Could Robert Barantheon have defeated Arthur Dayne?

[Gurkhal]

Here we go. It's a question that I've messed around with a bit, but I haven't thought about extensively. As of right now, I couldn't say who would live, though I'm leaning very slightly towards Robert. Both men were said to have been the greatest warrior of their time, no? Both from Houses known for their martial prowess, though I give the Daynes an edge here with their Swords of the Morning. But Robert was bigger and stronger even than the White Bull, he was also younger,right? I haven't done much research, which is why I started this thread. I do know thatbEddard once stated that Arthur was the finest knight he'd ever known. Had Robert taken Knight's vows ever? I'm not sure. Anyway, in a fight to the death, single combat, Robert's hammer vs Dawn, who would win?

I actually think Robert would win, but it would have been a close one.

[Alric Stark]

This is a "Margin of Selmy" case.

Gun (or crossbow) to my head I would side with Dayne. Greatest combatant in the Westeros is either Dayne or Barristan and GRRM says that without Dawn that is a coin flip between those two. That being said on the right day I think Robert could win. If they fight 10 times I think Dayne wins 6/10. (That being prime Robert of course vs. prime Dayne).

[GallowKnight]

I'd say Robert, he's big, strong and by all accounts a beast when it comes to fighting. And for a fight involving men in plat armor he has the better weapon. No way Dawn pierces steel plate, it is after all not all a lightsaber (even though people seem to believe it is).

[RenlyIsNotRight]

This would probably be a pretty close call imo. Yeah Robert was big and strong, but according to Jaime so was Arthur, albeit maybe not as much so. I don't doubt Arthur was also a more technically adept swordsman than Robert, who just seemed to be all about pure strength and brutality with his warhammer. If we're to go by Danys very warped perception in which she claimed that Rhaegar was on par with Arthur Dayne, then Robert could probably defeat him. But somehow I doubt Rhaegar was as good as Dayne.

[Barty]

A sword is a pretty bad choice against plate but this is no normal sword - Dayne will be wielding Dawn, which is probably as good as a valyrian steel sword. But Robert is also extremely skilled and his weapon needs just one solid blow and armor or no, Dayne is dead. As far as Robert's skills are concerned - I think he is extremely skilled and does not just rely on brute strength. Jaime does think that he can take Robert but Robert also thinks he can take Jaime as well and personally I think Robert could easily take down the Kingslayer. So I think it is too close to call - either one can win and it will all go down to luck.

[Fat Mac]

It depends on the conditions, and what they are fighting for. If they were fighting for Lyanna, you'd probably have to behead Robert in order to stop him, he'd be that driven. In a battle such as the trident, I'd give the advantage to Robby B.

Also, Dayne isn't really the best fighter necessarily. GRRM said with Dawn he could beat Barristan in his prime, but otherwise they are equal. And a lot of people think Jaime is up there with them too. So, like Darkstar said, it was kind of the sword that made Arthur Dayne as famous as he was.

[Artos Stark]

I think Dayne wins no matter what the conditions, he is said to be the greatest knight that ever lived. Robert on the hand took an injury from Rhaegar who isn't half the swordsman as Dayne. This one is easy to me.

[Artos Stark]

I know folks sing well of Dayne and his Sword of the Morning Dawn but let's not get ahead of ourselves.

The best swordsman was Ser Selmy. Thinking about it long and hard I think Dayne wins . . Dayne was just too fast for Robert.

Selmy and Jaime Lannister are best with swords.

GRRM stated that Dayne was better than Selmy when he had Dawn, when they both have normal swords they are about even. Dayne>Selmy>Jaime

[scurvy]

Anyone who has engaged in martial arts knows that there are very few always winners. I've played Judo for a few years and thrown better players than myself and been thrown by lesser players. It happens. There are very few among the best who win every match. There's only one Yasuhiro Yamashita or Masuhiro Kimura every few generations. And, with Judo as opposed to edged weapons, there's no chance for a lucky disabling contact and no chance for partial block that leads to injury. With edged weapons it can be all or nothing.

While you can rank the best warriors in the realm, I don't think any of them are fool proof in all situations to always be the victor against any of the other top warriors.

[Artos Stark]

It depends on the conditions, and what they are fighting for. If they were fighting for Lyanna, you'd probably have to behead Robert in order to stop him, he'd be that driven. In a battle such as the trident, I'd give the advantage to Robby B.

Also, Dayne isn't really the best fighter necessarily. GRRM said with Dawn he could beat Barristan in his prime, but otherwise they are equal. And a lot of people think Jaime is up there with them too. So, like Darkstar said, it was kind of the sword that made Arthur Dayne as famous as he was.

But Barristan in his prime is also regarded as one of the best swords who ever lived so I don't think that being equal with him without Dawn takes anything at all away from Dayne.

[Stormcloak]

In his prime he was a great warrior so on his day yeah Robert definitely could've, Dayne's meant to have been the greatest swordsman in living memory though so I think the odds would've been against Robert.

[BannermanOfDorne]

I think Robert was an extremely gifted warrior, especially with a warhammer, but Dayne is was one of the best swordsmen at the time. Dawn would probably give Dayne some advantage, but the skill as a swordsman he most likely possessed would be up to par with Barristan at his prime. My money's on Dayne although it would be a close call.

[Pope Killdragon]

Robert never won a joust at tourney; I believe he's described as having won numerous melees.

Dawn may be able to pierce Robert's plate, but it can't block a hammer, and a person can continue fighting for several minutes after getting cut with a sword; they could very well have killed each other.

That's right, for all of Rhaegar's renown as a jouster, he fell. And Robert was a beast in the melee. I'm sold on Robert now. He might be able to outreach Arthur with that warhammer of his and he could swing it easy and do massive damage. Robert's a tank, and a good one, he was designed to take out guys like Dayne.

I think Arthur Dayne wins.

Everyone* in the books believes that Dayne was a great warrior. Unbeatable in single combat.

I believe Robert was a great warrior.

Rhaegar, now, believes that Robert was a great warrior.

Ned believes Robert was a great warrior.

Robert believes Robert was a great warrior.

Who else?

* except Darkstar who thought it was the sword

I have to disagree. Robert had almost as great a reputation as a warrior as any of the Kingsguard knights. It's one of the reasons lords flocked to his cause.

[StarkSupporter]

Robert was strong and strong and that pretty much covers it. He never won a tourney. Arthur Dayne is remembered as an exquisite opponent and he would have slain Robert if they we ever to fight against each other in a one to one combat. Robert had strength but lacked skills and a certain agility. His hammer would be an amazing weapon in a battle, surrounded by enemies but in a single combat it would be too heavy and slow him down.

A tourney is not a fight, you can't use that as a measuring stick. Robert is also not just strong, he is described as a great warrior. I would think that anyone described as a great warrior, would in fact have a combination of skill, strength, and speed. To put it into modern terms, Robert is a boxer, while someone that relies solely on strength, like the Mountain, would be a boxer. I don't want to take anything away from Dayne, because GRRM himself has said that with equal equipment, Dayne and Selmy are equals. With that being said, Robert has a weapon that works better than any sword can, and both would likely be wearing armor. I will take Robert in that fight, although it would undoubtedly be a difficult fight, that will leave Robert hurting.

[Melpomene]

Well, they had their own unique greatness about them, and yet both of them equally faced a demise - one was killed and one became a lazy overweight drunkard. Just goes to show, awesome reputation or not, they had fallen in their own way. They are far from perfect, and obviously had weaknesses.

If I had to vote though, I guess I'll go for Arthur. I assume he was more intelligent than Robert, with more skills and wit instead of just using pure brute force. Arthur could very well possibly outsmart someone like Robert.

Neverthless, I could imagine it being a really tough, physically exhausting match.

[Artos Stark]

I still don't think it is close. Robert was considered one of the fierce fighters in his day while Dayne is considered one of the greatest of all time. Robert struggled with Rheagar, who wasn't half the swordsman that Dayne was and didn't have Dawn. I think Robert dies pretty easily.

[Pope Killdragon]

Well, they had their own unique greatness about them, and yet both of them equally faced a demise - one was killed and one became a lazy overweight drunkard. Just goes to show, awesome reputation or not, they had fallen in their own way. They are far from perfect, and obviously had weaknesses.

If I had to vote though, I guess I'll go for Arthur. I assume he was more intelligent than Robert, with more skills and wit instead of just using pure brute force. Arthur could very well possibly outsmart someone like Robert.

Neverthless, I could imagine it being a really tough, physically exhausting match.

I think that there's a huge misconception that Robert relied solely on brute force. Robert may have been mostly witless on the Throne but he was a man who lived for and loved war. If he understood anything on a deep level, it was warfare, battle. Also, as it's been put forth earlier in the thread, Robert was said to be a great warrior. Implying that he was very skilled with his weapons and that he possessed great speed and endurance in addition to great strength.

[Fat Mac]

I still don't think it is close. Robert was considered one of the fierce fighters in his day while Dayne is considered one of the greatest of all time. Robert struggled with Rheagar, who wasn't half the swordsman that Dayne was and didn't have Dawn. I think Robert dies pretty easily.

Robert was wounded at Stoney Sept, and for all we know could have since been wounded by the time the Trident came. He was fighting a war, taking hits. Rhaegar wasn't. Rhaegar was fresh into battle, and we aren't quite sure what condition Robert was in. And fights are more circumstantial and aren't as simple as a "Rhaegar wounded Robert. Arthur Dayne was much better than Rhaegar, so Dayne>Robert." It doesn't really work like that.

Not to mention, Robert wasn't a swordsman. Entering his warhammer in the mix adds another factor completely.

[The Promised Prince]

I think Dayne wins no matter what the conditions, he is said to be the greatest knight that ever lived. Robert on the hand took an injury from Rhaegar who isn't half the swordsman as Dayne. This one is easy to me.

I'm sorry but The Dragonknight is said to have been the greatest knight that has ever lived so.. your argument is pretty invalid here.

[Southpaw89]

I'm still on the side of, if Lyanna wasn't on the line for the fight between Robert and Rhaegar, it would've been a very close fight. You could tell from the book that Robert was deeply in love with Lyanna so the rage he had against Rhaegar would have made him invincible in battle (not invincible but would be able to take many wounds from the rapid adrenaline rush from anger). So taking Lyanna out of the equation and putting Robert up against Arthur Dayne, it is more reasonable to put money on Dayne. Of course, you can't determine extermine factors such as terrain or weather or whatever but on a flat surface 1 vs. 1 Arthur Dayne would win. Put in some rough terrain and a slight stumble from Dayne could equate into a strong blow from the bigger Robert and end the fight so you can never really say..