Glass Candles

[The Mother of The Others]

Its doubtful the candles are earmarked for Targaryens or kings of any sort. Targaryens don't get candles they get drakes, other people get the candles so they can talk about what the dragons are doing and coordinate the resistance or the survival or whatever.

[Ghost's Shadow]

:lol:

Thanks for that laugh!

[King of the Bastards]

Its doubtful the candles are earmarked for Targaryens or kings of any sort. Targaryens don't get candles they get drakes, other people get the candles so they can talk about what the dragons are doing and coordinate the resistance or the survival or whatever.

I never said they would get them, I said they could stand for Targaryens symbolically. I liked the metaphor and, after searching on the forum for greens and blacks, I found that I wasn't the first to make that connection.

[FalseSpring]

All the threats that Quaithe doesn't see also shows her fallibility. Granted she also might be not reporting them to Dany.

As Marwyn says, "Prophecy will bite your prick off every time.”

As for causing Aeyrs II madness with the candles, who would gain from that? Rhaegar. If there is anything to the Maester Conspiracy, they are a possibility. The history of madness in Targaryen's and the Defiance at Duskendale kidnapping that he suffered are sufficient to explain his paranoia, to me at least.

Shiera Seastar seems like a stretch to me. How many ~125 year old characters are going to be still alive and be vital plot elements?

Shiera's mother was known to use the dark arts to keep herself young, and shiera herself also practiced. On top of that, being BR's half sister and lover makes a nice symmetry for westeros and essos.

[Blazfemur]

Only after battles.

Is it possible with the lighting of the candles, that theyre powered by blood, or death? That it takes blood magic to power them? Or sacrifice?

[Bowen]

Wouldn't surprise me if Qyburn had a glass candle given him knowing Marwyn.

[Blazfemur]

Wouldn't surprise me if Qyburn had a glass candle given him knowing Marwyn.

as a master of whisperers, id think a glass candle can become very effective.

he really hasnt shown much evidence of it though, has he?

[VermithorSunni]

I think the glass candles might be the fire magic equivalent to Weirwoods.

:agree: about the similarity to Weirwoods. At least the way that Bran is learning to use weir woods.

Except that glass candles can give people visions. Who would be getting these false visions? Or maybe the visions are accurate? Maybe someone was giving Rhaegar visions? Maybe someone is giving Melisandre visions (and that's why she has such trouble interpreting them). I've read the passages about glass candles and they create more questions than they answer.

[VermithorSunni]

The glass candles burning part is clearly speaking of the return of magic to the world. Whether the dragons brought the magic back or the magic brought the dragons is an entirely different discussion but its clear what this means

The pale mare is the bloody flux. The unfortunate "Patient Zero" was riding a white horse and everyone begins to refer to it as the pale mare. No question here on the subject.

Kraken and dark flame are obviously Victarion and Moquorro. Victarion is a Greyjoy, their sigil is a kraken, and Moquorro is referred to as Black Flame by Victarion's crew after he has new robes made.

Lion and griffin are most likely Tyrion and Connington. They were headed to Dany, but then thanks to Tyrion's meddling Jon Connington is in Westeros and Tyrion is with the Second Sons.

The sun's son is without a doubt Quentyn Martell. He's the son of the Prince of Dorne, the sigil of Dorne is a sun, so he is literally the "sun's" son.

I'll skip the mummer's dragon part for a second to go to the next part: "Trust none of them."

What I think is really important to ask here is what are Quaithe's motives? I saw, and now believe, that she is not working for Dany's benefit; that she is in fact working against Dany. Perhaps in an attempt to steal a dragon? All we know of her is that she is a priestess from Asshai. No clue what order she is from, I at first wondered if it was an off-shoot cult of the R'hllorists since she wears her red mask but its tough to even say.

Perfect evidence for how she is working against Dany is by telling her not to trust Quentyn. Since we get him as POV character we know for a fact that he means no ill will towards Dany whatsoever. He shows up in Meeren with the promise of 50,000 spears (a bit of an exaggeration I feel) to help her win back her father's Iron Throne and to bring Fire and Blood to Westeros. Instead she spurns him and what does he do? He stays hoping he can somehow win her back from Hizdahr zo Loraq (I think the spelling is right, who knows)

What there should Dany not trust? That he isn't an overly handsome guy?

The rest of those mentioned we can assume mean Dany no harm. Victarion hopes to marry her, Moquorro was sent to help her, Tyrion just wants Cersei's head and Shae and Casterly Rock, and Jon Connington loved her brother and wants her to marry her brother's son. (That sounds kind of creepy)

When looking at it like that it seems clear Quaithe is simply trying to make Dany paranoid of all those around her, even those who clearly just want to help.

Could referring to Aegon as the "mummer's dragon" be a way of trying to turn Dany against Aegon? Begin the idea in her head (and ours) that Aegon is not truly a Targaryen? One true way to win a lot of support would be those two joining together or marrying. Aegon is the son of the beloved Rhaegar Targaryen; the crown prince who everyone believed had been brutally murdered by a monster of a man. Dany is the sister of that same great man and is known as the Mother of Dragons, Breaker of Chains, Khaleesi, and Mysha (or any other way you say "mother" in the other languages).

Turning Dany against Aegon helps no one, just as turning Dany against the others helped no one.... except Quaithe.

I like the theory, but here's another…

Quaithe might know about the White Walkers rising. If so, she might think that the real fight, the fight for dawn (or however Melisandre and TPTP prophecy puts it) is Dany's destiny.

CONQUEST of Westeros is what most of the others are interested in (Connington, Victarion, Aegon, etc). Quaithe may be saying don't trust them, as in "that is just a side show," because

DEFENSE of Westeros is Dany's true destiny.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

I like the theory, but here's another…

Quaithe might know about the White Walkers rising. If so, she might think that the real fight, the fight for dawn (or however Melisandre and TPTP prophecy puts it) is Dany's destiny.

CONQUEST of Westeros is what most of the others are interested in (Connington, Victarion, Aegon, etc). Quaithe may be saying don't trust them, as in "that is just a side show," because

DEFENSE of Westeros is Dany's true destiny.

This is exactly what I think of Quaithe, she is like Bloodraven and is more interested in what is up north and has no interest in playing the game, thats why she warns Dany of all those people cause all of them are players trying to use Dany as a pawn.

Thats why she mostly warns Dany about her dragons and never about the politics in slaver's bay.

[VermithorSunni]

This is exactly what I think of Quaithe, she is like Bloodraven and is more interested in what is up north and has no interest in playing the game, thats why she warns Dany of all those people cause all of them are players trying to use Dany as a pawn.

Thats why she mostly warns Dany about her dragons and never about the politics in slaver's bay.

Exactly! Slaver's Bay is another side show. Interesting events, but more of a learning experience than Dany's destiny.

[Snoggs]

:agree: about the similarity to Weirwoods. At least the way that Bran is learning to use weir woods.

Except that glass candles can give people visions. Who would be getting these false visions? Or maybe the visions are accurate? Maybe someone was giving Rhaegar visions? Maybe someone is giving Melisandre visions (and that's why she has such trouble interpreting them). I've read the passages about glass candles and they create more questions than they answer.

Wow! The Melisandre bit just blew my mind.....

[Blazfemur]

:agree: about the similarity to Weirwoods. At least the way that Bran is learning to use weir woods.

Except that glass candles can give people visions. Who would be getting these false visions? Or maybe the visions are accurate? Maybe someone was giving Rhaegar visions? Maybe someone is giving Melisandre visions (and that's why she has such trouble interpreting them). I've read the passages about glass candles and they create more questions than they answer.

Mind=blown. What if her visions are put there by someone with a glass candle. Damn.

ETA: but then why is it only followers of R'hllor demonstrate this abilitai?

[John Suburbs]

Marwyn also knew all about Sam and why he came to Oldtown. When Sam asks how, Alleras (Sarella) nods toward the candle. So that begs the question: who knew about Sam's trip to OT and might they have a glass candle too?

Possibilities include:

Aemon, before he left, which means there would still be one at the Wall;

The Kindly Man? How much did Arya tell him about Sam, and mayhaps he sent his own spies to fill in the rest?

Melisandre?

Here's a wild one: Bloodraven, who heard the entire plan through the Lord Commander's bird, and then relayed it to Marwyn. There is still a heart tree in the Isle of Ravens, BTW.