GinesthoiOfIce Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 ...or been ugly, what would Westeros have been like ? Lyanna Stark, "The Helen of Troy of Westeros" 's existence and beauty has been the cathalyst for most of the events that led to AGOT. Had she not been born, or been ugly, what do you think would have been the implications for Westeros ? What do you think would have been likely to happen, given the informations we have ? Do you think Rhaegar would have chosen the willing-to-marry-him Cersei as his second wife ?Do you think the twincest woud have been avoided, with Jaime possibly marrying Lysa Tully ?Would Robert have had any reason to rebel, and Rickard and Brandon Stark been involved and dying in the process ?Would then a Lannister-Targaryen alliance have led Rhaegar to depose his father ? So many things are intricately induced by Robert's rebellion and therefore Lyanna, and of course this influenced the lives of almost every character indirectly. What are your thoughts ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kienn Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I guess Rhaegar would have gone after Benjen to make the glorious Song of Ice and Fire. Or just dealt with an ugly Lyanna, turn the lights off of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahura Mazda Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 ...or been ugly, what would Westeros have been like ? Lyanna Stark, "The Helen of Troy of Westeros" 's existence and beauty has been the cathalyst for most of the events that led to AGOT. Had she not been born, or been ugly, what do you think would have been the implications for Westeros ? What do you think would have been likely to happen, given the informations we have ? [...] What are your thoughts ? The myth of Helen of Troy is undoubtedly romantic and all, but in my humble opinion wars like innovation are not the by-product of single events or single extraordinary talented guys without which society fails to move on. I support the Actor Network Theory as exposed by Bruno Latour, therefore in my way to read events, these wars have occurred for a greater number of reasons, a greater number of coinciding interests, actions and relations already setting up the stage for the bloodshed regardless of Lyanna or not. She has been a linchpin in this case but the network would have ended up with another trigger - another person or event - for such a war in any case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Dayne's Honor Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Rhaegar would have taken one for the 7K team and put a bag over her head and played through the "pain". There must be sacrifices for The Song of Ice and Fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 She didn't exist. It's fiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beorn Snow Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Would Robert have been betrothed to Lysa then? That´d probably be a good thing, someone would finally smash littlefinger´s skull in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywin Manderly Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Rhaegar would have taken one for the 7K team and put a bag over her head and played through the "pain". There must be sacrifices for The Song of Ice and Fire. :agree: And wasn't she born he would have probably have grabbed a Karstark girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I don't believe that she was the-most-beautiful-woman-on-GRRTH in order to be Helen of Sparta. I think that she was like a normal woman on Venus drug,if anyone gets what I mean. Rhaegar would have taken one for the 7K team and put a bag over her head and played through the "pain". There must be sacrifices for The Song of Ice and Fire. :lmao: "The things I do for the song of Ice and Fire" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinesthoiOfIce Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Would Robert have been betrothed to Lysa then? That´d probably be a good thing, someone would finally smash littlefinger´s skull in. It's possible yes, Lysa would, I believe have been either with Jaime or Robert. What obviously would have made her far happier, and possibly would have avoided the chaos Littlefinger throve on ! I'm not honestly very familiar with the R+L=J and the reasoning behind Rhaegar choosing Lyanna, but did he really "take" Lyanna just because of her Stark origin and her entitlement to be the Ice of the song ? Surely her beauty helped too. Rhaegar surely was not insensible and involved himself more willingly because of it. Anyway I think it quite impressive to see the tremendous butterfly effect Lyanna's existence and beauty has had : She was highborn, of the North and beautiful and surely had the three of them not been united, the result would have been different. A Karstark wouldn't have had as much influence for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Dayne's Honor Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I don't believe that she was the-most-beautiful-woman-on-GRRTH in order to be Helen of Sparta. I think that she was like a normal woman of Venus drug,if anyone gets what I mean. :lmao: "The things I do for the song of Ice and Fire":rofl: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TepidHands Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 The twincest started before all that. Cersei would have still visited the Maegi. And Aerys would have still been batshit crazy. Rhaegar wuold have probably run off with Ashara Dayne. Hell, she might have been a backup anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinesthoiOfIce Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 The twincest started before all that. Cersei would have still visited the Maegi. And Aerys would have still been batshit crazy. The twincest began earlier, I know, before even the birth of Tyrion since Joanna saw them. Yet I believe that had Cersei been married to Rhaegar, she would perhaps have dropped Jaime for the more handsome Rhaegar according to Cersei herself. The Maegi, if she indeed had real prophecy powers, would have seen what would have happened to Cersei without Lyanna in her way. For Cersei anyway Lyanna's non-existence would have been profitable : Rhaegar could have settled for her and if not, Robert himself could have Fallen for her. As for Aerys, He would indeed still have been crazy, but Rhaegar would perhaps have managed to depose him as many in this forum believe he wanted to do. Perhaps without Robert's rebellion, Rickard and Brandon Stark would not have died (Which would imply no Nedlyn or whatever Ned/Catelyn Relationship is called, so above Jon's non-existence if R+L=J, the Stark kids as we know them wouldn't have been born too...). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djinn Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 There would be a very different story since the Lyanna-Robert engagement was the link of the Baratheons to the alliance. Even if Rhaegar went for some other Northern girl, it wouldn't tick off Brandon nor rouse the entire North, and Robert wouldn't care. A ''stolen'' bride and a death sentence wasn't enough for all Stormlords back Robert, threatened wards wasn't enough for all Valelords nor a marriage pact was enough for all the Riverlords, but the ''kidnapping'' of the highest ranking woman in the North was. Kidnapping Ashara, for example, wouldn't stirred Dorne into rebellion because only the Daynes(and those closest to them) would actually care. Notice that Elia's rape and murder are always mentioned but nobody cares about the scores of low rank women victimized durring the sack of KL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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