An Early Take on Season 3

[Azzazel]

They are trying to be so secretive about Bolton that people won't even know his name by the time he kills Robb.

[Moët]

Moët,

You're making some large assumptions that run counter to what bother the writers have indicated and bits and pieces of information I've picked up.

Jason Momoa was in the show because they absolutely love him and wanted to find a way to work him back on -- that's the sum total of the reason for why Dany "finds love and her son".

And snow on the Iron Throne... heh.

It's really just nice imagery, but the sum total of "prophetic" material in it is really just this: a) winter will destroy everything if something isn't done and B) the Wall is a key part of the battle to save everything.

But we've sort of always known this stuff. So it's not really all that noteworthy.

Your assumption that you're assuming that I'm assuming anything at all, is rather presumptuous.. :D

I'm not assuming anything. It's my opinion. That's all. I certainly have absolutely no inside knowledge to anything, I'm just a fan of these books. And I'm certainly not high enough on the evolutionary scale to be sent 4 episodes ahead of time to review. That's your job. :D

I loved your review. Thank you.

But just because I loved what you wrote, doesn't mean I have to agree with you, or does it?

Your reply to me seems a little defensive, and I wasn't attacking you. But your assumption of

It's really just nice imagery, but the sum total of "prophetic" material in it is really just this: a) winter will destroy everything if something isn't done and

B)

the Wall is a key part of the battle to save everything.

...is also just that, an assumption. Nothing wrong with that, but telling me I'm assuming more than there is when I'm just having fun finding imagery in a TV show based on a series of books that has a lot of imagery, hoping the adaptation will do the same, is a bit unfair.

[The Flaying Man]

They are trying to be so secretive about Bolton that people won't even know his name by the time he kills Robb.

I agree, his name was literally only mentioned once last season, and even at that, "Lord Bolton" was just said in passing by Robb. His betrayal of Robb's cause needs to be of huge significance, and for that to happen, the viewer needs to know who he is!

In saying that, however, I do appreciate the cold stares he gives Robb occasionally in S2. It's good foreshadowing, a nice nod to the book readers, and will be appreciated even more in hindsight. Plus, McElhatton is great as Roose, in my opinion. Looking forward to seeing much(?) more of him in S3!

ETA: Ran, would it be possible to give an indication as to how much screen time and emphasis Roose Bolton gets in episodes 1-4?

[Carne]

I agree, his name was literally only mentioned once last season, and even at that, "Lord Bolton" was just said in passing by Robb. His betrayal of Robb's cause needs to be of huge significance, and for that to happen, the viewer needs to know who he is!

In saying that, however, I do appreciate the cold stares he gives Robb occasionally in S2. It's good foreshadowing, a nice nod to the book readers, and will be appreciated even more in hindsight. Plus, McElhatton is great as Roose, in my opinion. Looking forward to seeing much(?) more of him in S3!

From what I've heard he's mainly in the background for the first 4 episodes, with a line here and there.

[Dragonstoned]

Your assumption that you're assuming that I'm assuming anything at all, is rather presumptuous.. :D

I'm not assuming anything. It's my opinion. That's all. I certainly have absolutely no inside knowledge to anything, I'm just a fan of these books. And I'm certainly not high enough on the evolutionary scale to be sent 4 episodes ahead of time to review. That's your job. :D

I loved your review. Thank you.

But just because I loved what you wrote, doesn't mean I have to agree with you, or does it?

Your reply to me seems a little defensive, and I wasn't attacking you. But your assumption of

...is also just that, an assumption. Nothing wrong with that, but telling me I'm assuming more than there is when I'm just having fun finding imagery in a TV show based on a series of books that has a lot of imagery, hoping the adaptation will do the same, is a bit unfair.

Always funny when someone takes on one of the mods, but I think Ran's right here and isn't being defensive. Your 'just because I loved what you wrote, doesn't mean I have to agree with you, or does it?' is more defensive.

If you talk about D&D's changes then you should be up on why they may have made them. They've said in lots of interviews and in the Emmys panel how much they like Jason Momoa. Also the continued removal of prophecy from the show should indicate that maybe elevated ideas about Dany seeing Drogo and her son north of the Wall are less valid, that the producers aren't that bothered about the role of prophecy (despite Bryan Cogman saying otherwise) and that there is a simpler motivation for the prophecies they do include as well as all the ones they don't.

[Ran]

Ran, would it be possible to give an indication as to how much screen time and emphasis Roose Bolton gets in episodes 1-4?

He appears in one episode, and has about five lines so far.

[Dragonstoned]

Any thoughts on the score? One of the best things in s1 and 2.

[winksiemop]

He appears in one episode, and has about five lines so far.

First episode? Is he left at Harrenhal?

[protar]

He appears in one episode, and has about five lines so far.

I think that's to be expected though for the first 4 episodes. I would guess that his appearance is in E1

taking Harrenhal

With Jaime not arriving there until mid-season at which point Roose will have plenty more focus hopefully. All in all he seems set to appear as much as in the books.

[Ran]

You know, I was excited by some of the new musical themes in S2... but other than a recapitulation of the S10 Mother of Dragons theme, there's nothing that stands out as particularly new or interesting musically speaking.

[Dragonstoned]

Cheers Ran, I really liked 'Mother of Dragons' but hope it picks up later on.

I think that's to be expected though for the first 4 episodes. I would guess that his appearance is in E1

taking Harrenhal

With Jaime not arriving there until mid-season at which point Roose will have plenty more focus hopefully. All in all he seems set to appear as much as in the books.

Would be good if they compensated for the lack of Roose in s1 and 2 vis-à-vis the books though. Maybe they'll use the Ramsay-Theon storyline to indicate the Boltons aren't very nice instead.

[protar]

Cheers Ran, I really liked 'Mother of Dragons' but hope it picks up later on.

Would be good if they compensated for the lack of Roose in s1 and 2 vis-à-vis the books though. Maybe they'll use the Ramsay-Theon storyline to indicate the Boltons aren't very nice instead.

Sadly it seems as though they'll be making it something of a mystery as to where Theon is, though that could change later on which would be good. And yeah I don't necessarily think Roose himself needs too much screen-time so long as his reputation is bolstered by Ramsay and Locke.

[Moët]

Always funny when someone takes on one of the mods, but I think Ran's right here and isn't being defensive. Your 'just because I loved what you wrote, doesn't mean I have to agree with you, or does it?' is more defensive.

If you talk about D&D's changes then you should be up on why they may have made them. They've said in lots of interviews and in the Emmys panel how much they like Jason Momoa. Also the continued removal of prophecy from the show should indicate that maybe elevated ideas about Dany seeing Drogo and her son north of the Wall are less valid, that the producers aren't that bothered about the role of prophecy (despite Bryan Cogman saying otherwise) and that there is a simpler motivation for the prophecies they do include as well as all the ones they don't.

Hmm.... I didn't realize that replying to someone replying to me was "taking on" anyone, let alone a Mod, but good to know. I'm new here, so thanks for the heads-up. ;) [/sarcasm]

I watched the emmycast twice, (after persuading a friend to watch it - [if you're my friend, you'll watch this so I can have an excuse to watch it again and... just kidding... sort of... ;) ]...and I fall more in love with all of them every time I see them...) and all I heard through laughing my ass off again with the MERCY story was that they loved the opportunity to write Jason in and bring him back for that scene. I don't remember hearing them say, "the HoU was just a bunch of pretty images that meant nothing, so move on." But I miss things all the time, so.... :dunno: but thanks for explaining it to me. I'll try to pay more attention in future.

Again - I enjoy trying to find imagery in a TV show that I love, based on books that I love that are full of imagery. Why? Because I enjoy it. It's only my opinion. I'm wrong all the time and have no problem with it. You shouldn't either, because my opinion is just my opinion. It's not your opinion. And it's not important.

GRRM could write that Agent Mulder dreamed all of this and be done, and we're all a bunch of goofballs for thinking there was more to it. I hope he doesn't because I'm having a hell of a good time with it right now.

[Loras]

Here is a link to a wonderful review of the season so far. Be aware though that it does contain some dialogue and mild spoilers.

http://thinkprogress.org/alyssa/2013/03/29/1791171/review-game-of-thrones-rises-to-greatness-in-its-third-season/?mobile=nc

Best review I have read so far.

[Dragonstoned]

Hmm.... I didn't realize that replying to someone replying to me was "taking on" anyone, let alone a Mod, but good to know. I'm new here, so thanks for the heads-up. ;) [/sarcasm]

I watched the emmycast twice, (after persuading a friend to watch it - [if you're my friend, you'll watch this so I can have an excuse to watch it again and... just kidding... sort of... ;) ]...and I fall more in love with all of them every time I see them...) and all I heard through laughing my ass off again with the MERCY story was that they loved the opportunity to write Jason in and bring him back for that scene. I don't remember hearing them say, "the HoU was just a bunch of pretty images that meant nothing, so move on." But I miss things all the time, so.... :dunno: but thanks for explaining it to me. I'll try to pay more attention in future.

Again - I enjoy trying to find imagery in a TV show that I love, based on books that I love that are full of imagery. Why? Because I enjoy it. It's only my opinion. I'm wrong all the time and have no problem with it. You shouldn't either, because my opinion is just my opinion. It's not your opinion. And it's not important.

GRRM could write that Agent Mulder dreamed all of this and be done, and we're all a bunch of goofballs for thinking there was more to it. I hope he doesn't because I'm having a hell of a good time with it right now.

Hahah yeah I'm sorry, the 'taking on' was tongue in cheek. As far as I know, nowhere have D&D said explicitly why they brought Momoa back, however given their praise and friendship it makes a lot of sense that that is why. Like you say, it's all opinions, but some are more reasonable and some have less to support them. Maybe he came back as a favour for what he did to Benioff's hands?

Agree that the books are full of imagery but I really wish there was more of that in the show. Not to bring up Renly's peach for the millionth time but that is the obvious one. I actually think they did okay with the HotU because without the CGI budget there's no way what Dany sees can be go to screen, it's too much of a mad flurry not to mention the vast spoiler potential when the POV verbal descriptions become images. I still thought they could have picked a few of the salient visions and shown those instead. I haven't seen enough concern for prophecy/imagery so far in the show to justify any deep readings of what they have given us.

[PatrickStormborn]

If the brutality of torture is a predictable point for the show to make, Game of Thrones is also staging a fascinating discussion of what it means for women to be capable of both inflicting and withstanding violence, and how much it surprises men when they are. Jamie tries to escape Brienne at one point, but wants the satisfaction of beating her first. “If you were willing to hurt me, you might have had me there,” he tells her towards the beginning of their match, only to find himself startled by her skill. Later, when he shuts down after a defeat, her contempt for him shocks Jamie back to life. “You have a taste, one taste of the real world, where people have important things taken from them, and you whine, and cry, and quit,” Brienne tells him, proving both emotionally and physically stronger than the man considered the greatest fighter in Westeros. “You sound like a bloody woman.”

Ugh @ the bolded part. That line is so out of character for Brienne. It reminds me of last year when they made Arya say "Most girls are idiots" and when Yara called Theon a "cunt" despite book!Asha's flawless commentary on the use of the word "cunt" and how it is used to insult women.

Also, why are they trying to insist that Brienne is "physically stronger" than Jaime? She... really isn't. She's a great fighter, of course, but Jaime is one of the greatest. She only beats him because he's been held captive and underestimates her.

[Dragonstoned]

Ugh @ the bolded part. That line is so out of character for Brienne. It reminds me of last year when they made Arya say "Most girls are idiots" and when Yara called Theon a "cunt" despite book!Asha's flawless commentary on the use of the word "cunt" and how it is used to insult women.

Also, why are they trying to insist that Brienne is "physically stronger" than Jaime? She... really isn't. She's a great fighter, of course, but Jaime is one of the greatest. She only beats him because he's been held captive and underestimates her.

Wholly agree with the top part, some of the lines are very off.

But there is a point when Jaime fights Brienne where he thinks 'she's stronger than me'. I also don't think it's because he's been in a cell cos he debates who else is stronger than him, including certainly the Clegane brothers.

edit: Alyssa's article is a very good summary but not really a review in the critical sense.

[protar]

Ugh @ the bolded part. That line is so out of character for Brienne. It reminds me of last year when they made Arya say "Most girls are idiots" and when Yara called Theon a "cunt" despite book!Asha's flawless commentary on the use of the word "cunt" and how it is used to insult women.

Also, why are they trying to insist that Brienne is "physically stronger" than Jaime? She... really isn't. She's a great fighter, of course, but Jaime is one of the greatest. She only beats him because he's been held captive and underestimates her.

Brienne is physically stronger than Jaime. He admits as much in the books. But that doesn't necessarily equate to skill.

EDIT: :ninja:

[PatrickStormborn]

Oh okay, thanks for the clarification. For some reason I was under the impression that the reviewer was referring to skill when they talked about physical strength.

[Carne]

Ugh @ the bolded part. That line is so out of character for Brienne. It reminds me of last year when they made Arya say "Most girls are idiots" and when Yara called Theon a "cunt" despite book!Asha's flawless commentary on the use of the word "cunt" and how it is used to insult women.

Might just be a sarcastic remark towards Jaime for his condescending attitude. I don't think he expected to be bested in a fight by a woman.