Valyrian Spoon Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I've often wondered and speculated on similar threads that dragon steel could be dragon bone. We know that dragon bone bows exist perhaps blades can be fashioned too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Hats Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Or, maybe, Ned Dayne.Definitely what I think. I have said before, that I think Geord had big plans for that kid before abandoning the 5year gap. I think he was going to reappear as the new SOTM.,,,maybe he still will, but he is a bit young atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morienthar Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Maybe Valyrian steel is forged by dragon breathe ( it may be reason for westerosi not be able to forge Valyrian steel)But they can atleast reforge Valyrian steel.....i.e they can melt it down and make it into a sword again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daario's man Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 It's a good theory, but one thing makes me think it is wrong, when Sam tells Jon about dragon steel it seems to suggest that there are a number blades made from this material, surely if it were just Dawn the text would say Dawn, and if there were all these blades where have they all gone? I do not think it will be as simple as Valyrian steel but I do think there will be more than one dragon steel blade, if any at all show up.I do think however that Dawn could be Lightbringer as it seems to be the best sword there is and the fact that it came from a falling star could tie into the AA legend.I think it unlikely that the original Ice could be a twin to Dawn as I believe Dawn to be superior to Valyrian steel, why would the Starks trade there family blade for an inferior copy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost's Shadow Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I dont think Ned will grow up in time to be the next SotM. Darkstar is a total douchebag.If Dawn is the only surviving Dragonsteel sword left in the world, then the good guys are gonna have some issues.Those '2' books are going to have to move FAST to include a Darkstar stole Dawn chase, too... They've not even had a single thought about Dawn being it, so far (I think), and if they do understand it and it's not even in Starfall anymore... Pfft.Ideally Jon was going to have to pick it up (I'd like to see him there, see people's reaction to him), but that's just not going to happen.Is there any chance of Lightbringer being the same steel as Valyrian steel but because the spells were not invented yet the steel was weak, hence the need for the sacrifice of the wife to make it strong? Maybe the gods made it work because mankind had not invented the proper way to forge it yet.(I'm all for Lightbringer being Dawn, though. And I can't believe that after 5 books no one has even tested Valyrian steel against Others yet.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I've often wondered and speculated on similar threads that dragon steel could be dragon bone. We know that dragon bone bows exist perhaps blades can be fashioned too.The qualities that make dragonbone good for bows would make it terrible for blades, so it's effectively out as a candidate for "dragonsteel." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I agree that Dawn is Dragonsteel and was used against The Others, but I think it is Lightbringer and Azor Ahai have it to someone to take of in case The Others ever come back again. The Sword of the Morning and Dawn both sound like something connected to The Long Night. After The Long Night ended, dawn came again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Those '2' books are going to have to move FAST to include a Darkstar stole Dawn chase, too... They've not even had a single thought about Dawn being it, so far (I think), and if they do understand it and it's not even in Starfall anymore... Pfft.I've raised this possibility in several other threads. I'm very curious to know if we'll see exactly how Swords of the Morning are chosen. With the depletion of the Dayne family and their very low-profile role in the story so far, it doesn't seem like there's a council of wise old Daynes waiting to assess candidates anywhere. Perhaps the sword itself chooses, although that would be a level of magic unseen to this point in the books. Is there a way the sword could deny "consent" to Darkstar if/when he attempts to wield it?Is there any chance of Lightbringer being the same steel as Valyrian steel but because the spells were not invented yet the steel was weak, hence the need for the sacrifice of the wife to make it strong? Maybe the gods made it work because mankind had not invented the proper way to forge it yet.I don't think we're dealing with a story where there are gods who receive sacrifice and grant boons in return. I've suggested that the techniques and spells to make spellforged steel could have been pioneered elsewhere in the world prior to the rise of Valyria. Asshai would seem to be the leading candidate for reasons I've mentioned earlier in the thread.We're given no information about the grain of the material in Dawn's blade. What we know is that it's described as white, "pale as milkglass" and alive with light in Ned's recollection. This is a very different description from Valyrian steel, which has telltale signs of the forging techniques used to create it. Neither Darkstar nor Edric Dayne comment in any great detail on the sword, except to confirm general qualities that we've heard about elsewhere. This suggests that they are either so familiar with the weapon that other properties are mundane or common knowledge, or that they do not have access to the sword when they are at Starfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbstark Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I've raised this possibility in several other threads. I'm very curious to know if we'll see exactly how Swords of the Morning are chosen. With the depletion of the Dayne family and their very low-profile role in the story so far, it doesn't seem like there's a council of wise old Daynes waiting to assess candidates anywhere. Perhaps the sword itself chooses, although that would be a level of magic unseen to this point in the books. Is there a way the sword could deny "consent" to Darkstar if/when he attempts to wield it?Sevumar, do you think it must be a Dayne to truly be able to wield the power of Dawn? Could this be some sort of family trait, like we associate Starks+ past and present wargs, Reeds + past/present greenseers, and Targs + past (and debatable present) dragonlords/binders....I'm interested to what extent magic and prophecies play a role in the lives of members of certain families with a known magical past, and to what extent it is individual characters, like Jon, Arya and Dany, distinguishing themselves as individuals. If this is true, then the Daynes' mystery and magic is manifesting iteself through the wielding of the true power of Dawn. However, obviously not all Daynes are able to wield this power, so in a sense being a descendant of house Dayne is necessary but not sufficient to be "the chosen one for Dawn"Because Darkstar carries himself as if he's something special, but I don't believe that, he's not, he's just a guy.Maybe there have been some Daynes in the past with special skills, or even chosen by fate (or what have you) to have some of this magical ability, but not necessarily all Daynes are.ETA: sorry for the digression, I just want to know how the magic of Dawn is actually related to the Daynes and if we can even speculate aboiut this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nirolo Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I have a question:Which came first, dragons or dragonglass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I have a question:Which came first, dragons or dragonglass?Dragons were said to be discovered some 5 thousand years ago. The COTF gave Dragonglass daggers to the NW during the Age of Heroes, around 10 thousand years ago. So Dragonglass could be the one discovered first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nirolo Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Dragons were said to be discovered some 5 thousand years ago.The COTF gave Dragonglass daggers to the NW during the Age of Heroes, around 10 thousand years ago. So Dragonglass could be the one discovered first.Aye, I have read that too.So do we know when people started calling obsidian dragonglass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Aye, I have read that too.So do we know when people started calling obsidian dragonglass?Well seeing as they didn't know what dragons were back then, I imagine they called it another name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nirolo Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Well seeing as they didn't know what dragons were back then, I imagine they called it another name.probably just obsidian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 probably just obsidian.I think the Maesters first called it obsidian, so that would have been thousands of years after the Fist Men started using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nirolo Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I think the Maesters first called it obsidian so that would have been thousands of years after the Fist Men started using it.Is there a quote for this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Is there a quote for this?Can't find one currently in the books but in the TV series Sam says "the Maesters call it obsidian". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nirolo Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Can't find one currently in the books but in the TV series Sam says "the Maesters call it obsidian".Maybe the maesters simply recorded the original name they heard and started calling it that themselves. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Maybe the maesters simply recorded the original name they heard and started calling it that themselves. :dunno:I think they'd give a more educated name, if you can say that, rather than calling it something the COTF and First Men call it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis Eats No Peaches Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 So where did the rest of the dragonsteel swords go? Dawn is unique as far as we know, otherwise it wouldn't be so famous. It's possible I guess but I don't quite buy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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