how many seasons will GoT go on for?

[Leuf]

With HBO having already hired GRRM to develop another series for them, the idea that he is going to crank out the remaining books quickly has evaporated. The man is taking on even more side jobs instead of focusing on writing. HBO wouldn't shoot themselves in the foot like that if they cared about GRRM actually finishing the books. So I have come to the conclusion that they have no plans for the series to keep closely following the books. I think this was, if not the original plan, at least something that was discussed early on as plan B. Without the specter of catching up the books hanging over them, and creative freedom to ditch story lines that don't work for tv but might be too important to drop if they want to follow the books, I think they can satisfactorily bring the series to a conclusion in 7 seasons. The sooner they make the decision to diverge from the books the better off they are, if they have to diverge eventually anyway. They can avoid the morass of the story going sideways instead of forwards for the last two books and keep building towards an ending. GRRM can then provide the real ending in the books in his own time, and if he never finishes them at least we had some sort of ending.

The alternative of trying to pad out the middle of the story is a sure way to make interest in the series wane and result in cancellation.

[TwistedxVisionx]

Hey guys, just wanted to throw in my two cents. I love the show, I think they've done a great job on it. That being said I think they made a mistake starting the show before the books were finished. I also think the the show will reach its peak these next two seasons. SoS will make for some epic television. And while I liked AFFC and ADWD a lot, I don't think they make for very good tv. And now we have the problem that Martin probably won't write fast enough before the show catches up. And they didn't do him any favors by making him extremely popular when he still has so much work to do. He seems to get distracted from his writing very easily. My biggest fear is that he starts to change the books, because of how the TV audience would react. Would he have killed Ned, or had the RW if the show had been created first? I'm not so sure... Also, if they do decide to leave him behind and make the show on their own, I personally won't watch it. The show is great, but is nothing compared to the books IMO. And I won't spoil the books by watching the show that only has very loose bullet points from which to go off of. The more I think about it the more they should have waited until the story was completely wrapped up to make the show. How much does Martin even care about writing anymore? He seems totally into making the show, and attending colleges, book signings, etc. with his new found fame. I'm happy for him, but wished he could have completed the job first. I just want to get TWoW and make sure his writing is still brilliant. The TV show is a secondary concern.

[One Hand Clapping]

I think the rush is now on to complete the whole series before George bestirs himself to publish another book (and I seriously believe that we will never see TWOW never mind the final volume).

If the trailer shows Dany liberating Astapor in S03 (and my bet would be that will be the season finale) then we should see the two weddings in S04 (2014) and I would guess that they will polish off the the whole series in S05 and S06 (2015-16) as AFFC and ADWD are simply not produceable without killing the whole series stone dead.

And this I think is why GRRM has been locked into a new contract - his real job over the next two years will be to actually flesh out the plot outline that will drive S05-06.

Now of course if it still making money and winning awards in 2014 (and killing off four key characters in the S04 finale should give them a huge boost) they may well stretch those last two seasons out to four - and the absence of any further books will fgive them plenty of leeway and provide GRRM with even more motivation to not finish them - but given the history of genre shows this seems unlikely.

[protar]

I think the rush is now on to complete the whole series before George bestirs himself to publish another book (and I seriously believe that we will never see TWOW never mind the final volume).

If the trailer shows Dany liberating Astapor in S03 (and my bet would be that will be the season finale) then we should see the two weddings in S04 (2014) and I would guess that they will polish off the the whole series in S05 and S06 (2015-16) as AFFC and ADWD are simply not produceable without killing the whole series stone dead.

And this I think is why GRRM has been locked into a new contract - his real job over the next two years will be to actually flesh out the plot outline that will drive S05-06.

Now of course if it still making money and winning awards in 2014 (and killing off four key characters in the S04 finale should give them a huge boost) they may well stretch those last two seasons out to four - and the absence of any further books will fgive them plenty of leeway and provide GRRM with even more motivation to not finish them - but given the history of genre shows this seems unlikely.

Well you're wrong about your S3/4 projections for a start. RW is confirmed to be in S3 at least and the Mysha scene is confirmed to be in as well meaning that Dracarys will probably happen in E5/6.

I don't know were you're getting the idea that TWOW will never be released. That's pure nonsense. He's done at least a few hundred pages already.

And while AFFC/ADWD will be troublesome to adapt, there's actually a lot of potential for great television there with some compression and streamlining.

[One Hand Clapping]

Guys.... TWoW is coming out most likely the middle/end of 2014/early 2015.

And I have a lovely bridge to sell you in New York which will be a perfect vantage point for watching the pigs that are currently being genetically engineered to sprout wings and perform aerial acrobatics over the city.....

[One Hand Clapping]

Well you're wrong about your S3/4 projections for a start. RW is confirmed to be in S3 at least and the Mysha scene is confirmed to be in as well meaning that Dracarys will probably happen in E5/6.

I didn't see that.

This however creates bigger underlying problems - in a series like this one characters can't be abandoned for a decade of real (reader/writer) time as George does in his books but each season has to have stuff for all the main cast to do.

Which raises the question of what Dany can actually do after she liberates Astapor/Meereen (which I suspect may turn out to be the same city whatever they call it) and how Theon's being tortured and sexually violated can be sustained over multiple seasons.

So the books chronology (messy as it became) has to be abandoned even in S03 and S04 and I expect a LOT of material from AFFC and ADWD will be brought forward.

As for TWoW are you actually old enough to remember the wait for AFFC and then that for ADWD?

And back then George wasn't writing TV episodes and executive producing a TV series (and developing new TV series ideas!) and attending every convention on the planet as well.

Plus its well known that if as he's claimed George has 400 pages of TWoW (which are manuscript and not print pages - ADWD had 1500 such pages) at least half were left out of ADWD because he and his editor were incapable of squeezing them into the book (despite that being their freaking job....) in time for a deadline set years before - meaning he is actually writing about 100 pages a year of ASOIAF again - and so we should not expect to see TWoW until 2019 or so (when he will be 70).

.

And don't get me wrong - that is his right as an author - and if he never finishes the books but does finish the TV series that to me will be more than enough for me.

[protar]

I didn't see that.

This however creates bigger underlying problems - in a series like this one characters can't be abandoned for a decade of real (reader/writer) time as George does in his books but each season has to have stuff for all the main cast to do.

Which raises the question of what Dany can actually do after she liberates Astapor/Meereen (which I suspect may turn out to be the same city whatever they call it) and how Theon's being tortured and sexually violated can be sustained over multiple seasons.

Well, I expect she'll be doing what she's doing in the books: Ruling Meereen. My guess is that Yunkai will be merged with Meereen and S4 will move forwards her ADWD material up until marrying Hizdahr or shortly before. Or if we do get Yunkai, Meereen will be taken not far into S4 and then we get the same deal.

As for Theon I think you're exaggerating. He needs a 5/6 episode arc in S3 in which he meets "Boy", get's tortured, tries to escape and "Boy" is revealed to be Ramsay. Then he can vanish from S4 until episode 10 when we get his first ADWD chapter as a plot hook and from then on his arc can continue as in the book.

So the books chronology (messy as it became) has to be abandoned even in S03 and S04 and I expect a LOT of material from AFFC and ADWD will be brought forward.

I agree here, I expect Dorne and the Iron Isles to be moved forwards at the very least.

As for TWoW are you actually old enough to remember the wait for AFFC and then that for ADWD?

And back then George wasn't writing TV episodes and executive producing a TV series (and developing new TV series ideas!) and attending every convention on the planet as well.

Plus its well known that if as he's claimed George has 400 pages of TWoW (which are manuscript and not print pages - ADWD had 1500 such pages) at least half were left out of ADWD because he and his editor were incapable of squeezing them into the book (despite that being their freaking job....) in time for a deadline set years before - meaning he is actually writing about 100 pages a year of ASOIAF again - and so we should not expect to see TWoW until 2019 or so (when he will be 70).

.

And don't get me wrong - that is his right as an author - and if he never finishes the books but does finish the TV series that to me will be more than enough for me.

I started the series in 2008/9 so yeah I had to put up with a few years of waiting, but thankfully wasn't subject to the full force of it. In any case I am aware of how it went down and I seem to know more about it than you, else you would know that all of the problems that caused the delayed publications are gone: namely the Meereenese knot, the scrapped timeskip and the splitting of AFFC and ADWD into two books. The only thing Martin has to contend with now is busier schedule and his own writing motivation.

As for your 2019 prediction, don't be ridiculous. Firstly he has not claimed 400 manuscript pages, to my knowledge that was a misquote. He could've done more or less. All we know is that he bought 200 pages forwards from ADWD. And just because his writing pace has been slow so far that does not mean it cannot increase. He has plenty of time to get his ass in gear for a mid-2014 release, making 3 years between Dance and Winds. That is perfectly reasonable.

Now I know the guys busier than he was, but really that shouldn't be impacting his writing to an extent that he's only done 100 pages in a year. All the other problems are gone so the only real explanation is that Martin is just plain not working on the books as much as he once was. I fear that Feast and Dance (which got rather negative reactions with a lot of the fanbase.) may have disheartened him a little bit, so here's to hoping Season 3 of the show will reinvigorate him.

[northernshe-wolf]

I'm predicting around 5-7, maybe 8. Liam Cunningham signed on for 6 more seasons, so maybe that says something.

[ServantOnIce]

I think Seasons 3 and 4 are going to separate from the books to the dismay of bookies and to the non chalantness of the TV only crowd. Remember D and D are book fans but also know what works in TV.

The show like Dexter has gone away from the books and is still highly successful will do the same thing. Actually GRRM need not write any more ASOIAF books in his life and the TV show can be on for 7 or 8 seasons.

D and D have license that we do not have and I know that makes 100,000s of us who feel we do can it better than them jealous, but that is the way it is.

I trust D and D, they are going to do some things to piss me and other bookies off, but who cares? It's just entertainment not our lives.

[Khal-a-bunga]

The very idea that anyone here thinks they could do a better job (or even as good of a job; or even 1/100th as good of a job!) than D&D really does make me laugh. From the few years that I attended film school, I learned quite a bit about what it takes to bring a project as small as a student film to life. Then when I worked on a few independent feature films, I saw how that work seemed infinitesimal compared to the work on a student film. But to be in charge of a production on the scale of Game of Thrones is... Kind of unimaginable. And the fact that it's a multi-million dollar production certainly wouldn't make it any easier, considering the show might as well be considered "low-budget" for what they have to do versus the amount they have to do it with. The fact that they succeed incredibly well just on that front (making everything look feature film quality on a television budget) is just staggering to me, and speaks to the care and attention to detail of everyone involved. Changes or not, this is damn fine television, and it's on a scale that few shows have ever even attempted (only Carnivàle, Deadwood, and Rome come to mind, and even those productions doesn't truly compare).

[Phaing]

Gents, c'mon, the math is simple.

The show will go on as long as it continues to turn a profit, that's how the business works.

Another side of it is reputation. The cancellation of Firefly still hangs like a big, ugly dead snake around Rupert Murdoch's shoulders.

IMHO, making season 3 is HBO's way of crossing the Rubicon. They will be in it for the long haul, even if they have to make something up for the last season themselves.

Which, from what I have heard, ain't that much of a stretch... considering how free the adaptations for season 1 & 2 have been.

[The hairy bear]

I think they made a mistake starting the show before the books were finished.

Those kind of decisions are taken from a financial perspective. All the cash HBO is earning with GOT suggest they took the right decision. Creative issues or the integrity of the story do not weigh a lot here, I'm afraid.

The very idea that anyone here thinks they could do a better job (or even as good of a job; or even 1/100th as good of a job!) than D&D really does make me laugh.

That's nonsense. Not any single boarder has ever suggested that they'd do a better job at handling the production than D&D. You don't need to be able to "do it better" to engage in a discussion of the thinks that you like and the thinks that you don't in a piece of art.

Changes or not, this is damn fine television, and it's on a scale that few shows have ever even attempted (only Carnivàle, Deadwood, and Rome come to mind, and even those productions doesn't truly compare).

The general consensus here is that GoT is "damn fine television". There's no debate about this. But it could be better. To point out the thinks that you think that are improvable in a forum dedicated to discussing the show shouldn't be noteworthy

[Crown]

It's an interesting topic, which I discussed months ago in here and yesterday in the forum's chat, but I still think that HBO will keep creating the show as long as the ratings are increasing. Why would they pull the plug from a succesful show like this? They made the mistake with Rome and Deadwood.

I still think my ten season theory is going to be how they do have to do it, if they want to stick close to the source material and if they are keeping GRRM's writing speed in mind:

Season 1, A Game of Thrones, 2011

Season 2, A Clash of Kings, 2012

Season 3, A Storm of Swords, 2013

Season 4, A Storm of Swords, 2014

Season 5, A Feast for Crows/A Dance with Dragons, 2015

Season 6, A Dance with Dragons, 2016

Season 7, The Winds of Winter, 2017

Season 8, The Winds of Winter, 2018

Season 9, A Dream of Spring, 2019

Season 10, A Dream of Spring, 2020

Sure thing is that they are going to have to make up stories for Daenerys, Bran and some other characters.

[kevin1989]

I think about 9 a 10 seasons.

Season 1: GoT

season 2: CoK

season 3: 2/3 of SoS

season 4: finishing SoS. Beginning of FfC and DwD

season 5: almost finishing FfC and halfway through DwD

season 6: finishing FfC and DwD + Beginning of WoW.

season 7: 2/3 of WoW is finished.

season 8: Finishing WoW and 1/3 of DoD

season 9: Finishing the show.

That's what I think but it's waiting what they will do in season 4 and 5

[Crown]

I think about 9 a 10 seasons.

Season 1: GoT

season 2: CoK

season 3: 2/3 of SoS

season 4: finishing SoS. Beginning of FfC and DwD

season 5: almost finishing FfC and halfway through DwD

season 6: finishing FfC and DwD + Beginning of WoW.

season 7: 2/3 of WoW is finished.

season 8: Finishing WoW and 1/3 of DoD

season 9: Finishing the show.

That's what I think but it's waiting what they will do in season 4 and 5

I would agree with you if we had a solid release date on The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring. I don't see them doing material from either one of the books if they haven't been released yet.

[kevin1989]

I would agree with you if we had a solid release date on The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring. I don't see them doing material from either one of the books if they haven't been released yet.

I think that we don't have to worry about that. GRRM thinks that WoW will be releashed next year (2014) and I think that will be on television in 2016. And I think that if he does 3 years between DwD an WoW that DoD is releashed in 2017 if not sooner. And I think that the beginning of DoD will be on television in 2018. So I think that we don't need to worry about it. I start worrying when he didn't finished WoW before 2016. GRRM is optimistic so will I.

[Crown]

I think that we don't have to worry about that. GRRM thinks that WoW will be releashed next year (2014) and I think that will be on television in 2016. And I think that if he does 3 years between DwD an WoW that DoD is releashed in 2017 if not sooner. And I think that the beginning of DoD will be on television in 2018. So I think that we don't need to worry about it. I start worrying when he didn't finished WoW before 2016. GRRM is optimistic so will I.

I expect Winds in late 2014 or maybe early 2015. I have no reason to believe he'll write Dream in 2017. We can only speculate, time will tell.

[Lord Jakkor]

I think it's quite possible the book are out before the seasons reach that point in the story. I know a lot of people are doom and gloom about it because of how long it's taken GRRM to put the previous two books, but I think that was mostly due to some serious struggles that he had to work through that he's acknowledged and believes he has passed.

2013: Season 3 - SOS

2014: Season 4 - SOS

2015: Season 5 - FFC/DWD

2016: Season 6 - FFC/DWD

2017: Season 7 - FFC/DWD

2018: Season 8 - TWOW

2019: Season 9 - TWOW

2020: Season 10 - ADOS

2021: Season 11 - ADOS

Move everything up a year if you believe FFC/DWD will only compromise two seasons. I think the two books will cover 3 seasons because there's so much material, but could see the argument for two (I think HBO will stretch it to three if GRRM needs time). So let's say HBO needs the book to be out a full year before they start touching the material for the show. So depending when you think they'll get to TWOW in the show (2017 or 2018), the book needs to be out by 2016 or 2017 at the absolute latest. ADOS needs to be out by 2018 or 2019 at the latest.

So going on the 10 season timeline, GRRM needs TWOW out by 2016 and ADOD out by 2018. I think GRRM will put out TWOW in late 2015, leaving him 3 years to put out ADOD. If you go by the later timeline, give him an extra year on ADOD (which I think is likely).

If things really got restricted for time, HBO could take a year off (ala Mad Men), or do a prequel season centered around Robert's Rebellion. But I think that won't need to happen.

Just my thoughts.

[Crown]

<snip>

Wow, you're the first person I met on this board that actually thinks they'll do more seasons than I think they'll do. :lol:

[Lord Jakkor]

Wow, you're the first person I met on this board that actually thinks they'll do more seasons than I think they'll do. :lol:

haha. Yea that's the only thing that worries me. Obviously from a casting perspective it's difficult to hang on for so many years. So few shows reach 10 seasons, let alone 11 @_@. Also in terms of viewership. I think a lot hinges on GOT growing it's viewership through seasons 3 & 4, because after that I could definitely see it losing it's momentum. But given what happens in SOS and the dvd sales of season 2, I have to think the ratings will continue to rise at least this season and give GOT a solid base to hold on to for a few years.

They could also go the LOST route and announce an end point. Give viewers an idea after Season 5 or 6 how many seasons are left. They'll be more likely to stick around knowing there's an end in sight.