Magic 8 Ball Posted February 5, 2013 Author Share Posted February 5, 2013 http://awoiaf.wester...enyra_TargaryenAccording to this, Rhaenyra's marriage to a Strong did not result in surviving heirs, her children who succeeded her were born of her second marriage to an "as yet unnamed member of the Targaryen family"The Velaryon cousin marriage doesn't matter because none of the issue are in Danaerys' direct line.This doesn't change your argument or Dany's percentage of relationship to Aegon the Conqueror, but if your thing is genetics, mine is genealogy ;)ETA: Sorry, I see you were talking about speculative Velaryon cousins, not the one married by Aegon III. I really did enjoy this thread!Anyone interested in the Targ family tree, if you haven't seen this nifty graphic, check it out:http://awoiaf.wester...Family_tree.jpgHmm.... funny, I don't recall that part about Strong not producing heirs having been there a day or two ago...Not the "as of yet unnamed" Targ relative...Convenient cousin based Targ blood transfusion via retcon incoming.... in 3.. 2.. 1..Still no "dragonfucker" thread... I'm too scared to start one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsunad Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 When we look at blood tests today the emphasis is on male blood lines. There are other means by which to look at the individuals mother's blood line to determine one's acestrial lineage, but these are quite involved.mtDNA tests are pretty common, and should prove a straight female descent. From what I can tell, this was the test that was used as evidence in for Richard III remains.I've spent time looking about both Y-DNA and mtDNA tests (both would be useful to prove or disprove certain family claims that I'm unsure of). mtDNA tests seem legit, and aren't too expensive.Of course, Dany should have neither. Dany's mtDNA (in the real world) should be from whatever house Jaehaerys II's wife was from. And Dany doesn't have any Y-DNA, since she was female. (Aegon, if he's legit, should have the same Y-DNA as his conquering namesake, if there's no illegitimacy in his family lines. Viserys could make the same claim. So could Jon, if R+L=J. Aegon's mtDNA would be Dornish, most likely (but could be anything, since its a straight female descent line - all we know is he'd have the same mtDNA as Doran, since they both are descended from Doran's mother, the Princess of Dorne, according to the wiki of Ice & Fire).But yes, I agree, in GRRM's world, magic is involved in heredity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boojam Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 But yes, I agree, in GRRM's world, magic is involved in heredity.You know, I think someone mentioned this,... there may have been magic and 'magic'.By 'magic' I mean in some sort of way being born of Valyrian heritage one is assimilated into Valyrian culture. I don't think Viserys (with his vainglory ravings) was Dany's only instructor. I know George has never told us, but I still hold to the possibility Darry brought Dany's mother ,Rhaella, ladies-in-waiting , in fact part of her retinue who may have been Valyrian... in the escape to Braavos. Yeah I know Viserys and Dany were turned out when Darry died and maybe something happened to Rhaella's retinue , but Dany seems to have picked up a lot Valyrian culture and education. She does , after all, speak High Valyrian , seemingly her puppy language.As influential as they were GRRM has not written much of account Valyrian culture.So no matter the fraction of blood, Dany may be as much Valyrian in spirit (and 'magical' spirit) as a full blooded Valyrian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boojam Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 Ok, so I double checked the family tree and did the generous assumptions plus the cousin math - and surprised myself by getting her to...I have seen that genealogical 'map' , and as I have said I don't read the novels paying THAT much attention to those kind of connections. So just how accurate is that family tree?Are we supposed to have confidence in it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Gwynhyfvar Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 Hmm.... funny, I don't recall that part about Strong not producing heirs having been there a day or two ago...Not the "as of yet unnamed" Targ relative...Convenient cousin based Targ blood transfusion via retcon incoming.... in 3.. 2.. 1..Still no "dragonfucker" thread... I'm too scared to start one.Ya, I thought the same but I checked and double checked. And the wiki hasn't been changed since last fall. There's still the question of how accurate the wiki is though...As for your dragon sex thread, go for it! I notice Ran hasn't come back to elucidate on the thought bomb he dropped in here the other day. Maybe a whole thread devoted to it would tempt him back ;)I have seen that genealogical 'map' , and as I have said I don't read the novels paying THAT much attention to those kind of connections.So just how accurate is that family tree?Are we supposed to have confidence in it?I do pay attention to all the genealogy in the novels, but that doesn't account for all the details in the wiki tree. The version on the link I posted yesterday is sure pretty though, and has timeline and everything :) Someone put a lot of work into it. I assume a lot of SSMs were culled for information. Again, there IS one person (besides GRRM himself) who has visited this thread and could shed some light. Maybe at least on whether we can trust the wiki tree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Ennepe Posted February 5, 2013 Share Posted February 5, 2013 Ya, I thought the same but I checked and double checked. And the wiki hasn't been changed since last fall. There's still the question of how accurate the wiki is though...As for your dragon sex thread, go for it! I notice Ran hasn't come back to elucidate on the thought bomb he dropped in here the other day. Maybe a whole thread devoted to it would tempt him back ;) My offer still stands, I will sacrifice myself for it if Avatar is too afraid to start one :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic 8 Ball Posted February 5, 2013 Author Share Posted February 5, 2013 My offer still stands, I will sacrifice myself for it if Avatar is too afraid to start one :PPlease do, I already have a warning post for making a "Dany is fat" joke once. I'm on thinner ice than Ramsay Bolton is about to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic 8 Ball Posted February 7, 2013 Author Share Posted February 7, 2013 bump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boojam Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 bumpCan we trust the Wiki Tree or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Gwynhyfvar Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Can we trust the Wiki Tree or not?Ran could answer that, if only he would... :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireicemaiden Posted April 29, 2013 Share Posted April 29, 2013 ok so on the tower of the hand site there are some comprehensive family trees. It says that Maegor I is the child of Visenya and Rgaenys which I always thought was a typo, however this thread got me thinking that maybe it's not. Maybe like the dragon there is a possibility of changing genders..... that would be an interesting twist....I am also curious about tracking the dragons along with the family tree because I was wondering about blood sacrafice to create or hatch new dragons.... They start with 3 - Balerion, Vhaghar, and Meraxes and Jaeharys is confirme to have Silverwing and goes to Winterfell with 6 dragons... according to the link to the family tree posted here Jane Westerling was married to Magor I - was her death able to hatch 3 eggs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSense Posted April 29, 2013 Share Posted April 29, 2013 What about Dany's midichlorian count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Idiots Lantern Posted April 29, 2013 Share Posted April 29, 2013 Dany gets a lot of crap for her "blood of the dragon" spiels. I think people take that way too seriously.C'mon guys, it's just an expression she repeats to herself to psyche herself up and give herself courage; a way of saying "c'mon girl, keep it together, you can do this." It's a mental totem for her.Who cares how literally true it is? That's not the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Storm King Posted April 29, 2013 Share Posted April 29, 2013 but youre assuming that genetics works the same way in the world of asoiaf as it does in our world. we know that valyrians were a powerful people they might have had some kind of magic in their blood. for all you know their humans might have 23 pairs of chromosomes its a fictional world GRRM can do whatever he wants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindchap Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 It's funny just a few topics away there's a whole group of people complaining about incest and too much blood of the dragon. This free speech thing is just getting way outta hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin king Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 but youre assuming that genetics works the same way in the world of asoiaf as it does in our world. we know that valyrians were a powerful people they might have had some kind of magic in their blood. for all you know their humans might have 23 pairs of chromosomes its a fictional world GRRM can do whatever he wantsIf they're anything like us they do :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireicemaiden Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I think Dany's higher tolarance for heat will allow her to blow the dragon horn..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeRhaegar Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 arguing genetic in a fantasy world lolol this is just like arguing about aragorn having how much elf blood LOLOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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