U.S. Politics - More of it

[TerraPrime]

Not to cut short previous on-going discussions, but here's an article that's sure to cause the GOP-sphere to bristle:

Washington Post column called: "Let’s just say it: The Republicans are the problem."

We have been studying Washington politics and Congress for more than 40 years, and never have we seen them this dysfunctional. In our past writings, we have criticized both parties when we believed it was warranted. Today, however, we have no choice but to acknowledge that the core of the problem lies with the Republican Party.

*awaits GOP here to respond*

[Ser Greguh]

Very nice article, love how it singles out Gingrich and Norquist as the root causes of the party's fall from sanity. It's somewhat staggering that so many people are perfectly okay with an absolutist pledge to never sign a tax increase under any circumstances no matter what as if compromise, complexity, and nuance are reduced to curse words. The GOP isn't collectively qualified to run a World of Warcraft guild, let alone a nation.

[TerraPrime]

The GOP isn't collectively qualified to run a World of Warcraft guild, let alone a nation.

:lol:

Well, maybe if it's a social, RP guild. :-p

ETA: Codex/Zabu 2012!

[Kalbear]

What's funny is that the last good GOP president - Bush 1 - was famous for being pragmatic and breaking his word and getting new taxes because that was the right choice. And he knew that it would almost certainly cost him the reelection, but it didn't matter to him; what mattered was doing the right thing for the right reasons, regardless of ideology.

[Robin Of House Hill]

What's funny is that the last good GOP president - Bush 1 - was famous for being pragmatic and breaking his word and getting new taxes because that was the right choice. And he knew that it would almost certainly cost him the reelection, but it didn't matter to him; what mattered was doing the right thing for the right reasons, regardless of ideology.

You mean like lying that we weren't in a recession when we were?

[Kalbear]

I honestly am not sure what you're talking about. Care to clarify?

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

The AZ legislature did something mildly useful for once and voted to nullify the NDAA. They even made it a crime for a state employee to assisg the feds in detaining someone. On my phone so I cant link to the article.

[Commodore]

Not to cut short previous on-going discussions, but here's an article that's sure to cause the GOP-sphere to bristle:

Washington Post column called: "Let’s just say it: The Republicans are the problem."

Democrats have not passed a budget in three years (a legal requirement). Obama's budgets get zero votes in congress. He rejected the recommendations of his own bipartisan debt commision. Dems offer no proposal to deal with the deficit or entitlements. They wrote the stimuls and health care bills without any GOP input. The results are record deficits, stagnant growth, and perpetually high unemployment.

What exactly should the GOP be doing? More taxes? More stimulus?

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

Not to cut short previous on-going discussions, but here's an article that's sure to cause the GOP-sphere to bristle:

Washington Post column called: "Let’s just say it: The Republicans are the problem."

*awaits GOP here to respond*

Why should they? You guys will just answer for them and then tear down the strawmen you created.

So have at it!

[Jon Sprunk]

Democrats have not passed a budget in three years (a legal requirement).

True, as far as I know. I don't defend it in the least.

Obama's budgets get zero votes in congress.

True. Same.

He rejected the recommendations of his own bipartisan debt commision.

Not even close to true. The president accepts some parts of the commission's "findings," and rejects others. Which is the same position as every member of congress, as well as Romney's position.

Dems offer no proposal to deal with the deficit or entitlements.

Not true. The ACA addresses the curve of rising medicare costs, or at least attempts to do so. There have been ideas about how to tweak SS, from both sides, but congress is not about to hammer out an agreement in the current political reality.

They wrote the stimuls and health care bills without any GOP input.

Wrong again. The repubs had months of opportunities to add to the dialogue about the ACA. They were included in the initial conferences, and even a televised roundtable with the president. This has been hashed out in these threads before. The GOP had chances to be an active partner, but instead they chose to throw a temper tantrum for the past 3 years.

The results are record deficits, stagnant growth, and perpetually high unemployment.

The deficit also rose under Reagan, Bush I, and Bush II. So....

Growth is not stellar, but the economy is growing at a steady rate. Compared to the freefall we experienced under the last quarter of Bush Jr's reign. So.....

Unemployment spiked and has come a couple points. Still not good. Not sure what you'd like the dems to do. If you think the repubs have a magic wand for unemployment, you're fooling yourself. In fact, repub policy is slanted toward the powerful at the expense of the vulnerable. Not exactly a good atmosphere for job growth. Although if they can oppress the middle class enough that everyone is willing to pick fruit for pennies a day, I guess that would qualify as a jobs program in a literal sense...

What exactly should the GOP be doing? More taxes? More stimulus?

I honestly don't know if more stimulus right now would do much. I think that ship has sailed because no one on either side is talking about it. But I could be wrong.

More taxes? Yes. Let the Bush tax cuts expire. MAYBE keep the middle-class portion, but I'm skeptical even about that.

What the GOP should have done is let the president have a real chance to get things done. I'm not saying roll over and die, but the senate repubs should NOT have used the threat of filibuster a record number of times, to block anything and everything. It was blindly partisan and bad for the country on a number of levels.

I heard a Romney supporter today say that he hopes this election sends a clear mandate to whomever wins (him being convinced it will be his guy). I had to laugh. The repubs don't listen to mandates from the other side of the aisle. Obama won a sweeping victory in 2008, the dems rode into power in both chambers of congress. That should have been a crystal clear mandate. Instead, the repubs played schoolyard politics and gridlock ensued.

What should the GOP do? STFU and get out of the way for a few years. Maybe (omg, I know) pretend to care more about the country than about their party's power.

[Fez]

I'm incredibly sick of talking politics so I'll stick to be definitionally pedantic....

I guess I get trolled a lot because every time I talk to someone who claims to be a libertarian, they have a different philosophy, and get mad that I assume they have anything to do with the previous libertarian I talked to. It's actually pretty funny.

Its true that Libertarians believe in lots of different things and can have lots of different opinions on what should be done about various things; but the one thing all real Libertarians (as opposed to college students who think its a cool thing to do) believe in is the absolute sanctity of individual contracts as the end all be all of civil society. And something everyone agrees on is that contracts are worthless without an enforcement mechanism to ensure that they are uphold. The only entity capable of doing is the government. Ergo all Libertarians believe that at least some form of government must exist. Since its impossible to have a government without some form of taxation (unless you're from ancient Assyria and believe the spoils of war can fund you), this means all Libertarians support at least some form of limited taxation.

Personally I'm a statist of the highest order and think its all a bunch of bollocks. But even I would never accuse them of being so radical as to not want any government whatsoever.

[ThinkerX]

I find myself wondering: would even a 'radical' republican president, with pretty much full republican control of the house and senate alike, attempt major alterations to the likes of Social Security or Medicare? As in...say...30% cuts across the board to the checks going out?

And would even FLOW support such an action?

[TerraPrime]

Why should they? You guys will just answer for them and then tear down the strawmen you created.

So have at it!

u mad bro?

[Swift]

I find myself wondering: would even a 'radical' republican president, with pretty much full republican control of the house and senate alike, attempt major alterations to the likes of Social Security or Medicare? As in...say...30% cuts across the board to the checks going out?

And would even FLOW support such an action?

Doubt Republicans would try that. Aren't old people a large GOP voting block?

[Brienne the Beauty]

Personally I'm a statist of the highest order and think its all a bunch of bollocks. But even I would never accuse them of being so radical as to not want any government whatsoever.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism_and_minarchism

I just googled the issue, and according to that article there are two camps of libertarians, one that believes in a minimal state (minarchism) and one that believes in no state at all (anarcho-capitalism.)

[Brienne the Beauty]

Doubt Republicans would try that. Aren't old people a large GOP voting block?

They always qualify this with assurances that this would not affect the currently retired or people very near retirement. Which is pretty nasty as it would leave younger folk paying taxes to fund the retirements of their elders without ever getting benefit from it. The republicans are very determined on this point so younger folks better get a good retirement fund.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

http://en.wikipedia...._and_minarchism

I just googled the issue, and according to that article there are two camps of libertarians, one that believes in a minimal state (minarchism) and one that believes in no state at all (anarcho-capitalism.)

FWIW, many anarchist libertarians are left-wing "free market anti-capitalists." One of the best left-wing libertarian perspectives on the necessity of a legal monopoly can be found here.

[Brienne the Beauty]

FWIW, many anarchist libertarians are left-wing "free market anti-capitalists."

Wouldn't those be anarcho-syndicalists, not anarcho-capitalists?

[Angeleyes]

Just popping in quick to add the following Cracked article: 5 Ways to Spot a B.S. Political Story in Under 10 Seconds.

Yes I understand that Cracked is not a legitimate news source. However, this article is excellent, funny and often poignant.

#4 The Headline Ends in a Question Mark

A news story so questionable the publication literally felt the need to mark it as such.

[shows Drudge Report Headline "Book to Reveal Obama's True Identity?"]...

But that in no way reflects on Drudge's credibility, because he never said he believed the book. He was simply wondering out loud. Same as another outlet wondered aloud about McCain's "Secret Dossier on Romney?":

I like how that one doesn't even phrase a whole question -- it's just a few scary, scandalous words with a question mark ("Ron Paul's Covert Sex Commandos?").

Hope it is good for a Monday laugh for everyone out there.

ETA: Formatting the quote took 2 attempts

[TrackerNeil]

Not to cut short previous on-going discussions, but here's an article that's sure to cause the GOP-sphere to bristle:

Washington Post column called: "Let’s just say it: The Republicans are the problem."

*awaits GOP here to respond*

I read this earlier today and I agree with nearly all of it. I'd add that the problem with the modern GOP is not that it's conservative - conservatives are as capable of rationality as liberals - but that it's almost completely dysfunctional. Policies that once had a home in the party are now derided as the Death of Liberty, and the various pledges (no tax increases ever, only anti-abortion judicial nominees) officeholders are required to sign essentially prevent the compromises that are a necessary part of responsible governing.

I don't expect that conservatives will suddenly decide that, say, Dodd-Frank is a great thing. However, I do hope they'll accept that the law is indeed the law and not try to repeal it via the confirmation process. That's just dysfunctional.