AFFC/ADWD Hate?

[total1402]

I will have to disagree about nothing happening. As you state ADwD is more about character development and setting the stage for future events. Surely that is important? These books are not about just action and battles. I would say that ADwD was on par with ACoK in that respect. Characters can't just turn up and be awesome. Jon's story was more then just getting stabbed. At the end of ASoS he was a young LC of the NW. Throughout Dance we see him trying to tackle different factions, prepare for the Others, grow as a leader, make mistakes and stumble at the end. Stannis march to WF was important. Jon bringing the Wildlings across the wall and the new alliances and treaties are important. The Iron Bank was important. Manderly and the Boltons was important. Dany learning to rule was important. The introduction of Aegon was important. I would say all that is worth the amount of paper spend on it.

Because you do not spend two massive volumes dedicated entirely to (limited) character development and setting the stage for future events. We did not need two books before Robert went out hunting in AGOT in order to understand the characters and have things set up. Two books is a ridiculous amount and these are not light reading. One book alone would barely be justifiable but an entire third of the series just to set up act 2? Yes I expect the plot to move forward during the course of two books. Yes, I expect some big events to happen during the course of two several thousand page novels that aren't just the foreshadowing for WoW (like Dany riding Drogon, Aegons inv, Jons death). That is not a high or ridiculous expectation when so much material is repetitive or unneccesary. I do not expect the entire plot to be on hold whilst I struggle to remember who all these new characters are. Who Cerseis shoving her fingers into. How many cousins Arriane has. Who Quentyn Martel has waddling around with him. I don't give a shit. I don't want to hear Cersei and Quentyns life story. I do not appreciate pointless plots like the Arriane conspiracy or Danys efforts at peacemaker (coz you KNOW she is going to fail from the start).

Plus, to do all that just to end it where he did as it actually looked like all this garbage was going to amount to something is just not forgivable. Honestly, I would have been far more okay with AFFC/ADWD if he had not ended it just when things were about to happen. That is just insulting. I am not expecting something to happen every chapter. But for gods sake I expect something important to happen plotwise in a book and not for this to be WOW-THE PROLOGUE.

[StarkDragon]

AFFC was slower, but good.

I thought Theon was very strong in ADWD.

I thought Danny... could have been better in ADWD.

[tallTale]

Probably my biggest issue was with Jon's plot lines and how it turned into a convoluted mess.

[total1402]

Probably my biggest issue was with Jon's plot lines and how it turned into a convoluted mess.

How so?

[Joyful Union]

Probably my biggest issue was with Jon's plot lines and how it turned into a convoluted mess.

I though Jon's was one of the most simple and clear storylines in aDwD. A few of the chapters may have been bogged down in details, but it wasn't very convoluted. In fact, Jon is one of the few characters in the book who has a clear arc.

[King in the North Carolina]

Not really. If he had begun the series with two books like AFFC and ADWD I doubt I ever would have taken any interest in the series.

Point well taken, but that's why you don't start a series with the slower books. Slowing down midstory (once the readership is already hooked) makes all the sense in the world to me. Presumably business should pick back up as the story enters its third act.

I know lots of readers who were frustrated with the pacing in AFFC and ADWD, but I've never met anyone who lost interest in the series because of it. That means it hasn't been a real problem, IMO.

Interestingly enough, I think it may become more of a problem for the tv program. I think there's a natural expectation most viewers have to see the plot being significantly pushed forward in every episode. When you read ASOS, you can easily imagine it translating to thrilling tv. AFFC and ADWD, not so much.

[tallTale]

I though Jon's was one of the most simple and clear storylines in aDwD. A few of the chapters may have been bogged down in details, but it wasn't very convoluted. In fact, Jon is one of the few characters in the book who has a clear arc.

I suppose I was referring to the whole Wall related clusterfuck:

Jon Snow, Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, is beset on all sides by threats and danger. King Stannis Baratheon wants land and waycastles belonging to the Watch, which he means to hand out as fiefs to his most loyal supporters. The Others are continuing to mass beyond the Wall. Mance Rayder's wildling host, leaderless and smashed by Stannis during the events of A Storm of Swords, still numbers in the thousands, and Jon sees every wildling represents another wight theOthers can send against the Wall. To this end he takes great pains to court the wildlings, winning them over to his side and uniting them with the Watch against their common foe; but in doing so, he loses the support of many of his sworn brothers. Shortly after shepherding a large wilding host through the Wall, he is stabbed by several members of the Night's Watch, his last chapter ending with him falling unconscious. Melisandre, meanwhile, burns Rattleshirt disguised as Mance Rayderunder a sorcerous glamour, while Rayder secretly lives on disguised as Rattleshirt. She reveals to Jon Snow that a grey girl on a dying horse, who she interprets to be Arya Stark, is coming up the kingsroad to seek asylum, and with Snow's permission dispatches Rayder and several spearwives to rescue her. The woman is revealed to actually be Alys Karstark, fleeing the manipulations of her relatives in light of her father's death. After taking Jon's advice Stannis is able to seizeDeepwood Motte with the allegiance of the hill folk, the Karstarks, the Glovers and Mormonts, and half of the Umbers. He then moves against Ramsay Bolton, who has taken up seat in the ruins of Winterfell with the other half of the northern bannermen. At last report — a gloating letter in Ramsay's handwriting to Jon Snow — Stannis' host was smashed and the king slain.

[Dagon Greyjoy]

A Feast For Crows is easily the best book on the series, hands down: It's got this all-pervasive sense of impending doom, it's amazing. Yes, the wars have bogged down to a crawl. Yes, everyone is licking their wounds and plotting.... But the whole atmosphere of the fucked-up calm before the storm, amazing people like Arianne Martell being willing to burn the realm to rule over the ashes, Brienne on an impossible quest throughout the devastated warzones, Jaime reclaiming his honor in a world where honor don't mean shit no more, the Ironborn claimants, Euron's arrival as pretty much a herald of doom....

Cm'on!

[Alester Florent]

Point well taken, but that's why you don't start a series with the slower books. Slowing down midstory (once the readership is already hooked) makes all the sense in the world to me. Presumably business should pick back up as the story enters its third act.

There's slowing down and then there's changing course and apparently stopping in the middle of nowhere. The middle section of books, or the second book in a trilogy, is usually my favourite part of the story, because you're done with the character introductions and establishing the setting so you can really get stuck into it. But these two fall away, and there's not even the meat behind them in terms of the setting in the earlier books. When you look at the work that was done in the first two books in particular in terms of establishing the setting, introducing characters, all the stuff like Quaithe's propecy and the HotU, and moving the plot forwards, and then compare them to AFFC and ADwD... the latter two books seem really thin. AFFC and ADwD feel at times less like the middle section of an epic story and more like the tedious start of a new epic story.

I know lots of readers who were frustrated with the pacing in AFFC and ADWD, but I've never met anyone who lost interest in the series because of it. That means it hasn't been a real problem, IMO.

I know one - the person who got me into ASoIaF in the first place, in fact. I picked up AGoT because she was raving about it, then overtook her while reading and got to the end of the series. She got about halfway through AFFC, realised that the next two books were going to be more of the same, and hasn't read any of them since. She's still watching the TV show and says she might come back to the books when the next one is published, if it's more eventful than the last two, but if GRRM takes too long about it I wouldn't want to bet on it.

[total1402]

There's slowing down and then there's changing course and apparently stopping in the middle of nowhere. The middle section of books, or the second book in a trilogy, is usually my favourite part of the story, because you're done with the character introductions and establishing the setting so you can really get stuck into it. But these two fall away, and there's not even the meat behind them in terms of the setting in the earlier books. When you look at the work that was done in the first two books in particular in terms of establishing the setting, introducing characters, all the stuff like Quaithe's propecy and the HotU, and moving the plot forwards, and then compare them to AFFC and ADwD... the latter two books seem really thin. AFFC and ADwD feel at times less like the middle section of an epic story and more like the tedious start of a new epic story.

Absolutely agree. In fact I am already finding that with the TV show. I want to just get on with events rather than constantly bombarding me with new characters.

Also just to pick through Jons story

Jon Snow, Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, is beset on all sides by threats and danger. King Stannis Baratheon wants land and waycastles belonging to the Watch, which he means to hand out as fiefs to his most loyal supporters. The Others are continuing to mass beyond the Wall. Mance Rayder's wildling host, leaderless and smashed by Stannis during the events of A Storm of Swords, still numbers in the thousands, and Jon sees every wildling represents another wight theOthers can send against the Wall. To this end he takes great pains to court the wildlings, winning them over to his side and uniting them with the Watch against their common foe; but in doing so, he loses the support of many of his sworn brothers. Shortly after shepherding a large wilding host through the Wall, he is stabbed by several members of the Night's Watch, his last chapter ending with him falling unconscious. Melisandre, meanwhile, burns Rattleshirt disguised as Mance Rayderunder a sorcerous glamour, while Rayder secretly lives on disguised as Rattleshirt. She reveals to Jon Snow that a grey girl on a dying horse, who she interprets to be Arya Stark, is coming up the kingsroad to seek asylum, and with Snow's permission dispatches Rayder and several spearwives to rescue her. The woman is revealed to actually be Alys Karstark, fleeing the manipulations of her relatives in light of her father's death. After taking Jon's advice Stannis is able to seizeDeepwood Motte with the allegiance of the hill folk, the Karstarks, the Glovers and Mormonts, and half of the Umbers. He then moves against Ramsay Bolton, who has taken up seat in the ruins of Winterfell with the other half of the northern bannermen. At last report — a gloating letter in Ramsay's handwriting to Jon Snow — Stannis' host was smashed and the king slain.

-So the book is primarily about the fallout of ASOS with the wildlings. Not advancing the plot at all and deliberately delaying any entaglements with the Others even though they have yet to show up at all in this series.

-Another fake death is stupid and ridiculous. We need to be killing these characters off not keeping them alive and introducing new ones. Its an unneccesary and silly twist and it renders ASOS irrelevent because now Mances host has gotton past the wall with him now able to rejoin it again.

- Stannis spends a ton of chapters at the wall doing nothing in ASOS, never mind ADWD and it takes him all this time just to get him to Winterfell. We then don't learn what the result of that battle is and it ends on another massive cliffhanger with Jon.

-Seriously, cliffhangers like that are frustrating and maddening. No other series would get away with this. He and the editors clearly felt the need to keep up interest and hype by ending everything on a cliffhanger. It actually makes me sick just thinking about it.

-Simply put, nothing happens and Martin manages to render ASOS resolution pointless in the process.

-All so Jon can learn to lead an organisation which has likely just condemned itself to destruction early in the next book

[Dove]

Brienne on an impossible quest throughout the devastated warzones,

Maybe they're easier for me to swallow because I like Brienne but yeah, I dig her chapters and getting insight into how the war is affecting the "smallfolk" even if we know that her errand is fruitless. Plus the throwdown between her and Biter towards the end is one of the best, most visceral fight sequences GRRM's ever written.

[HopeForSpring]

I think the 4th and 5th books added a lot of depth and tapestry to the world. I enjoyed them a lot. I'm not in a hurry to have less prose "to just get it over with." But I started reading with the start of the TV series, so I haven't had yeeeeaaarrrss of waiting. That maybe some of the difference. If I had waited 12 years with no big pay-off, well I can see being more restless.

[Dicer]

-All so Jon can learn to lead an organisation which has likely just condemned itself to destruction early in the next book

I am just curious here. What did you want Jon's story arc to be in ADwD after he becomes LC at the end ASoS?

Did you want the Others to attack in Dance? But the NW was in a bad place at the end of ASoS and were severly undermanned. So how were they supposed to defend themselves? Are the Wildlings not essential to the story at all? Stannis plotting with Jon to get the North to ally with him is important to the Bolton storyline.

Do you know something the other readers don't about the fall and destruction of the wall? How it happens and when in the story it's supposed to happen?

The simple answer is that Martin is telling his story. It's a huge, complicated story with a big list of characters, prophecies, myths, mysteries and various plots. Only he knows what is going to happen in what manner. It maybe that he needs to tell the story in a certain way for all the pieces to fall in the right way, for the characters to interact with each other at the right times, for the timing to be right for certain things to happen. It's not for you and me to dictate how he should write all this.

I can understand what you are saying. I certainly felt like AFfC was a waste of my time while others may enjoy reading it. Mainly because I feel that the story at the wall should start becoming more important and I thought Martin should have started shifting his focus there instead of spending it on the aftermath of the WOT5K. I thought Brienne wandering around was boring and not required. And Dany and Tyrion's chapters in Dance did drag, but I don't think we can rubbish the entire two books and say that they have nothing of importance except for a few instances where Dany flew on Drogon or Jon got stabbed. I personally thought that there was a lot of substance in Dance, especially the whole Northern storyline.

[Tagganaro]

-So the book is primarily about the fallout of ASOS with the wildlings. Not advancing the plot at all and deliberately delaying any entaglements with the Others even though they have yet to show up at all in this series.

Typically the book after the book before follows the book before. How can you complain about Jon's story being the fallout from the events that happened right before it? I mean I understand being pissed about AFFC not involving him, but that's sort of a different issue. And how can you dismiss EVERYTHING that happens at the Wall from not advancing the plot at all? There is a shitload going on at the Wall that changes the game.

-Another fake death is stupid and ridiculous. We need to be killing these characters off not keeping them alive and introducing new ones. Its an unneccesary and silly twist and it renders ASOS irrelevent because now Mances host has gotton past the wall with him now able to rejoin it again.

I'm not a fan of Jon's fake death I'll admit, but who is to say it won't have major ramifications for the future plot? And why does this render ASOS irrelevant? It still is hugely important in terms of Jon's character development and story arc, and it drives home the problem that the NW has forgotten about its true purpose/true enemies and it will probably bite them in the ass in the end.

- Stannis spends a ton of chapters at the wall doing nothing in ASOS, never mind ADWD and it takes him all this time just to get him to Winterfell. We then don't learn what the result of that battle is and it ends on another massive cliffhanger with Jon.

I definitely agree that the Battle for Winterfell should have been resolved. However Stannis at the Wall is all kinds of awesome and entertaining, and it seems most people agree with me on that. Him and Jon have a great rapport and it leads to a lot of awesome exchanges. It's also strategically important (stannis needs to develop one to win over mostly cautious, if not hostile Northern lords), plot-important (Jon gets further and further entangled with Stannis's cause despite his misgivings about it) and character-important.

-Seriously, cliffhangers like that are frustrating and maddening. No other series would get away with this. He and the editors clearly felt the need to keep up interest and hype by ending everything on a cliffhanger. It actually makes me sick just thinking about it.

Ok we get it, you don't like cliffhangers. I can agree, but that hardly makes everything preceding it irrelevant.

-Simply put, nothing happens and Martin manages to render ASOS resolution pointless in the process.

-All so Jon can learn to lead an organisation which has likely just condemned itself to destruction early in the next book

That's how stories work though. I mean I'm not sure I get the complaint. To say "nothing happens" is simply wrong, as well as saying it renders the ASOS resolution pointless in the process. It does not. It adds to it by showing an essentially screwed institution, which Jon is forced to run, and have Jon try and deal with it in the best way he knows how.

I am just curious here. What did you want Jon's story arc to be in ADwD after he becomes LC at the end ASoS?

Did you want the Others to attack in Dance? But the NW was in a bad place at the end of ASoS and were severly undermanned. So how were they supposed to defend themselves? Are the Wildlings not essential to the story at all? Stannis plotting with Jon to get the North to ally with him is important to the Bolton storyline.

Do you know something the other readers don't about the fall and destruction of the wall? How it happens and when in the story it's supposed to happen?

The simple answer is that Martin is telling his story. It's a huge, complicated story with a big list of characters, prophecies, myths, mysteries and various plots. Only he knows what is going to happen in what manner. It maybe that he needs to tell the story in a certain way for all the pieces to fall in the right way, for the characters to interact with each other at the right times, for the timing to be right for certain things to happen. It's not for you and me to dictate how he should write all this.

I can understand what you are saying. I certainly felt like AFfC was a waste of my time while others may enjoy reading it. Mainly because I feel that the story at the wall should start becoming more important and I thought Martin should have started shifting his focus there instead of spending it on the aftermath of the WOT5K. I thought Brienne wandering around was boring and not required. And Dany and Tyrion's chapters in Dance did drag, but I don't think we can rubbish the entire two books and say that they have nothing of importance except for a few instances where Dany flew on Drogon or Jon got stabbed. I personally thought that there was a lot of substance in Dance, especially the whole Northern storyline.

Basically This.

[Alester Florent]

Do you know something the other readers don't about the fall and destruction of the wall? How it happens and when in the story it's supposed to happen?

The simple answer is that Martin is telling his story. It's a huge, complicated story with a big list of characters, prophecies, myths, mysteries and various plots. Only he knows what is going to happen in what manner. It maybe that he needs to tell the story in a certain way for all the pieces to fall in the right way, for the characters to interact with each other at the right times, for the timing to be right for certain things to happen. It's not for you and me to dictate how he should write all this.

While I see what you're getting at, I also find this line of argument a little Panglossian. Just because he's telling his story doesn't mean he's necessarily telling it well. It's possible that the whole of both books were absolutely necessary for the telling of the story, but I think it's vanishingly unlikely that a lot of it couldn't have been changed or cut, even when we find out how the whole thing ends.

[total1402]

Typically the book after the book before follows the book before. How can you complain about Jon's story being the fallout from the events that happened right before it? I mean I understand being pissed about AFFC not involving him, but that's sort of a different issue. And how can you dismiss EVERYTHING that happens at the Wall from not advancing the plot at all? There is a shitload going on at the Wall that changes the game.

I'm not a fan of Jon's fake death I'll admit, but who is to say it won't have major ramifications for the future plot? And why does this render ASOS irrelevant? It still is hugely important in terms of Jon's character development and story arc, and it drives home the problem that the NW has forgotten about its true purpose/true enemies and it will probably bite them in the ass in the end.

I definitely agree that the Battle for Winterfell should have been resolved. However Stannis at the Wall is all kinds of awesome and entertaining, and it seems most people agree with me on that. Him and Jon have a great rapport and it leads to a lot of awesome exchanges. It's also strategically important (stannis needs to develop one to win over mostly cautious, if not hostile Northern lords), plot-important (Jon gets further and further entangled with Stannis's cause despite his misgivings about it) and character-important.

Ok we get it, you don't like cliffhangers. I can agree, but that hardly makes everything preceding it irrelevant.

That's how stories work though. I mean I'm not sure I get the complaint. To say "nothing happens" is simply wrong, as well as saying it renders the ASOS resolution pointless in the process. It does not. It adds to it by showing an essentially screwed institution, which Jon is forced to run, and have Jon try and deal with it in the best way he knows how.

Basically This.

I am refering to Mance Rayder still being alive as the fake death. ASOS and Stannis swooping in was, to me, about destroying the wildlings and Mance as a threat. Having him captured and then engineering events so we have Mance hidden and alive plus with his wildling horde still considerable on the other side of the wall essentially makes Stannis victory a bit mute. We need less characters. Not more.

ASOS is not ALL about fallout from ACOK. Gradually the story moves on and gains a life and identity of its own. This never happens in ADWD. Its all about what to do with the wildlings and ansawring that question takes hundreds of pages. Then, we do not even get to see the consequences of this action once it happens.

How? How does it change the game? We knew Stannis was with Jon. We knew wildlings were still out there. Until the very end this situation does not change. Its boring, trite and all just to establish that "Jon lets Tormund and co past the wall; his brothers kill him for this". This is after a 1500 pages and we do not get to see what the consequences are of this. I suspect that they will be dire for the Nights Watch as Jon was the only thing stopping Wildling, Stannites and brothers killing eachother. To me that seems the only logical conclusion to this unless weird shit happens; but I won't know for many years. That did not need all this material to set up this situation. I don't care for hundreds of repetitive scenarios that go over and over the same themes you just mentioned. If you don't provide any resolution then you as a writer have consciously wasted my time just to hype up your next book.

Yes it does make it entirely irrelevent. If you have a story which is blatently building and slowly evolving into several set piece events and character confrontations you render it all for nothing if you do not actually show what it was building up to. It is fucking pointless. I will have forgotton 90% of this garbage by the time WoW comes out with any luck.

@Dicer. I am dictating nothing to Martin. I never ask him to hurry up with the books for instance. Hes going to take his time I am resigned to that fact. I am merely complaining about how he went about AFFC and ADWD. Which I did not enjoy and therefore feel the need to express that vehement dislike. That is not the same as telling him how to write his series. I only refer back to how I felt about the first 3 books and that is the standard from which I judge the last two. They fall far short of it and add insult to injury. I do feel that if he continues to write like this that the series will suffer because if I didn't enjoy this style of writing with ADWD then I certainly won't enjoy it. Besides, since this isn't addressed personally to Martin and hes never going to read anything any of us write on this forum so I don't see how I could be said to be dictating anything to him. Its, kind of a silly notion really.

[Lady Blue Rose]

I did effectively I guess - just read all 5 books one after the other over 5-6 weeks. I think that's as close as you get without mixing it up that way? There's still a noticeable drop off after ASOS btw.

Right on point. Can't see how Dany's arc in ADWD can be considered good. Nothing against her character, just no progress in those books, and a fairly frustrating character portrait too.

I did the same thing. I started reading the five book bundle as a mega book over 5 weeks. Even then, I struggled through DwD in general. I would skip the Dany chapters and then force myself to read them back to back every 3rd or 4th dany chapter or so, or whenever I reached any other chapter that was tied to hers. Essos just became too much of the same... Dany saying, thinking and doing the same thing over and over.

I did not mind all the cliff hangers that much, maybe because I did not have to wait at all for the books.

What I did not like was that, after the long dragged-out chapters in Essos, I felt that all the characters outside of Westeros were left in the same, of what seems an endless loop. No closer to moving forward. All those searching for Dany might have reached Meereen, but Dany is no longer there....

As for Dany, she is right back where she started. She is facing another Kahl, cross the whole way back to Slavers' Bay, she has to reunite with two of her dragons, reconquer Slavers' Bay, regain control of her armies, is yet to acquire means to transport her army across to Westeros... I just absolutely lost interest in Dany and her story, even though she was one of my favorite characters.

I want Danny's story to pick-up when she is already landing in Westeros and only want to get snippets or flashbacks to those details of her crossing that are essential and absolutely necessary to the development of the main plot.

[Lady Blue Rose]

Yeah thats definetly my biggest gripe. Dany will only get to Westeros part way through the final book, we'll already have the Others invasion and reaction to Aegons reveal to contend with. We simply will not get the different character reactions and interactions.

In fact I actually felt really annoyed that AFFC seemed to be building up a WTF moment in Cersei's chapters about Dany invading; then its just casually revealed stated at the small council. I get that we need to see the small council more organised and capable because Varys throws a spanner in the works. However Martin seems to have just decided "okay, everybody knows now." and it makes all the other characters being in the dark for so long seem a little pointless if it wasn't going to lead to an OMG dragons moment. Its a bit like in Wheel of Time where Valda doesn't realise the Seanchan are bearing down on him and nor do the other whitecloaks despite repeat warnings. Usually this means the realization comes too late and I would have liked to have seen the look on Cersei face. But since time has moved on and its now common knowledge we aren't going to get that so I don't see why he bothered making Cersei oblivious.

Yes, I also thought the title A Dance with Dragons was kind of wasted in this book since the dragons are barely present throughout book. One is missing and the others locked-up. A DwD, for me, always foretold of a battle involving dragons. But, other than Dany riding Drogon, which was not a grand revelation moment since we'd known she would since they hatched, nothing of great importance happened where the dragons affected the main storyline.

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

I share your view (I love both books) but I have to agree that AFFC and ADWD are significantly inferior to the other books for the slow pacing and uneven quality between the chapters. But what I love and totally agree with you is the sheer number of details and expansive plot lines that got me hooked. I'm a fan of Dorne and Iron Island's chapters even though I can see most of these characters are not as well written as others. Theon's chapters in ADWD are IMO the best POVs in the whole series. However I'm not a fan (at all) of Mereen or the slave cities in general so I dragged in Dany's POVs more than ever in ADWD.

[Lord of Long Lake]

Hello Lord of Long Lake,

I am pleased to make your acquaintance! I am your long lost wife, it appears. :blushing: Do you like the sigil I designed for our castle?

Luckily, we will make a great couple because I agree with you. Each book is precious. Each one was perfect, to me. On re-reads, ADWD has become my favorite. Davos, Theon and Jon have the most riveting and satisfying story lines in the whole series in that book!

P.S. Let me know if our sharing a name upsets you. I made the name up while looking at a map of where I'd love to live. Long Lake has so many amenities! A big lake full of fish, pine tree forests surrounding it, beautiful mountains to the N/W and I'd be smack dab in the middle of an awesome triangle of cool neighbors- Stark, Glover and Umber:) But you chose it a year before I did so you are the first born. Let me know if you want me to change it.

This is great. Made my day.

That's the exact same reason I chose it. We're destined to be together! Same love of Long Lake, as well as the books.

I've got my castle situated up on the northern shore of the lake. I've even come up with a full back story including history, castle design, etc. for House Kellett, The Lords of Long Lake.

Keep the name my Lady. It would be ill of me to deprive you of the second most awesome name in Westeros. :)