James Arryn Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I think people are overestimating Barry the Old. His best days are way behind him. In ADwD, without armor, he was meat.Not the impression I got. Well, first off, he's trained to fight with armor his whole life, so dunno why he'd suddenly not, but either way, when I read DWD Barristan actually went up in my eyes. I wasn't sure if he still had it...how much was just rep. But during that fight, he's so in control he's considering the degree to which his adversary deserves to die honorably. That's fucking boss. I can't imagine how good he was when he was younger, but there's no doubt in my mind he's still in the top tier. Probably Jaime 2 hands or Garlan or w/e take him, but not many, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toos Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 What about Daario ?Dany clearly thinks he's a billy bad ass, but do we have anything hinted that he's skilled at arms?His dress and ornamentation imo seem to imply that he's not skilled so much as concerned with appearing skilled.We don't see his abilities and only references about his abilities are from Daario himself. I think that he is average fighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hukthagz Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 But do we know he doesn't just chill at the back of his forces shouting orders?He killed two captains of Stormcrows. He constantly makes sorties, returns bloody and brings heads. Besides, Barristan would immediately understand if he was a phony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Eh, Daario annoys me, but I get the impression he can walk the talk. Just because he's still alive in a world/profession based on his skill, I doubt he's all hot air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Jon is definitely in the top tier of Westerosi swordsmen. He's not the best on the continent, but he's a skilled and experienced warrior in the way that a lot of other noble-born swordsmen aren't. He's received focused training and combat experience outside of tournaments, but with little or no reputation building up as a result.Nobody cares about how good some bastard in the Night's Watch is with a sword, same as few people outside the North care how good Mance or Qhorin are with a sword. He's something of a darkhorse there and I wouldn't be surprised to see him demonstrating his skills more and more as the story goes on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt O'Sevens Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I'd say Jon is above average, could handle himself against most knights in the kingdoms, but probably not quite on the same level as Arthur Dayne, or Barristan the Bold in his prime. I do think he is capable of being that good, and probably will be very soon.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 He killed two captains of Stormcrows. He constantly makes sorties, returns bloody and brings heads. Besides, Barristan would immediately understand if he was a phony.It's always sounded like he took them by surprise, either when they were asleep or otherwise unprepared for combat. You can bet he didn't fight staged duels with them for possession of their heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywolf2375 Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 That's what i was getting at. He obviously went full assault, damning defense for its sake. While awake he can do better.He's said to be pride of Eastwatch. He's either the best or at least one of the elite.I think Jon can take Barristan the Old while Jaime in his prime would still be out of his reach.Barristan would eat Jon for breakfast.Jon is above average and is made better by Longclaw. He has the ability to be better, but isn't there yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Turtle Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Yes he is most probably better than Barristan the Old, Jaime the One Handed and Hound the Lame. It's sad what GRRM is doing with the best fighters. I think he has a real chance to win against Mance, though the chances for victory are 4:1 favoring the wildling king.Speaking about the younger ones, is Jon better than Loras? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaegrM Posted September 16, 2012 Author Share Posted September 16, 2012 It's always sounded like he took them by surprise, either when they were asleep or otherwise unprepared for combat. You can bet he didn't fight staged duels with them for possession of their heads.I always assumed they were sleeping as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaegrM Posted September 16, 2012 Author Share Posted September 16, 2012 Yes he is most probably better than Barristan the Old, Jaime the One Handed and Hound the Lame. It's sad what GMMR is doing with the best fighters. I think he has a real chance to win against Mance, though the chances for victory are 4:1 favoring the wildling king.Speaking about the younger ones, is Jon better than Loras?I'd put Loras above Jon in terms of skill....But Jon isn't arrogant or overconfident like Loras.He proved he's able to be calculating against Mance.And with Longclaw.....I don't know who would win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barristan The Based God Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Yes he is most probably better than Barristan the Old, Jaime the One Handed and Hound the Lame. It's sad what GMMR is doing with the best fighters. I think he has a real chance to win against Mance, though the chances for victory are 4:1 favoring the wildling king.Speaking about the younger ones, is Jon better than Loras?Idk all I've heard about Loras is stuff from tourneys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hukthagz Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Speaking about the younger ones, is Jon better than Loras?Loras' swordmanship is worse than Garlan but he swiftly takes out two of Rainbow Guards in grief. Stalemate probably.It's always sounded like he took them by surprise, either when they were asleep or otherwise unprepared for combat. You can bet he didn't fight staged duels with them for possession of their heads.I think Daario blitzed them both but Barry vouches for his warrior streak. Sneak attacks, poison etc are not his lot. His victims at least saw him coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Idk all I've heard about Loras is stuff from tourneys.Loras is pretty green as far as real combat goes. Depending on what happened at Dragonstone, we could see evidence one way or the other. Yes, Loras is good at jousting, but that's a very different skill than swordplay and a very different setting than combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormcloak Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I don't think he's in the same league as Garlan, Mance, Qhorin, Arthur Dayne, Oberyn, Sandor, Rhaegar, Syrio, Oberyn in his prime, Barristan in his prime or Jaime with two hands yet but he is (was?) heading in that direction.Like everyone else is saying I think he's as good as Loras (with a sword, not at jousting) and maybe up there with Jaime when he first joined the King's Guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sworn Shield Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Mance must be fairly skilled to become King of the North, they didn't allow him to become King because he was a good singer. He had to beat Tormund, the Magnar of Thenn and several others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Mance must be fairly skilled to become King of the North, they didn't allow him to become King because he was a good singer. He had to beat Tormund, the Magnar of Thenn and several othersHe had to beat Styr 3 times, and Styr was no joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Loras is probably a prodigy, his swordsmanship just rates poorly compared with both his brother's (who might be the best swordsmen around now) and his own jousting, which might be the best around now. So he might easily be incredible with those still being true. With age him might become elite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barristan The Based God Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Loras is pretty green as far as real combat goes. Depending on what happened at Dragonstone, we could see evidence one way or the other. Yes, Loras is good at jousting, but that's a very different skill than swordplay and a very different setting than combat.Exactly I've always thought his actual skill was over hyped. What actually happened at Dragonstone will be big in determining his worth in my eyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pod The Impaler Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 What about Daario ?Dany clearly thinks he's a billy bad ass, but do we have anything hinted that he's skilled at arms?His dress and ornamentation imo seem to imply that he's not skilled so much as concerned with appearing skilled.Probably not a slouch, otherwise he wouldn't make it far as a sellsword, but I think treachery probably brought him higher than skill.In the end, I think either Ser Grandfather or Victarion is going to wipe the floor with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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