markg171 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 "Father, I am sorry," Cersei said, when the door was shut. "Joff has always been willful, I did warn you . . . " "There is a long league's worth of difference between willful and stupid. 'A strong king acts boldly?' Who told him that?" "Not me, I promise you," said Cersei. "Most like it was something he heard Robert say . . . " "The part about you hiding under Casterly Rock does sound like Robert." Tyrion didn't want Lord Tywin forgetting that bit. "Yes, I recall now," Cersei said, "Robert often told Joff that a king must be bold." "And what were you telling him, pray? I did not fight a war to seat Robert the Second on the Iron Throne. You gave me to understand the boy cared nothing for his father." "Why would he? Robert ignored him. He would have beat him if I'd allowed it. That brute you made me marry once hit the boy so hard he knocked out two of his baby teeth, over some mischief with a cat. I told him I'd kill him in his sleep if he ever did it again, and he never did, but sometimes he would say things . . . " "It appears things needed to be said." Lord Tywin waved two fingers at her, a brusque dismissal. "Go." The incident with the cat is of course: Once after learning a kitchen cat was pregnant, Joffrey killed the animal and cut open its belly to see the kittens inside. He showed one of the unborn kittens to his father. Robert was so shocked and angry he hit the boy so hard it knocked out two of his baby teeth. Robert we're told showed mostly indifference to his kids, and didn't really look after his bastards (though if he didn't know about them, that's not really something he could control). But we see with Joffrey at least, that Cersei is the one who wouldn't let Robert teach him lessons, even though they needed to be taught. So was Robert really a bad parent? Or was he simply not allowed to be a parent by his wife? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Lee knot Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was a bad parent but not terrible. He didn't care much about disciplining his children but he didn't treat them bad either. Joffrey was bent in the mind. A real messed up motherfucker but it wasn't Robert's fault. Myrcella and Tommen are pretty normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was an absentee parent. From what we hear of Robert with Mya or with Edric on his visits to Storms End, he knew how t be a good parent, but mostly... he wasn't around. Also, Joff did a horifically evil thing, but he probably hit him to hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markg171 Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was an absentee parent. From what we hear of Robert with Mya or with Edric on his visits to Storms End, he knew how t be a good parent, but mostly... he wasn't around. Also, Joff did a horifically evil thing, but he probably hit him to hard. IIRC there was also a bastard that he wanted to bring to court and raise, but Cersei wouldn't let him otherwise she'd have the kid killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Cersei had a problem with Robert whoring. He did it anyway,Cersei had a problem with Robert physically abusing her. He did it anyway.Cersei had a problem with Robert being a responsible parent... He did--- ah, no. THERE he blamed it on her... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonardo Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was an absentee parent. From what we hear of Robert with Mya or with Edric on his visits to Storms End, he knew how t be a good parent, but mostly... he wasn't around. Also, Joff did a horifically evil thing, but he probably hit him to hard. Yet Ned and Robert were both sent off to foster with Jon Arryn and neither really raised by their biological fathers so you could call both of their sires absentee to a point along with most of Westeros. In Westeros it seems a bit abnormal in some ways for a parent to teach their children when they're I agree with you actually on this, but I don't think Robert was necessarily given the best examples to go by either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonardo Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Cersei had a problem with Robert whoring. He did it anyway, Cersei had a problem with Robert physically abusing her. He did it anyway. Cersei had a problem with Robert being a responsible parent... He did--- ah, no. THERE he blamed it on her... Cersei didn't give two shits about Robert whoring though That was the time she spent fondling her brother :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axell Redhand Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was probably a very normal 'medieval' father - at least for the upper class. Medieval highborn men didn't spend lots of time with their children. Hell, that's a common theme even up until modern times. The fact that he hit Joff for doing something horrifying is a non-issue. It doesn't mean he was a bad father, nor does it mean he was really making a strong effort to instill values and discipline in his child. I don't think, beyond that, we really know enough about Robert as a parent to make any judgement whatsoever. But from what text we have -- he wasn't bad, he wasn't great - he was normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert's not the worst parent, but that's not saying much. He was pretty bad though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Cersei had a problem with Robert whoring. He did it anyway, Cersei had a problem with Robert physically abusing her. He did it anyway. Cersei had a problem with Robert being a responsible parent... He did--- ah, no. THERE he blamed it on her... Well if we look at Roberts other kids... Mya, Bella, Edric and Gendry, they're all petty good kids.. I think we're meant to believe that the incest caused it, so yes... it was Cersei's fault. Not Roberts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimJames Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was an ok parent. He may have been distant, but he was never abusive like Tywin or Craster (rule one of parenting: see what Craster is doing? Do not do that!). Now obviously "don't be Craster" is setting the parental bar too low, so let's examine Robert's parenting in depth. Joffery turned out to be an evil monster, but that is mostly Cersei's fault. As for Tommen and Myrcella, they both are sweet little angels. This means that Robert trusted people in his court to take care of his children while he was busy ruling a kingdom, and the ones who weren't Cersei did a good job.As for his bastards, he didn't neglect them. It is stated that Varys sent Edric Storm a birthday present every year on Robert's behalf. It is clear that Robert entrusted Varys with looking after all his bastards, and that Varys did this very well (even including the bastards Robert doesn't know about). Robert even wanted to bring Mya Stone to court, and probably would played a bigger part in his bastards lives have had Cersei not threatened to murder them (he should have divorced her right about then). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
golden_eyes Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Before he died Robert told Ned that he thought something was disturbingly wrong with Joffery and wasn't comfortable leaving the country with him. He also said that he never felt the connection with Joffery, Myrcella and Tommen that he felt with Mya Stone and his other bastards leading him to wonder if they were really his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olenna123 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 He was pretty bad. I don't understand people blaming Cersei for Joffrey's behavior but giving Robert a pass for his neglect. Is it cause they wanna blame everything on her? Or because they hold women to different santards than men? Myrcella and Tommen turned out ok so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markg171 Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 Robert was probably a very normal 'medieval' father - at least for the upper class. Medieval highborn men didn't spend lots of time with their children. Hell, that's a common theme even up until modern times. The fact that he hit Joff for doing something horrifying is a non-issue. It doesn't mean he was a bad father, nor does it mean he was really making a strong effort to instill values and discipline in his child. I don't think, beyond that, we really know enough about Robert as a parent to make any judgement whatsoever. But from what text we have -- he wasn't bad, he wasn't great - he was normal. If anybody showed their parent that they killed a cat and its unborn kittens, they'd have been hit too. The fact that Joffrey did this when he was still a kid, indicates that Robert hit him while he was still in his prime seeing as it's not until after the Greyjoy Rebellion that he becomes fat. I'd think a guy like Robert would have killed Joffrey if he hit him as hard as he could while Joffrey was still a child. So Robert actually held back when he hit Joffrey. But the point of showcasing Robert's hitting of Joffrey was just to add onto Tywin's quote that things needed to be said to Joffrey while he was growing up. When Joffrey did something wrong, Robert corrected him. When Cersei heard about it, she told him she'd kill him if he ever did it again. Cersei never let Robert try and be a parent to Joffrey. Cersei's the one who let him get out of control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markg171 Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 He was pretty bad. I don't understand people blaming Cersei for Joffrey's behavior but giving Robert a pass for his neglect. Is it cause they wanna blame everything on her? Or because they hold women to different santards than men? Myrcella and Tommen turned out ok so... We're never told that Cersei actively stopped Robert from playing a role in their upbringing. We know that she did with Joffrey. It's pretty simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 He was pretty bad. I don't understand people blaming Cersei for Joffrey's behavior but giving Robert a pass for his neglect. Is it cause they wanna blame everything on her? Or because they hold women to different santards than men? Myrcella and Tommen turned out ok so... Robert wasn't involved in the lives of most of his children, but they weren't cutting open pregnant cats when they were barely out of diapers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olenna123 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We're never told that Cersei actively stopped Robert from playing a role in their upbringing. We know that she did with Joffrey. It's pretty simple. I don't think it's as simple as you make it out to be. Joffrey seemed to had some serious issues that none of his siblings ever had. And again Joffrey and Tomen and Myrcella were raised by Cersei and when one of them goes wrong it's Cersei's fault but when the other two turned out normally it's cause of Robert's supposed good influence in their lives? Seems pretty unfair to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markg171 Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 I don't think it's as simple as you make it out to be. Joffrey seemed to had some serious issues that none of his siblings ever had. And again Joffrey and Tomen and Myrcella were raised by Cersei and when one of them goes wrong it's Cersei's fault but when the other two turned out normally it's cause of Robert's supposed good influence in their lives? Seems pretty unfair to me. Nothing says that Myrcella and Tommen were raised solely by Cersei. We do however know that Joffrey for sure was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 I don't think Robert was very involved in Tommen and Myrcellas lives, but I really want to see what they think of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgottenKnight Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 We really don't see him do much "parenting". Hard to say. Maybe if he an Cersei didn't hate each other, Joff might have had a chance to be decent. Seeing as he is the first born and the practice kid, we see him the most messed up by getting the worst of both. Spoiled coddling from Cersei and hard force from Robert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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