U.S. Politics - the end of summer edition

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Commodore - You misunderstand me, probably intentionally. I meant it is standard for companies to offer insurance to the spouse only when that spouse is not eligible for insurance through his/her own employer. Obamacare makes more businesses provide insurance, hence some spouses who previously could not get insurance through their own employer now can.

[The Progressive]

Errr so this is getting weird ..... manning want to have a sex change and become chelsea after is sentencing was announced yesterday.

http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=national&url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57599677/bradley-manning-i-want-to-live-as-a-woman-named-chelsea/&feed_id=1&videoid=37&catid=57599677

[awesome possum]

I'm not sure how its weird, as there are several pictures of him dressed as a woman. The only weird - and its more sad and pathetic than weird - is how the government released pictures of him dressed as a woman almost as an attempt to discredit him.

[Fez]

Errr so this is getting weird ..... manning want to have a sex change and become chelsea after is sentencing was announced yesterday.

http://m.cbsnews.com...&catid=57599677

Strange timing perhaps, but back when the story first broke it was pretty widely reported that he had gender identity issues. Some really shitty Fox News heads suggested that it was anger stemming from that, that led to him "lashing out" by releasing all those documents.

[Stag Country]

Commodore - You misunderstand me, probably intentionally. I meant it is standard for companies to offer insurance to the spouse only when that spouse is not eligible for insurance through his/her own employer. Obamacare makes more businesses provide insurance, hence some spouses who previously could not get insurance through their own employer now can.

You're asking about a standard that doesn't exist. There is no standard when it comes to employer provided insurance. Each company and the insurance policies they carry are unique to those companies. Some will cover spouses, others will not cover spouses who qualify elsewhere. As for companies making changes for Obamacare, why would anyone be surprised by that? If the government comes up with regulations that will cost companies money, they will find a way to pass that cost on. You can call it greedy, I would call it prudent.

I'm not sure how its weird, as there are several pictures of him dressed as a woman. The only weird - and its more sad and pathetic than weird - is how the government released pictures of him dressed as a woman almost as an attempt to discredit him.

Only sad thing about this is that we the tax payers are going to be footing the bill for him to undergo "hormone therapy" while he is doing 35 to life.

[TerraPrime]

Only sad thing about this is that we the tax payers are going to be footing the bill for him to undergo "hormone therapy" while he is doing 35 to life.

Why is it a sad thing to provide necessary medical treatment for the prisoners?

[Frog Eater]

Why is it a sad thing to provide necessary medical treatment for the prisoners?

hormone therapy is not a necessary medical treatment

[Stag Country]

Why is it a sad thing to provide necessary medical treatment for the prisoners?

It's an elective treatment not a medical necessity. Following this logic, you would be ok for tax payers footing the bill for a female prisoner that decides she wants brest implants or a male prisoner deciding he would want his junk enlarged?

[The Progressive]

It sure would be unprecedented. I think that up to this point, federal prisons do not provide hormone therapy or sex-reassignment surgery for gender identity disorder.

[Liffguard]

It's an elective treatment not a medical necessity. Following this logic, you would be ok for tax payers footing the bill for a female prisoner that decides she wants brest implants or a male prisoner deciding he would want his junk enlarged?

The question as to what extent gender reassignment procedures are medically necessary is a legitimate one but this is absolutely not equivalent at all.

[Stag Country]

It sure would be unprecedented. I think that up to this point, federal prisons do not provide hormone therapy or sex-reassignment surgery for gender identity disorder.

It's not. It's actually been ruled on in courts before. With some lunatic judge deciding that it was a violation of the 8th amendment to withhold the reassignment surgery and the treatment. Needless to say I think that Judge was an idiot.

Here is a bit more on Manning's request:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/08/22/manning-wants-hormone-therapy-in-prison-will-it-happen/

The question as to what extent gender reassignment procedures are medically necessary is a legitimate one but this is absolutely not equivalent at all.

Not really sure how you can argue they are different. They are exactly the same; it is fundamentally about altering the look of the person involved. It's patently absurd for tax payers to be on the hook for expensive surgery for these inmates because they need feel trapped in the wrong gender.

[Fez]

It sure would be unprecedented. I think that up to this point, federal prisons do not provide hormone therapy or sex-reassignment surgery for gender identity disorder.

Actually its not unprecedented, at least for federal prisons in general. For a while now, US Bureau of Prisons' prisons (so not military prisons) have provided hormone therapy to inmates who were receiving such therapy prior to incarceration. Recently, they changed that policy and provide it to any inmate after assessments and evaluation.

[TerraPrime]

hormone therapy is not a necessary medical treatment

So how do you explain the prescription of hormone replacement form doctors? Are they prescribing drugs for reasons other than what is medically needed?

Re: Stag Country

It's an elective treatment not a medical necessity. Following this logic, you would be ok for tax payers footing the bill for a female prisoner that decides she wants brest implants or a male prisoner deciding he would want his junk enlarged?

That is not even close to what gender reassignment and hormone replacement treatment means to transsexual and transgender people.

[Stag Country]

So how do you explain the prescription of hormone replacement form doctors? Are they prescribing drugs for reasons other than what is medically needed?

The doctor's prescription of treatments and drugs to a patient to reach their desired outcome is not an indication that the treatment or the drugs were necessary in the first place.

That is not even close to what gender reassignment and hormone replacement treatment means to transsexual and transgender people.

I don't care what it means that group of people (Off Topic question: why would you use those labels as two seperate groups?).

Bradley Manning entered prison as a man, the fact that he has identity issues is not my concern nor should it be. Nor should it be my responsibility as a tax payer to help subsidize his elective procedure because he doesn't like who he is. He's not dying of cancer, he isn't suffering from some virus (that I know of) that requires treatment. He just wants to be a woman. Something he had his entire life to sort out, by the way.

[TerraPrime]

The doctor's prescription of treatments and drugs to a patient to reach their desired outcome is not an indication that the treatment or the drugs were necessary in the first place.

Can you tell us what you know of the steps leading to gender reassignment surgery? I'd not want to presume that you know nothing of it, but your response here leaves room for doubt on this matter.

I don't care what it means that group of people

Yes, that much is clear. But thanks for re-affirming that, anyway.

(Off Topic question: why would you use those labels as two seperate groups?).

Word usage varies, but the reason why I like both transsexual and transgender is that it helps distinguish people who seek to conform to the established binary sex identity (male or female) from those who wishes to blur the line completely. I see more now that people use the term genderqueer to mean what I think is transgender, and they apply the term transgender to mean what I think is transsexual. It seems more and more trans* people are adopting the transgender identity, so that's probably the best way forward unless you have some other reasons.

Bradley Manning entered prison as a man, the fact that he has identity issues is not my concern nor should it be. Nor should it be my responsibility as a tax payer to help subsidize his elective procedure because he doesn't like who he is. He's not dying of cancer, he isn't suffering from some virus (that I know of) that requires treatment. He just wants to be a woman.

First, evidence would suggest that Chelsea has already started identifying as a woman prior to her imprisonment. So your first sentence is dubious.

Second, do you oppose giving drugs in all other non life-threatening conditions, then? Like perhaps chronic arthritis? Irritable bowel syndromes?

Something he had his entire life to sort out, by the way.

I suspect that she has already sorted it out, given her decision to announce to the world at large her desire to complete the transitioning process.

[Seli]

...

Bradley Manning entered prison as a man, the fact that he has identity issues is not my concern nor should it be. Nor should it be my responsibility as a tax payer to help subsidize his elective procedure because he doesn't like who he is. He's not dying of cancer, he isn't suffering from some virus (that I know of) that requires treatment. He just wants to be a woman. Something he had his entire life to sort out, by the way.

Not really, Manning was born and entered prison as a woman. Whether she should get treatment is for the prison system and courts to decide.

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

http://topinfopost.com/2013/06/23/child-pornography-in-us-pentagon

First I'm hearing about this...5200 Pentagon Employees bought child porn.

[Fez]

http://topinfopost.c...-in-us-pentagon

First I'm hearing about this...5200 Pentagon Employees bought child porn.

How many of these employees had security clearances? Because that's the only number that should be embarrassing to the Pentagon. The Pentagon/DOD has 3.23 million civilian and military employees (2.13 million excluding reserverists), and a 0.16% (or 0.24%) rate of child porn usage is, sadly, probably about the same as the general population (I'd look it up, but I don't want the words 'child porn' showing up anywhere in my google search history).

[Stag Country]

Not really, Manning was born and entered prison as a woman. Whether she should get treatment is for the prison system and courts to decide.

Manning was born a man and entered prison as a man. The fact that he has psychological issues that result in him not agreeing with this reality doesn't change the fact that he is biologically a male.

Can you tell us what you know of the steps leading to gender reassignment surgery? I'd not want to presume that you know nothing of it, but your response here leaves room for doubt on this matter.

Are you actually trying to debate that gender reassignment surgery is not an elective procedure?

Yes, that much is clear. But thanks for re-affirming that, anyway.

Oh, grow up. The fact that someone thinks a surgery is a medical necessity because they want it, doesn't actually make it so. Gender reassignment is entirely elective and is no more necessary than face lifts (or any other augmentation surgery) are in people who are compulsively driven to look "more beautiful".

First, evidence would suggest that Chelsea has already started identifying as a woman prior to her imprisonment. So your first sentence is dubious.

Second, do you oppose giving drugs in all other non life-threatening conditions, then? Like perhaps chronic arthritis? Irritable bowel syndromes?

It doesn't matter if he identified himself as something else or not. He is 25 years old, he had literally his entire life to go forward with such a decision....but curiously waits until after he is sentenced to 35 years in federal prison to make this decision.

And no, I don't oppose dispensing drugs for arthritis or IBS (no idea why you are adding the criteria that an illness be life threatening here) those are actually illnesses and the treatments are medically necessary. Gender Reassignment surgery and hormone therapy are elective procedures that are not necessary to keep an individual healthy.

[Frog Eater]

Not really, Manning was born and entered prison as a woman. Whether she should get treatment is for the prison system and courts to decide.

no. He was born a man, entered the military as a man, has now entered prison as a man, and whatever he does from there is on him.