The Blood Betrayal

[Lord Martin]

I have finally finished the world book and lots of fascinating angles have been discussed here at length. But one particular excerpt caught my attention and its sparked myriad theories in my mind. I wanted to get the discussion going on these issues.

The key piece of text was this:

When the daughter of the Opal Emperor succeeded him as the Amethyst Empress, her envious younger brother cast her down and slew her, proclaiming himself the Bloodstone Emperor and beginning a reign of terror. He practiced dark arts, torture, and necromancy, enslaved his people, took a tiger-woman for his bride, feasted on human flesh, and cast down the true gods to worship a black stone that had fallen from the sky. (Many scholars count the Bloodstone Emperor as the first High Priest of the sinister Church of Starry Wisdom, which persists to this day in many port cities throughout the known world).

In the annals of the Further East, it was the Blood Betrayal, as his usurpation is named, that ushered in the age of darkness called the Long Night. Despairing of the evil that had been unleashed on earth, the Maiden-Made-of-Light turned her back upon the world, and the Lion of Night came forth in all his wroth to punish the wickedness of men

There's a lot to work with here:

First, I'll note the "black stone that had fallen from the sky." This reminds me of several stories we've heard before most notably the origins of House Dayne. As far as I know, these are the only two "follow the star" stories we have in ASOIAF (other than some passing references to following the tail of the Ice Dragon and other constellations)

Second, I note that the "Blood Betrayal" was rumored to usher in the Long Night. This got me wondering if there is a Westerosi Blood Betrayal at the start of the Long Night? Given the myriad theories out there (many mine own) I think we could all think of many such potential betrayals.

These two facts brought me full circle to the bizarre connections between the Daynes and the Starks. I fully admit that I initially rejected any notion that the Daynes played a major role in the Battle for the Dawn during the Long Night. I was probably wrong.

So one of my musings (I won't yet call it a theory) is that one potential cause for the return of the Others is the death of Arthur Dayne at the hands of Eddard Stark. If there is a distant blood relation between Stark and Dayne, coupled with some sort of magic relationship that goes back to the end of the Long Night, this musing gains some traction. I'd like to play out a deeper theory later, so any input on this is welcomed.

I also noticed that the myth refers to the Maiden Made of Light and the Lion of Night. The parallels to both the Lord of Light and the Female Other who ensorcered the Night's King comes to mind. I have slowly come to the opinion that the "Great Other" is actually the companion (bride if you will) of the Lord of Light. The concept of male/female duality permeates the series at all times. So the Lion of Night is to the Maiden Made of Light as the Great Other is to the Lord of Light.

This dualism continues to play out: e.g. Black Stone vs. Starfall, male vs. female. It also just occurred to me that "black stone fallen from the sky" = Dark Star....I am not a big fan of the Darkstar playing a key role in supernatural events... but I doubt this is a coincidence.

And to further the Night's King parallel... the Night's King fell in love with a non-human female. The Bloodstone Emperor did similar by marrying a "tiger-woman." I am not entirely sure what a tiger-woman is. If I had to theorize, the world book tells us explicitly that Valyrians use blood magic to interbreed humans and animals after the 4th Ghiscari War. The book also tells us about the proto-Valyrians (probably from Asshai) who bred Wyvers and Fire Wyrms with blood magic to create dragons. Perhaps these same proto-Valyrians conducted similar experiments (I am starting to wonder if this is where Squishers, the Farwynds or even all the Iron Born came from... not to mention the First First Men in Oldtown who built the base of the High Tower).

A secondary thing I noticed in this tale is that the family line goes from Opal to Amethyst to Bloodstone... or white to purple to red. All three of those colors play major thematic roles in the series.

So what do people think?

Is a Blood Betrayal at the root cause of the Long Night? Is this why kin-slaying is so taboo?

Are there parallels between the Lord of Light, the Maiden Made of Light, the Night Lion and the Great Other?

What is the reason for the falling star theme?

Feels good to post again, its been a while!

[aryagonnakill#2]

I've started to think that Yeen, Moat Cailin, and the 5 forts were built by the squishers/Deep ones, and that they had some kind of war with the proto Valyrians that wiped them both out and resulted in the distorted seasons due to blood magic.

However blood treason could also point to a long held theory that an angry branch of the cotf created the White Walkers using blood magic.

[Lord Martin]

I am also wondering about the red comet now as well.

The only other two comets or shooting stars we get are the two mentioned above, Dayne's Star and the Bloodstone Emperor's Dark Star.... what is the significance of the red star vis-a-vi these two stars?

[Lord_Pepsi_Cupps]

Hey OP, good post - yes it seems we are definitely meant to be speculating on the connections between all the various "Long Night" stories (the Rhoynar have a great one, which helpfully also features specific mention of winter, as the Rhoyne froze).

The Night King didn't marry an Other, he married a "woman" that's variously described as his "corpse bride" or with "skin pale as milk" yadda yadda yadda. She has a connection with the Others, but she's likely not the same Other like we see in the Prologue to GoT and that Sam slays. Firstly, there's strong hints that the Others don't have females, and that's why they take Craster's sons (I'm not talking about the TV show here). Secondly, Old Nan mentions that the Others "bred" with human women to create hybrids. The Night King's queen is likely one of those half-Other / half-human hybrids. Check out the Radio Westeros podcast on the Long Night, it's very well explained.

It's also likely that the Night's King was a Stark, and it's said that he "gave his seed" to his corpse bride, which may indicate they actually had children. Could the present-day Stark line go back to those kids, giving the Starks a bit of "Other blood".

This does work nicely with the parallel against the Targs (who have dragon blood), but also gives the Starks a contrast with the Daynes (who are not Valyrian, but somehow do have those purple eyes).

"There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" may have been part of some pact or some magic that keeps the Others at bay (or the Long Night at bay). In ADWD, the huge snowstorm seems to start after Ramsay declares himself "the trueborn Lord of Winterfell" at his wedding - symbolically breaking or at least challenging the surviving Starks' claim to lordship over Winterfell. If winter has (finally) come because there is no longer a Stark in Winterfell, that begs the question of what it is about the Starks that was so special. The "ice" in their blood may have been that thing (again, check out Radio Westeros).

The Yitish version of the Long Night is curious because it could be a retellings of the Westerosi Long Night (with culturally relevant changes) or it could have been a separate event. I suspect that the mention of the "tiger woman" suggests that it was a modified retelling of the Westerosi story. "Tiger people" (whoever they were - perhaps a Valyrian genetic experiment) sound like they were the great foe of the early Yitish, the same way that the Others were in Westeros; BUT there's nothing to suggest that a "tiger woman" has anything to do with winter, while the Others clearly do; the Long Night is connected with winter numerous times, suggesting that the Others are the "real story" and the "tiger woman" story is a culturally relevant modification.

It may also be a simple mistranslation: perhaps for the Yitish "tiger woman" was a euphemism for an evil or dangerous woman (female tiger... kind of like the word for a female dog?) that was translated literally to the Common Tongue in which Yandel writes. If so, the story may not have involved any "tiger people", but instead was referring to someone very similar to the Night King's corpse bride.

As for the succession issue with the Bloodstone Emperor: that might just be Yitish storytellers reverse-engineering the cause of the Long Night. Given that Yi Ti seems to be a cauldron of intrigue, presumably such events like a younger brother taking down his sister would not have been unheard of; but the disastrous consequences (warfare... see the Dance of the Dragons) may have created a cultural abhorrence towards usurpers. Then it was an easy leap to link up a famous historical instance of usurpation with the start of the Long Night.

This all assumes that the Westerosi version of the Long Night is the most accurate. It seems it's the most confirmed: it says the Long Night was when the Others came from beyond the Wall, and now we are seeing the Others coming from beyond the Wall. So I think it makes sense to use the Westerosi legend as the "standard" and then compare with the others to see if you can get a bigger picture.

[Lord Martin]

Hey OP, good post - yes it seems we are definitely meant to be speculating on the connections between all the various "Long Night" stories (the Rhoynar have a great one, which helpfully also features specific mention of winter, as the Rhoyne froze).

The Night King didn't marry an Other, he married a "woman" that's variously described as his "corpse bride" or with "skin pale as milk" yadda yadda yadda. She has a connection with the Others, but she's likely not the same Other like we see in the Prologue to GoT and that Sam slays. Firstly, there's strong hints that the Others don't have females, and that's why they take Craster's sons (I'm not talking about the TV show here). Secondly, Old Nan mentions that the Others "bred" with human women to create hybrids. The Night King's queen is likely one of those half-Other / half-human hybrids. Check out the Radio Westeros podcast on the Long Night, it's very well explained.

It's also likely that the Night's King was a Stark, and it's said that he "gave his seed" to his corpse bride, which may indicate they actually had children. Could the present-day Stark line go back to those kids, giving the Starks a bit of "Other blood".

This does work nicely with the parallel against the Targs (who have dragon blood), but also gives the Starks a contrast with the Daynes (who are not Valyrian, but somehow do have those purple eyes).

"There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" may have been part of some pact or some magic that keeps the Others at bay (or the Long Night at bay). In ADWD, the huge snowstorm seems to start after Ramsay declares himself "the trueborn Lord of Winterfell" at his wedding - symbolically breaking or at least challenging the surviving Starks' claim to lordship over Winterfell. If winter has (finally) come because there is no longer a Stark in Winterfell, that begs the question of what it is about the Starks that was so special. The "ice" in their blood may have been that thing (again, check out Radio Westeros).

The Yitish version of the Long Night is curious because it could be a retellings of the Westerosi Long Night (with culturally relevant changes) or it could have been a separate event. I suspect that the mention of the "tiger woman" suggests that it was a modified retelling of the Westerosi story. "Tiger people" (whoever they were - perhaps a Valyrian genetic experiment) sound like they were the great foe of the early Yitish, the same way that the Others were in Westeros; BUT there's nothing to suggest that a "tiger woman" has anything to do with winter, while the Others clearly do; the Long Night is connected with winter numerous times, suggesting that the Others are the "real story" and the "tiger woman" story is a culturally relevant modification.

It may also be a simple mistranslation: perhaps for the Yitish "tiger woman" was a euphemism for an evil or dangerous woman (female tiger... kind of like the word for a female dog?) that was translated literally to the Common Tongue in which Yandel writes. If so, the story may not have involved any "tiger people", but instead was referring to someone very similar to the Night King's corpse bride.

As for the succession issue with the Bloodstone Emperor: that might just be Yitish storytellers reverse-engineering the cause of the Long Night. Given that Yi Ti seems to be a cauldron of intrigue, presumably such events like a younger brother taking down his sister would not have been unheard of; but the disastrous consequences (warfare... see the Dance of the Dragons) may have created a cultural abhorrence towards usurpers. Then it was an easy leap to link up a famous historical instance of usurpation with the start of the Long Night.

This all assumes that the Westerosi version of the Long Night is the most accurate. It seems it's the most confirmed: it says the Long Night was when the Others came from beyond the Wall, and now we are seeing the Others coming from beyond the Wall. So I think it makes sense to use the Westerosi legend as the "standard" and then compare with the others to see if you can get a bigger picture.

I'll have to check out the podcasts.

It's funny, a lot of what you are discussing relates back to a post I did on the Last Hero as candidate for Nights King. It's in my signature block.

I could buy the notion that the NKs bride was a hybrid, but I don't take as cannon the idea there are no female Others. I'm aware of what happens with crasters sons, but one method of creation does not preclude others. But Either way I'm certainly on board with a Stark Other merging of bloodlines but I suspect House Bolton is in there too. But I'm also coming around to the notion of COTF getting into the stark line as well giving that line even greater abilities leading to Bolton enmity. It's been suggested many other places that that the Bolton flaying ritual stems from jealousy over an inability to skin change. This would explain a lot about Brandon the Builder and Brans skills.

i like the idea of a Tiger lady being too blunt a translation. But as you point out, it could also be coincidental timing with the Westerosi long night... Sort of like the lace serpent who was burned at Duskendale after the defiance.

and I think Brans vision of the "heart of winter" beyond the wall suggests it's the genesis of the long night.

Who runs those podcasts? I assume they're regular posters here?

[Lord_Pepsi_Cupps]

I'll have to check out the podcasts.

It's funny, a lot of what you are discussing relates back to a post I did on the Last Hero as candidate for Nights King. It's in my signature block.

I could buy the notion that the NKs bride was a hybrid, but I don't take as cannon the idea there are no female Others. I'm aware of what happens with crasters sons, but one method of creation does not preclude others. But Either way I'm certainly on board with a Stark Other merging of bloodlines but I suspect House Bolton is in there too. But I'm also coming around to the notion of COTF getting into the stark line as well giving that line even greater abilities leading to Bolton enmity. It's been suggested many other places that that the Bolton flaying ritual stems from jealousy over an inability to skin change. This would explain a lot about Brandon the Builder and Brans skills.

i like the idea of a Tiger lady being too blunt a translation. But as you point out, it could also be coincidental timing with the Westerosi long night... Sort of like the lace serpent who was burned at Duskendale after the defiance.

and I think Brans vision of the "heart of winter" beyond the wall suggests it's the genesis of the long night.

Who runs those podcasts? I assume they're regular posters here?

Ooh, I like the flaying as jealousy motif; it also works well as a "FU Stark, skinchange out of this one" motif as well. It seemed pretty certain to me that the Warg King thing was how the Starks got their skinchanging abilities (through the WK's daughters), and presumably the Warg King's line was a COTF hybrid. But if so, that's after Bran the Builder.

Yes, the podcasts are run by Lady Gwynyfhar and yolkboy from here. For clarity, I'm not 100% sure about all the bits of the Long Night discussion from my previous post as being in the podcast episode, some of it may be just my thoughts on the theories in the episode (been a while since I listened, it's all mixed up now). Well worth checking out though!

[barristan-b]

Love this topic. I think the Golden Empire of the Dawn is key.

The formerly lush lands between the Stones, Shivering Sea, Jade Sea, and Grey Waste was the first empire of man in Planetos. The lion of the Night (Who is the most featured statue at the House of B&W) and the maiden Made of Light gave way for the Earth-God. I see this as the first Ice & Fire bloodline.

This placenflourished until a meteor shower hit the planet, which actually caused the long night. The Bloodstone Emperor became obsessed with the fallen material, began a sinister cult, and I'll speculate he controlled the former Golden Empire. He ventured into the volcanic regions where crazy creatures came from, built Asshai and Stygai with his obsessed material. The Bloodstone emperors magic is what the Shadowbinders and Red Priests think is R'hllor. It's the sinister magic induced from this fallen material.

Now consider this: Maybe, just maybe the descendants that escaped his wrath scattered. Some went north-west to build a maze based city of Lorath, some went south across the Jade Sea to establish Yeen, and the rest? They fled east beyond the Saffron Straits landing in current Oldtown and the Iron Islands. Those are the likely locations where they'd go if they needed to flee..probably not through the Bones. I'm thinking that's where more primal races (shepherds and savages) of men lived west of the bones. Eventual Valyrians, Dothraki, Andals, and Essosians. The First Men came from the Golden Empire.

I'm speculating up the ass but maybe certain factions of the Golden Empire were the ones in Westeros who built a civilization before the children started carving into trees. These are the descendants of the likes of Oldtown and Greyjoy IMO. They found the fallen meteors again maybe in the sea and at Starfall.

Don't forget, the First Men were in Westeros for a while before the Long Night. Maybe the Citadel and Children are just flat out wrong about all of men coming from the stepstones. Considering there are green people and shapechangers in Essosians forests, maybe the Children came through the steps and never knew men were settled on the westerosi perimeter: iron islands and the reach coastline. They thought they and the giants had Westeros as their home. Then the First Men came and no one knew the certain men didn't come from the east.

So after some hero defeated the night in Essos, this Hyrkoon/Shadowchaser built the Five Forts to keep them out. This was the "fire" side of the long night who was pushed beyond the grey waste but also laid low in Stygai and Asshai.

Now in Westeros, when the "ice" night forces from Always Winter came, one guy fell for a female up there (night's king). Then, a certain hero led an army using that magical oily fallen material through a sword that made it burn against the forces and built the Wall with the children/giants help...used the magical resources available...ice and weirwood successfully blocking off the forces.

Conclusion:

The sinister shadowbinders are misled followers of the ancient Bloodstone emperor. The Five Forts help keep that at bay. Also, Dany needs to stay the f away from Quaithe.

The Night's King never died and is coming back with an army.

The Faceless Men worship the original god of gods from the Golden Empire. The rest of the religions are just scattered fragments of the Golden Empire with different interpretations.

Much of the Essosian are weak, more barbaric or peaceful unmagical people. Though certain parts of them rose after they discovered a new power through volcanic dragon based resources. The right people need to be in control of the dragons both ice and fire. Can't let the Others or R'hllorians in the equation.

[Mithras]

I think we should not take the Yi Ti history too literally.

These successive god-emperors named after gems and ascending to stars after death should give us a hint. Each god-emperor’s reign might represent an astrological age. As the ages passed, people fell into the darkness of sins. The reigns became shorter and probably the seasons jumped out of balance.

Bloodstone Emperor and Amethyst Empress during the Long Night somehow remind me of the Night’s King and his Other bride. Of course there might be inconsistencies between these two different tales but the truth might lie somewhere between.

From the way it seems, the way the First Long Night was dealt with was incomplete and probably that is why the seasons are still unbalanced. And probably that is why people prophesized that the Hero will return to finish the job.

BTW, Church of Starry Wisdom is yet another homage to Lovecraft.

[Lady of the Lonely Light]

I always took the "tiger woman" to be a Sothoryi, ie. a brindled woman. Though everything Yandel says has to be taken with a grain of salt, there are some similarities between the Bloodstone Emperor and what Yandel writes of Sothoryos, specifically that:

These Sothoryi worship dark gods with obscene rites. Many are cannibals, and more are ghouls; when they cannot feast upon the flesh of foes and strangers, there eat their own dead.

This concords with the Emperor's strange "new" religion... What if it was just that of his Sothoryi wife? And as we know brindled women can't mate with men of Essos or Westeros, because these result in stillbirths. If he was after an heir, why not turn to blood magic to ensure his wife produced a living child?

The logistics of getting a bride from the inner Sothoryi continent all the way to YiTi, however, are still foggy to me, but I just thought it was a pretty interesting connection to make.

[Lord Varys]

Not only the Church, the stone itself two. It is the Shining Trapezohedron from 'The Haunter in the Dark' which also introduces the Church of Starry Wisdom which worships it as part of their rituals - and 'one of the many harbor cities of the world' in which the Church is still active is, of course, Providence, where 'The Haunter in the Dark' takes place.

The story about the Bloodstone Emperor and the Amethyst Empress is just one of many stories from Yi Ti about the Long Night. This story and the story about the sun hiding its face from the world until the woman with a monkey's tail set things to right again are not exactly easily reconciled, although the Maiden-Made-Of-Light clearly seems to be an divine embodiment of the sun - whereas the Lion of Night is clearly some deity connected to, well, the night.

It is pretty obvious why Yi Tish mythology developed the way it did during/after the Long Night, don't you think? The Yi Tish see day and night as deities, which means that they interact in some way with their mortal worshipers. When the night decided to stay, and the sun hid their face from the earth (i.e. never rose in the morning, lost all its warmth etc.) the Yi Tish would naturally have assumed that they as a people did something to enrage the wrath of the gods - they believed their caused the Long Night because they sinned.

[barristan-b]

I think we should not take the Yi Ti history too literally.

These successive god-emperors named after gems and ascending to stars after death should give us a hint. Each god-emperor’s reign might represent an astrological age. As the ages passed, people fell into the darkness of sins. The reigns became shorter and probably the seasons jumped out of balance.

Bloodstone Emperor and Amethyst Empress during the Long Night somehow remind me of the Night’s King and his Other bride. Of course there might be inconsistencies between these two different tales but the truth might lie somewhere between.

From the way it seems, the way the First Long Night was dealt with was incomplete and probably that is why the seasons are still unbalanced. And probably that is why people prophesized that the Hero will return to finish the job.

BTW, Church of Starry Wisdom is yet another homage to Lovecraft.

I see where you're coming from but don' forget it's pre-YiTi. Yi Ti rose after the long night.

It's the earliest of mythology on the planet but I think what the oily black material reveals is this ancient golden civilization's plight from the Long Night possibly caused by the blood betrayal.

The specific rulers can definitely be viewed as myth but the crux is that the original battle occurred against the undead in far far eastern Essos. Though we're talking Grey Waste, volcanoes, and fallen stars..much more fiery dead. Through Blood Betrayal, Bloodstone seems like the first person to venture into more sinister shadow magic IMO.

The hero of this great civilization eventually barred off the night with the Five Forts and I'm speculating The Church of Starry Wisdom and Co. Were the more sinister forces that fled and lived in the shadows. They're from the Golden offshoot that built Asshai and Stygai.

What I'm getting at is once this hypothesized black meteor shower occurred, different people scattered from the same civilization used it for different means. It can be used as a weapon, building material, magical entity, etc.

I see more parallels with the origins of the world religions with maybe a foreshadowing approach to Night's King. I really am thinking some of the supposed First Men are the descendents who made it to Westeros far before the First Men came from this Golden Empire even if many of the figures are myth. They knew how to combat the Night when it came from the north. To me, it seems a Stark joined with the Others to lead an army south...and it's why a hero forged a sword from that black oily material to lead an army against them. The problem was he wasn't really offed and that's why the sword needs to be held and looked after.

I agree that there's a parallel with the Blood Betrayal similar to The Night's King and look to it as history somewhat repeating. Looking at this whole blood sacrifice scenario, it makes me think of something even more interesting that Bloodraven and Bran are trying to get Stannis to sacrifice the blood of a Greyjoy who are of this mysterious descent.

I'm probably completely wrong in my line of thinking but I got on a tangent looking at the way the darker magic was brought into this world bringing about the long night.

[MaesterSam]

I think we should not take the Yi Ti history too literally.

These successive god-emperors named after gems and ascending to stars after death should give us a hint. Each god-emperor’s reign might represent an astrological age. As the ages passed, people fell into the darkness of sins. The reigns became shorter and probably the seasons jumped out of balance.

Bloodstone Emperor and Amethyst Empress during the Long Night somehow remind me of the Night’s King and his Other bride. Of course there might be inconsistencies between these two different tales but the truth might lie somewhere between.

From the way it seems, the way the First Long Night was dealt with was incomplete and probably that is why the seasons are still unbalanced. And probably that is why people prophesized that the Hero will return to finish the job.

BTW, Church of Starry Wisdom is yet another homage to Lovecraft.

First of all I want to say, fantastic OP! Very neat interpretation of events.

Now, regarding the quote above, while I agree with much of it, I wonder if these god-emperors with gem names aren't more literal than we think. They seem to appear in Dany's fever dream after she loses her baby, and shortly before she wakes her dragons:

She could feel the heat inside her, a terrible burning in her womb. Her son was tall and proud, with Drogo’s copper skin and her own silver-gold hair, violet eyes shaped like almonds. And he smiled for her and began to lift his hand toward hers, but when he opened his mouth the fire poured out. She saw his heart burning through his chest, and in an instant he was gone, consumed like a moth by a candle, turned to ash. She wept for her child, the promise of a sweet mouth on her breast, but her tears turned to steam as they touched her skin.

“... want to wake the dragon... “

Ghosts lined the hallway, dressed in the faded raiment of kings. In their hands were swords of pale fire. They had hair of silver and hair of gold and hair of platinum white, and their eyes were opal and amethyst, tourmaline and jade. “Faster,” they cried, “faster, faster.” She raced, her feet melting the stone wherever they touched. “Faster!” the ghosts cried as one, and she screamed and threw herself forward. A great knife of pain ripped down her back, and she felt her skin tear open and smelled the stench of burning blood and saw the shadow of wings. And Daenerys Targaryen flew.

“wake the dragon

The door loomed before her, the red door, so close, so close, the hall was a blur around her, the cold receding behind. And now the stone was gone and she flew across the Dothraki sea, high and higher, the green rippling beneath, and all that lived and breathed fled in terror from the shadow of her wings. She could smell home, she could see it, there, just beyond that door, green fields and great stone houses and arms to keep her warm, there. She threw open the door.

“... the dragon... “

And saw her brother Rhaegar, mounted on a stallion as black as his armor. Fire glimmered red through the narrow eye slit of his helm. “The last dragon,” Ser Jorah’s voice whispered faintly. “The last, the last.” Dany lifted his polished black visor. The face within was her own.

After that, for a long time, there was only the pain, the fire within her, and the whisperings of stars.

She woke to the taste of ashes.

These "ghosts" sure sound like the ancestors of modern-day valyrians if you go by looks: gold/silver/platinum hair and very unusual eye colors. And they have eyes made of gems...

Another interesting observation (which I admit is not my own originally, I saw it on youtube) is that last bit, After that, for a long time, there was only the pain, the fire within her, and the whisperings of stars.

The stars whisper to her again, 4 books later at the end of ADWD. Here she is, in the Dothraki sea, delirious after eating those berries and probably having a miscarriage:

She dreamed. All her cares fell away from her, and all her pains as well, and she seemed to float upward into the sky. She was flying once again, spinning, laughing, dancing, as the stars wheeled around her and whispered secrets in her ear. “To go north, you must journey south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward, you must go back. To touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow.”

“Quaithe?” Dany called. “Where are you, Quaithe?”

Then she saw. Her mask is made of starlight.

“Remember who you are, Daenerys,” the stars whispered in a woman’s voice. “The dragons know. Do you?”

Creepy conclusion: Quaithe may have been in Dany's dreams right from the start. In fact, it's quite likely. Barristan-b above had the right of it: Dany better stay the f away from Quaithe.

[barristan-b]

I just think the shadowbinders and followers of R'hllor have falsely interpreted a god for what the Church of Starry Wisdom originally came from and generated magic from. They've mixed up the AA prophecy and are actually backing the powers of what I think is essentially the Others on the fire side. The volcanic beasts beyond just dragons, the Winged men, demented creatures, etc. That's why GRRM isn't going to Asshai, as Admiral Ackbar would say: "It's a trap!". It's what the Forts are keeping out IMO and these forces work in the shadows.

Then on the ice side, the people who knew how to combat the forces used Lightbringer/Dawn and magic to ward them off. The wall is doing the same thing but more susceptible and the Night's King is alive leading an army south. A true descendent that can wield this sword will defeat them.

Crackpot incoming if I'm not already there: The new fire fight in my complete guess is Dany v. A Demonic Stannis. Jon will fight the Night's King. All will perish, but the Others will finally be wiped out.

My theory in a nutshell: It all stems back to a lost Golden civilization who's factions dissipated throughout the globe to create what people view as the Iron aborning, First Men, dragon lords, etc. Magic was already there but a meteor shower or moon collission brought a foreign magic to the planet that screwed up the seasons.

[MaesterSam]

I just think the shadowbinders and followers of R'hllor have falsely interpreted a god for what the Church of Starry Wisdom originally came from and generated magic from. They've mixed up the AA prophecy and are actually backing the powers of what I think is essentially the Others on the fire side. The volcanic beasts beyond just dragons, the Winged men, demented creatures, etc. That's why GRRM isn't going to Asshai, as Admiral Ackbar would say: "It's a trap!". It's what the Forts are keeping out IMO and these forces work in the shadows.

Then on the ice side, the people who knew how to combat the forces used Lightbringer/Dawn and magic to ward them off. The wall is doing the same thing but more susceptible and the Night's King is alive leading an army south. A true descendent that can wield this sword will defeat them.

Crackpot incoming if I'm not already there: The new fire fight in my complete guess is Dany v. A Demonic Stannis. Jon will fight the Night's King. All will perish, but the Others will finally be wiped out.

My theory in a nutshell: It all stems back to a lost Golden civilization who's factions dissipated throughout the globe to create what people view as the Iron aborning, First Men, dragon lords, etc. Magic was already there but a meteor shower or moon collission brought a foreign magic to the planet that screwed up the seasons.

I agree with much of this, except I'm not sure we can equate Asshai and its people with those of the Grey Waste. On the map, the Five Forts are clearly positioned to keep out anything from the Grey Waste- the only protection against Asshai are the mountains (which do seem formidable).

On that note, I find it curious that Asshai has a large land wall. The only other thing on that peninsula is Stygai. Have the Asshai'i always been afraid of Stygai? Did the two cities fight, long ago?

Lastly, I found something of potential interest regarding the OP. We may have to add another location to our list of creepy places. And have a potential home for our Emperor. Unless it's a coincidence that one of the Stepstone islands is named Bloodstone:

When His Grace perished in the tragedy at Summerhall in 259 AC, matters in the west deteriorated even further, for the new king, Jaehaerys II Targaryen, lacked his sire’s strength of will and was besides soon embroiled in the War of the Ninepenny Kings. A thousand knights and ten thousand men-at-arms went forth from the westerlands at the king’s call, but Lord Tytos was not amongst them. His lordship’s brother was given command in his stead, but in 260 AC Ser Jason Lannister died on Bloodstone. After his death, Ser Roger Reyne seized command of the remaining westermen and led them to several notable victories.

Lord Tytos’s three eldest sons also acquitted themselves well upon the Stepstones.

If the bloodstone was indeed found on a current Stepstone island, perhaps the shattering of the land bridge had nothing to do with the CotF after all.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

Blood betrayal may refers to pact of the Green Men IMO, and someone broke it and either the Children created the Others. Or First Men used blood magic to turn them into the others.

Ice would ruin Children who rely on the sun and forests.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

Now I have a new idea. After the Long Night (we still don't know the origin of the Others), Brandon of the Bloody Blade (the same guy as Brandon the Builder) slaughtered Children and Giants to assemble the Wall, blood sacrifice for Ice Magic. The Alliance between the two stopped the Long Night, but the Betrayal between them stopped it for much longer with the assembly of the Wall.

Which is why few are down south, and the wildlings were the honourable ones who wanted to keep the Alliance, not betray them, and as such cast out to North of the Wall. It also explains why the Children were not allies to First Men during the Andal invasion, and fought the Andals seperately, not as allies.

[Durran Durrandon]

I am also wondering about the red comet now as well.

The only other two comets or shooting stars we get are the two mentioned above, Dayne's Star and the Bloodstone Emperor's Dark Star.... what is the significance of the red star vis-a-vi these two stars?

The lords of Tarth go by the title, the Evenstar, and their seat is called Evenfall. It parallels well with the seat of House Dayne being Starfall.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

The lords of Tarth go by the title, the Evenstar, and their seat is called Evenfall. It parallels well with the seat of House Dayne being Starfall.

House Evenstar ruled Tarth before Ser Galladon of Morne messed them up and the Tarth's took over.

Everstar and Dayne connections... Sword of the Evening, Vorian Dayne. Everstar/Starfall/Evenfall Hall.

Dorne is Dawn (Dayne's as original Dornish) while Morne is Morn (as in morning). There is a lot of connections here actually.

Perhaps the Targ/Tarth ancestor is through the Dayne's (who Lord Varys speculates to have Targ blood).

Can't think of any theory here, but there is something here right?

(Maybe Brienne wielding Dawn, which Ice was??, since she now has Oathkeeper which was Ice??).

[Durran Durrandon]

House Evenstar ruled Tarth before Ser Galladon of Morne messed them up and the Tarth's took over.

Is this a personal theory or can you point me to where this? I don't get this from my reading of TWOIAF or my reads of Brienne's chapters.

Perhaps the Targ/Tarth ancestor is through the Dayne's (who Lord Varys speculates to have Targ blood).

Can't think of any theory here, but there is something here right?

(Maybe Brienne wielding Dawn, which Ice was??, since she now has Oathkeeper which was Ice??).

I am current promoting the crackpot idea that Tarth's recent blood connection to The Targaryans is through a decendent of Duncan the Tall and one of Aegon V's sisters. I have no evidence to back it up, but the puzzle piece would fit nicely.

I also like the fact that Brienne has borrowed Duncan's coat of arms, a shooting (falling?) star on a sunset (even fall) field, which is not dissimilar from House Dayne's.

[Lord Varys]

Selwyn Tarth is the son of a Dunk's only daughter by Princess Daella. It is known. Actually, it isn't, but my guess is as well that no Targaryen actually married into House Tarth, but that the Targaryen blood of the Tarths goes back to Dunk's daughter by the sister Egg was originally supposed to marry.

A hint in that direction is that the Targaryen family tree has Daella being older than Egg rather than younger - which I originally thought, as Aerion was complaining that he had no sister to marry because Egg was a boy. Being older than Egg would put Daella closer to Dunk in age as was previously assumed, meaning that Dunk and Daella could more easily fall for each other following their first encounter.

Any other assumption would mean that both a Targaryen princess and a daughter of Dunk from another woman married into House Tarth before Lord Selwyn's birth - which seems to be too big a coincidence...