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GregorBlackfinger

Dany, Jon & Tyrion : Connected Since Birth?

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There are plenty of theories going around that the other two people to fly Dany's dragons are going to be Jon & Tyrion. For a while, I didn't believe it. Just picturing them flying around together on dragonback didn't sit well with me. But now, after a few rereads, I think i've come up with a new theory.

Now, I've lurked on these boards for over a year, and just recently decided to make an account, so Im sorry if this has been brough up, but I havent seen it before..

Here goes nothing...

Jon, Tyrion, and Daenerys all "killed" their mothers during their birth. Could this have something to do with the sacrifices needed for blood magic?

Now, before anyone goes all crazy at what I just said, let me clarify.

NO. I don't believe that Tywin, Lyanna(if the theory is true), or Daenerys mother purposely performed blood magic to ensure they have a child. But could it be that they are all somehow connected because of the fact that their mothers died birthing them?

Maybe this will be the link that makes them the 3 heads of Daenerys' dragons?

Maybe a bit out there for a theory, but I tried! Comments appreciated.

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I don't know about blood magic, but this connection makes them good candidates for the dragon riders positions, and saviors of Westeros

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I don't know, I suppose at that time a lot of women died in childbirth so I don't think it is anything especial. I'm not fond of the theory of the three people riding three dragons and saving the world, boring. I actually hope that not all three dragons make it to Westeros, I actually hope that dragons are not the ones that save the world, I actually hope that dragons die. :leaving:

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I just had the discussion with a friend, and it made me change my mind a little bit. "Head of the dragon" could be, in a way, a metaphor. Viserys called himself a dragon numerous times, as does Dany. Could it be that they will all three be "dragons" in that they help Dany in her conquest for Westeros?

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Dany will never go to Westeros, certainly not on dragonback. That's my opinion. Right now, she's alone with only one dragon and a possible hostile khalasar. By the time she's gotten her army back, we've finished reading TWoW. She will use one or maybe more dragons, but not to conquer Westeros.

Dragons will go to Westeros however, but I don't they will be ridden by Jon or Tyrion. Bran might warg one, going from raven to dragon.. It only seems logical.

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I just had the discussion with a friend, and it made me change my mind a little bit. "Head of the dragon" could be, in a way, a metaphor. Viserys called himself a dragon numerous times, as does Dany. Could it be that they will all three be "dragons" in that they help Dany in her conquest for Westeros?

There's a thread by Apple Martini, Queen of awesome theories ^_^ about that issue, if you want to have a look a it http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/61739-issue-with-the-three-heads-of-the-dragon/ I also tend to believe that in "the dragon has three hedas" dragon means Targaryen, and not a real dragon, so I pretty much agree with Apple's theory.

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I am so happy to find this thread !

I finished the 5th book last month and I've been thinking A LOT about it. I recently had the revelation about Tyrion, Dany and Jon's mothers (if Jon's is Lyanna) dying after childbirth.

I can't believe that so many people on this thread say it's a coincidence. It could be if it happened to secondary characters. It cannot be a coincidence when it's about the 3 heroes ! The 3 protagonists of DwD, 3 of the most beloved characters, 3 that were outcasts from the moment they were born. Their lack of mother's love, the loss of their fathers, their urge for a home and love has shaped them and defines them. May I also add that this is GRRM, a champion in parallelisms, prophecies and foreshadowings ?

I will also say that the connection with the direwolf in the first chapter, makes it almost impossible that it is just a coincidence. "Born with the dead. worse luck."

Jon's darkness/Ghost's whiteness and Dany's silver/Drogon's blackness, one born in Ice and the other in Fire, both leaders caring for the people and the underdogs is also something that makes the connection clear to me. We'll see for Tyrion I guess... he first has to make himself worthy I think (after his father's and Shae's deaths), especially that Quaithe had warned Dany not to trust the Lion, and that we have a telltale in Quentyn. It's also said that Jon is a very good rider, Dany had her silver (and can obviously ride Drogon) and Tyrion has designed is own saddle (why that detail ?). It would also be pretty awesome if Joffrey wanted him to ride a pig and he ends up on a dragon... The very fact that a dwarf would be even more unlikely to ride anything, makes it more interesting if he ends up being a rider.

Now, I don't know if that means for sure that those three are the three riders/heads of the dragons (I don't disassociate the two notions), but the fact that they are the main characters in the book named A Dance with DRAGONS, is certainly hinting towards it.

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I don't know, I suppose at that time a lot of women died in childbirth so I don't think it is anything especial. I'm not fond of the theory of the three people riding three dragons and saving the world, boring. I actually hope that not all three dragons make it to Westeros, I actually hope that dragons are not the ones that save the world, I actually hope that dragons die. :leaving:

I agree with you. I fear Dragons more than the White Walkers....I actually like the White Walkers

I do not believe that Jon, Dany and Tyrion all killing their moms during their birth is a coincidence. Personally I do not like the idea of Dragon riding, its pretty lame to me, but if this means their three fates are tied together that is pretty cool.

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There are plenty of theories going around that the other two people to fly Dany's dragons are going to be Jon & Tyrion. For a while, I didn't believe it. Just picturing them flying around together on dragonback didn't sit well with me. But now, after a few rereads, I think i've come up with a new theory.

Now, I've lurked on these boards for over a year, and just recently decided to make an account, so Im sorry if this has been brough up, but I havent seen it before..

Here goes nothing...

Jon, Tyrion, and Daenerys all "killed" their mothers during their birth. Could this have something to do with the sacrifices needed for blood magic?

When Melisandre supposedly caused the death of the 3 kings with the 3 leeches, we knew the reason why she wanted it done.

If someone wanted Dany, Tyrion and Jon to be born that badly that they sacrificed their mothers, what would the person want them for? Or who would that person be? This would have to imply that all 3 are Targs but it would have to be a Targ or a Targ loyalist that would have made the spell- wouldn't it?

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I don't know, I suppose at that time a lot of women died in childbirth so I don't think it is anything especial. I'm not fond of the theory of the three people riding three dragons and saving the world, boring. I actually hope that not all three dragons make it to Westeros, I actually hope that dragons are not the ones that save the world, I actually hope that dragons die. :leaving:

Me too they are a crutch for horibble rulers.

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I've long commented that the similarity between the manner in which Jon, Tyrion and Daenerys were born is far too coincidental for it not to indicate some connection between the three (besides being the main characters, of course). Then there is the fact that there just happen to be three dragons and three heads of the dragon . . .

It fits much too well.

I'd have to read some pretty compelling contrary evidence to think these roles will be filled by anyone else besides these three.

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And there´s the Theory that Jon is son of Rhaegar, and Tyrion could be son of Aerys (since he´s the Only Lannister with pale blonde hair and Aerys did have a crush on Joana). Three Targs who killed their moms in birth, it´s a great connection.

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And there´s the Theory that Jon is son of Rhaegar, and Tyrion could be son of Aerys (since he´s the Only Lannister with pale blonde hair and Aerys did have a crush on Joana). Three Targs who killed their moms in birth, it´s a great connection.

I don't like the theory of Tyrion being a Targ... I think he is too much like Tywin.

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:agree: But, the Tywin dislike of Tyrion could be for this reason, the one that it´s not his son (or at least he suspects of it) is the one who really think like him

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Interesting theory. And don't forget another connection. There is a good chance all three pregnancies resulted from rape.

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Interesting theory. And don't forget another connection. There is a good chance all three pregnancies resulted from rape.

Other than wild speculation, is there any evidence to suggest either, let alone all, of them were the result of rape?

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Other than wild speculation, is there any evidence to suggest either, let alone all, of them were the result of rape?

Perhaps saying that there is a "good chance" is overstating it. One is simply a fact, one is an open question for which there is conflicting evidence, and one is rank speculation.

For Dany, it is in a Jaime point of view. Jaime has to stand outside the room while Aerys attacks his wife.

For Jon, there is an open question whether Robert, Bran, etc. are right and Lyanna was kidnapped, or whether Dany is right and she went willingly.

For Tyrion, there is speculation that Aerys attacked Tyrion's mother, based on evidence that is pretty thin.

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There are plenty of theories going around that the other two people to fly Dany's dragons are going to be Jon & Tyrion. For a while, I didn't believe it. Just picturing them flying around together on dragonback didn't sit well with me. But now, after a few rereads, I think i've come up with a new theory.

Now, I've lurked on these boards for over a year, and just recently decided to make an account, so Im sorry if this has been brough up, but I havent seen it before..

Here goes nothing...

Jon, Tyrion, and Daenerys all "killed" their mothers during their birth. Could this have something to do with the sacrifices needed for blood magic?

Now, before anyone goes all crazy at what I just said, let me clarify.

NO. I don't believe that Tywin, Lyanna(if the theory is true), or Daenerys mother purposely performed blood magic to ensure they have a child. But could it be that they are all somehow connected because of the fact that their mothers died birthing them?

Maybe this will be the link that makes them the 3 heads of Daenerys' dragons?

Maybe a bit out there for a theory, but I tried! Comments appreciated.

I go over many theories with my friend. We try to dissect the book theory by theory and try and pick the best one. With this I would like to believe that Tyrion is a head of the dragon but... i do not think is may be. He is too much like Tywin, but there are alot of qualites going for him. I believe Stannis may be a head of the dragon. Why would we still be getting POV's from people within his company. His grandmother was Rhaella i belive. She was a Targ. Therefore by having this blood in him he may be a head of the dragon. He is a loyal man who understands that the Targs ruled before the Baratheons, he is a logical strategist OR at the very least be a on Dan's small council.

I don't know, I suppose at that time a lot of women died in childbirth so I don't think it is anything especial. I'm not fond of the theory of the three people riding three dragons and saving the world, boring. I actually hope that not all three dragons make it to Westeros, I actually hope that dragons are not the ones that save the world, I actually hope that dragons die. :leaving:

As for the dragons not saving the world... its a SONG OF ICE AND FIRE! The WW are the ice, and the dragons are the fire. The obidisian weapons and "Dragonsteel" are all from dragons fire. Hence they must be the ones to combatant the WW. They are as ancient as the WW and we do not know how much the WW can do. We only know right now they can control Wights i have no doubts that they have more powers then that. The ultimate struggle is coming, the wall will have to be destroyed in order for the books to continue. The heads will most likely be Dany for sure, maybe Jon depending on what happens at the start of the next book, and maybe Stannis i believe either one dragon will die or there is a theory out there that Viseron is pregnant.

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i can't find the exact convo that made me feel this way but i deff got the feeling that targaryen births were often more difficult for the mothers to bare, leaving them bed ridden and sometimes even killing them. This is really the ONLY thing that makes me even consider the whole tyrion is a targ theory... I do believe that whoever it is that ends up being one of the three riders will have the "blood of the dragon" and not just i drop or two...

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Perhaps saying that there is a "good chance" is overstating it. One is simply a fact, one is an open question for which there is conflicting evidence, and one is rank speculation.

For Dany, it is in a Jaime point of view. Jaime has to stand outside the room while Aerys attacks his wife.

For Jon, there is an open question whether Robert, Bran, etc. are right and Lyanna was kidnapped, or whether Dany is right and she went willingly.

For Tyrion, there is speculation that Aerys attacked Tyrion's mother, based on evidence that is pretty thin.

Yes! The rape situation (though speculated) makes me think of this quote in AFfC about Ramsay Bolton: "The evil is in his blood. He is a bastard born of rape. A Snow no matter what the boy king says."

I think this is said to make a parallel with Jon, and maybe Dany and Tyrion. That they are born of rape, supposedly "evil", all of them underdogs at the beginning of the story, and they could rule the whole land in the end. In book 4, talking about Volantis, they mention that the city has 3 rulers, to balance things out. So that there is no dictature of one person. I think this is foreshadowing of what's to come.

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