Eddard and Robert: A Tragic Love Story

[Lyanna Stark]

Welcome to the board Averagesizedjon!

I can't think of a better thread to start posting it. And I do believe you have a good point too! Ramsay should absolutely be added to the list, now if only Theon could stop forgetting the safe word...

[bloodymime]

I think we can be reasonably sure that the Nights Watch, the Kingsguard and the monks at the QI are all secretly gay as they have on purpose joined all male organisations for little other reason than to be with other men, exclusively, and pursue different types of male only activities. You might say they are hiding their gay in plain sight.

EDIT: The new High Septon is clearly gay since Cersei could not seduce him and if he was immune to her Vortex of Doom, it surely means only one thing....

Further, wasn't it established before that Eunuchs like Varys are all secretly gay due to not being sexually attracted to women? In that case, I think the Unsullied should be counted here too.

Absolutely and the incontrovertible proof is the fact that I posted that only to find you and Natalie_S had already said the exact same thing just before me. Three posts in a row, there's a lot of truth in that.

[butterbumps!]

I can appreciate the comedic value of a Robert/Ned gay thing, but honestly, it isn't in the books; not at all. If that's what your really, believe, good for you, but you're grasping at straws. Ned and Robert were brothers, and in these strange times anyone hears the word love thrown about between two straight men and they say "Hey, GGGGAAAAAYYYYY". It just doesn't work like that.

I disagree. It is in the books, as the exponential growth of citations across 16 pages of this thread can attest to. Of course, there isn't "proof," in much the same way that DNA testing can't "prove" that Cersei's children are actually not Robert's, so we have to rely on what we have in the books, and all reasonable interpretation points to the rampant homosexuality of the majority of characters. Are you saying that you don't believe Joff, Tommen and Myrcella are "bastards born of incest" just because there is no verifiable "proof?"

First off, Robert sowed a veritable field of bastard children, and those are only the ones we know about. Secondly, Ned and Cat are banging away at Winterfell in pretty much the only scene we see them in together. Have to think that four kids later they are doing this out of more than duty. Like maybe they enjoy it?

This is a common misconception. How better to mask homosexual tendencies than to invent a cover story that you "sow a veritable field of bastard children?" How many of these so-called "Robert's bastards" have we even seen? Four? Yet rumor has it that he's sown 16. I think it's far more likely that in accordance with sound counsel, Robert planted a few orphans to pose as his "bastards," and ran a good PR campaign to exaggerate the depth of his heterosexual depravity.

And about Ned- honestly. What on earth could be so important that Lyanna would require such a difficult promise than to honor her request that he tame his urges for Robert's spectacular rump? Combine this with the fact that it's unseemly for a man at war to not father at least a few bastards on his campaign, and you've got "Promise me, Ned." "Promise me," as in "I know you and Robert have been super gayz, but since I'm dying anyway, take my child as testament to the fact that you bang women, for the sake of the realm end this with Robert, and for the love of the gods at least try to have children with your wife." Why did Ned have to fight the Kingsguard at the TOJ? Simple. As article #281 explains, those guards were super gayz too, and if Ned couldn't have Robert then no one could. Ned's promise to Lyanna also explains your contention that four kids later they are doing this out of more than duty. Seriously, 5 kids total only shows that they had sex precisely 5 times in 14 years, which speaks Ned's promise to cultivate an aura of heteronormalcy. Please.

Dude one of my good friends get's laid all the time from being muscled like a maiden's fancy.... That's why he get's laid! How does that make the speaker gay? The operative words are "muscled like a maiden's fancy" . Not "muscled like a guy that would make an arguably straight man try to sheath his sword in your man leather".....

I'm not sure what you're arguing here. "Maiden's fancy" is just the way Ned sublimates his desire in terms that are more heteronormative. Did you miss the obvious distress that Lyanna's promise causes Ned throughout his POVs? What could cause more turmoil to a man unable to be true to his homosexual identity and who is unable to be with the one man he truly loves? Also: "muscled like a guy that would make an arguably straight man try to sheath his sword in your man leather." You are obviously well versed in the poetics of erotica. Perhaps you could write a Charter for the Commission for Brotherly Love? (Also, if anything "gayed up" this thread, it was that).

Just saying, to make a gross characterization, people on this site tend to take things too literally, and attribute a few mentionings of brotherly love for two guys going brokeback mountain. Not so with Robert and Ned. If that were the case, why not just bang away after Robert got the throne? Seven hells, we know that he didn't enjoy being king - if he was all up for Ned why was he leaving bastards all around the realm instead of leaving a glut of dead male hooker Ned-look-a-likes in a bloody wake behind him? I'm just saying that it doesn't add up.

See above. Also, why would Robert need a glut of "dead male hookers?" He had Thoros's flaming sword and kiss of life to warm his manhood in Ned's absence. (Hence, why Ned sent Thoros and Dondarrion off on that fool's errand when he became hand.) Honestly, this has already been addressed, please go back and do the research if you're going to propose such groundless theories.

If Robert and Ned were ever gay together, they'd be holed up in the Aeyrie or banging away over Rhaegar's dead corpse in the shallows of the trident. you guys are reaching here. Sometimes it's actually okay in the modern world for two dudes to be friends without fucking eachother. I know that may come as a surprise to most of this board, but seriously, it's not like you have fuck the king to become the goddamned hand. How many times do you think Tyrion or Tywin fucked Joffrey. yeah, the same zero that Ned posted against Robert. Boooyah!!!!

Not so fast, little buddy! Ned was not at the goddamn Trident! Seven Hells, do people just not read these books!

:cheers: thanks for keeping our research rigorous

[Lummel]

ALL the Tarlys. I mean, Horn Hill? :cool4:

True. Randyl Tarly. If that's not a case study in repression and transference then I don't know what is.

[bloodymime]

This is a common misconception. How better to mask homosexual tendencies than to invent a cover story that you "sow a veritable field of bastard children?" How many of these so-called "Robert's bastards" have we even seen? Four? Yet rumor has it that he's sown 16. I think it's far more likely that in accordance with sound counsel, Robert planted a few orphans to pose as his "bastards," and ran a good PR campaign to exaggerate the depth of his heterosexual depravity.

You just blew my mind here. This perfectly explains this whole ridiculous theory that there's a Baratheon super gene making all the offspring look just like him. There is no such thing. It's his people combing the land for children that match Roberto's features.

[facetree]

Oh yes, and I find it intriguing that Baratheon holdings were called the Stormlands-as in perhaps, a buffeted storm of unrequited love-and the Stark holdings Winterlands-as in what would happen to a man's heart when he's forced to repress his urges....

[Lummel]

...Ned's promise to Lyanna also explains your contention that four kids later they are doing this out of more than duty. Seriously, 5 kids total only shows that they had sex precisely 5 times in 14 years, which speaks Ned's promise to cultivate an aura of heteronormalcy. Please...

Precisely. Oscar Wilde was also married and had children. The perfect cover.

[bloodymime]

Oh yes, and I find it intriguing that Baratheon holdings were called the Stormlands-as in perhaps, a buffeted storm of unrequited love-and the Stark holdings Winterlands-as in what would happen to a man's heart when he's forced to repress his urges....

Yep. Storms-END, the Eyrie and their Moon Doors, the wolves howling at the Moon, MoonBoy.

[brashcandy]

Have you guys ever noticed the sexual connotations in all the House words?

Stark: Winter is coming (in bed)

Lannister: Hear me Roar (in bed)

Greyjoy: We do not Sow (in bed)

Tyrell: Growing Strong (in bed)

Targaryen: Fire and blood (in bed)

Tully: Family, Duty, Honor: (in bed)

Baratheon: Ours is the fury (in bed)

Good grief! I think this was GRRM's way of getting back at me over the book titles!

[facetree]

Have you guys ever noticed the sexual connotations in all the House words?

Stark: Winter is coming (in bed)

Lannister: Hear me Roar (in bed)

Greyjoy: We do not Sow (in bed)

Tyrell: Growing Strong (in bed)

Targaryen: Fire and blood (in bed)

Tully: Family, Duty, Honor: (in bed)

Good grief! I think this was GRRM's way of getting back at me over the book titles!

And the "Growing strong" and "Family" mottos have connotations with fertility as well....:P

[bloodymime]

Have you guys ever noticed the sexual connotations in all the House words?

Stark: Winter is coming (in bed)

Lannister: Hear me Roar (in bed)

Greyjoy: We do not Sow (in bed)

Tyrell: Growing Strong (in bed)

Targaryen: Fire and blood (in bed)

Tully: Family, Duty, Honor: (in bed)

Baratheon: Ours is the fury (in bed)

Good grief! I think this was GRRM's way of getting back at me over the book titles!

Wow, and there's your connection between Tully and Arryn right there. Honor in bed. Nice catch.

[facetree]

Arryn: As High(as in uh, you know..when you finish) as honor.

Martell: Unbowed. Unbent. Unbroken. (So phallic!)

Bolton: Our blades are sharp (again, phallic reference :P)

[Winter's Knight]

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

You guys, can't we apply the idea that Robert's overcompensating for something with his whoring to Tyrion as well?

I mean, just look at his farewell to Bronn:

"I’m not your bloody brother.”

“No,” said Tyrion sadly. “You’re not.” He waved a hand. “Begone, then. Run to Stokeworth and Lady Lollys. May you find more joy in your marriage bed than I ever found in mine.”

Bronn hesitated at the door. “What will you do, Imp?”

“Kill Gregor myself. Won’t that make for a jolly song?”

“I hope I hear them sing it.” Bronn grinned one last time, and walked out of the door, the castle, and his life.

Also, notice how Aerys' insanity and problems with Tywin seem to date from around the time that Tywin wed Joanna? It wasn't poor Jo that Aerys lusted after but Tywin!

[Cressit]

Has anyone else wondered if Robert also took comfort in Jalabhar Xho, the exotic exiled lord from the Summer Isles? What better way to get your mind off your dream-wolf then dark prince dripping in jewels and feathers? He kept him around court, year after year, never quite giving him a firm "no".

[facetree]

Also, notice how Aerys' insanity and problems with Tywin seem to date from around the time that Tywin wed Joanna? It wasn't poor Jo that Aerys lusted after but Tywin!

Is that why he took "certain liberties?" To make Tywin jealous?

[bloodymime]

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

You guys, can't we apply the idea that Robert's overcompensating for something with his whoring to Tyrion as well?

I mean, just look at his farewell to Bronn:

Also, notice how Aerys' insanity and problems with Tywin seem to date from around the time that Tywin wed Joanna? It wasn't poor Jo that Aerys lusted after but Tywin!

And what does Aerys do in revenge? He lures Tywins nubile young son into joining the Kingsguard, an organization Lyanna Stark has already covered.

[Lyanna Stark]

Is that why he took "certain liberties?" To make Tywin jealous?

Oh for certain. Aerys and Tywin had a classic love/hate relationship. Just look at how Tywin started to sulk when Aerys took Jaime into the kingsguard. Clearly Tywin is just jealous since he thinks Aerys prefers Jaime who is younger, fitter and hotter.

And what does Aerys do in revenge? He lures Tywins nubile young son into joining the Kingsguard, an organization Lyanna Stark has already covered.

Indeed! We all know the "true" purpose of that organisation, where men like Ser Arthur Dayne honed his "sword of the morning", and we have participants like "The White Bull" (can there be a gayer name??) and it was an open secret that Prince Lewyn Martell had a paramour, and knowing the Dornish and that he was related to Oberyn, of course this was a male paramour.

[Toccs]

And about Ned- honestly. What on earth could be so important that Lyanna would require such a difficult promise than to honor her request that he tame his urges for Robert's spectacular rump?

But rights I should send you the repair bill if the beer that I just spat all over my laptop screen causes any damage. :cheers:

[Winter's Knight]

And what does Aerys do in revenge? He lures Tywins nubile young son into joining the Kingsguard, an organization Lyanna Stark has already covered.

And why he refused Cersei for Rhaegar-he couldn't bear to have younger version of the woman who stole Tywin from him in court!

[brashcandy]

Arryn: As High(as in uh, you know..when you finish) as honor.

Martell: Unbowed. Unbent. Unbroken. (So phallic!)

Bolton: Our blades are sharp (again, phallic reference :P)

:laugh: yes yes!