Theory regarding Dany, Asshai and the rest of the Meereen gang

[Archmaester]

Having recently re-read AGOT, it occurred to me how often Asshai is mentioned (several times by Jorah, once in Brans dream - with dragons). This leads me to believe that GRRM had at least originally planned for us to see Asshai, although I now keep hearing that he has said we won't be going there in the story.

However, I have thought long and hard about how the Essos story might unfold in the next book, and I believe it may be the most logical step to have Dany travel East to Asshai and beyond to Westeros.

here is my thinking:

• Dany will head to Asshai with the khalasar (after killing Jhaqo, as she promised in AGOT), where there will possibly be a storyline involving Quaithe so we might finally learn something about her - I predict she will betray Dany after luring her to Asshai with the prophecy. the khalasar will be destoyed by some Asshaii demons or something (we really don't what's out there, could be anything), but Dany and Drogon will escape and fly to westeros by the end of the book (provided not too many chapters are spent travelling to asshai).
  
• Following the battle at Meereen, Tyrion, Victarion, Barristan et al (whoever is still alive) will wait for Dany to return. When she doesn't, Tyrion will announce that they don't need her: thanks to Victarion's horn they already have 2 dragons, and Tyrion happens to know that they already have a Targaryen (fake or not) heading for westeros in the form of Aegon.
  
• They will head west, probably some of them via the demon road and the rest via Victarions ships. Along the way, we will have a naval battle with the Volantenes where the dragons will rip shit up. Meanwhile, amongst those that survive the demon road will be Barristan and the Tattered Prince; since Dany has conveniently chosen another route, the Tattered Prince is free to call on Barristan's promise that he will be given Pentos, so some event will go down there as well.
  
• This presents the prospect of, by books end, having Dany and Drogon arriving in the west of Westeros, and Victarion, Rhaegal and Viserion arriving in the East of Westeros. Add to this the battles at Meereen and possibly Asshai, Volantis and Pentos, and we have one awesome sounding Essos storyline. And this is without even thinking about all of the possible events in Westeros itself!
  

I realise I have made many assumptions here but it is all just speculation, and knowing the way GRRM likes to play with our expectations the majority of it will probably be completely wrong.

Thoughts?

[Arthanis]

I think Danny and Drogon will enter battlefield at critical moment of battle, maybe with some support of Khalassars. It is going to be really epic battle.

[Lordtoofat2sitAthrone]

It's a logical, predictable, series of events. I could really see it going down like this. But that's probably why it won't happen. :stillsick: It will be awesome but I am just dying to see the Battle of Ice. I want to see why Stannis earned his reputation as a capable military commander in the first person narrative. :drool: Hopefully GRRM will find a way to stick Theon next to Stannis for the battle so we just don't hear about it after.

[Arkash]

I've always been one of the greatest fan of this theory so yes!

Dany invading Westeros via the Sunset Sea, landing in Casterly Rock is so thrilling!

And the idea of Tyrion going by the "common road" is one that recently poped up on the forum and I like it.

[Arthanis]

Due to prophercy Dany must meet Kraken, dark Flame, Griffin and Lion first. Surely, she may do it via Asshai-westerlands direction, but simple return to Mereen is much, much easier option. Also, she is definitely determined to save Mereen AND she has no reason to go Asshai (except prophecy). Dany going west at this moment of book is completely illogical.

[alienarea]

...

Dany going west at this moment of book is completely illogical.

Best proof she'll do exactly that. ;)

[Arthanis]

Best proof she'll do exactly that.

Then best proof of Tyrion-Jon gay marriage and Others opening Shoe Shoop at the Wall is no logic in this scenario too? :)

Danny has different goals, she really care of her people. She has a extremely important reason to return Mereen, good reason to visit Westeros, some reasons to go Astapor/Yunkai, and absolutely no reason to go Asshai. Yes, battle of Mereen MAY change her goals, but I cannot see Dany even thinking of visiting Asshai.

[nufyat]

I would really love to see this happen although I think it's a safe bet that Dany will return for Meereen before going anywhere next.

It would be a great way to finally explore the remaining parts of the world (Sunset Sea/Jade Sea). However, what would happen to her army? They can't travel east. It's too far and most of her people would die like in the Red Waste (but sure, if they defeat the Volantene ships they could go west....but how can Dany alone conquer West Westeros?). And I'm not sure Drogon can cross the ocean without resting on the ground here and then. As a mather of fact he didn't even want to go back to Meereen - how is she gonna cross half the world with him on a route few have ever walked? Anyway, even there are concerns, I'm sure there are ways to write this outcome down in a plausible way.

But my biggest concern is that this is just too much travel and plot advancement to happen in the next book. There are too much POVs for the next book and no space for another 10 Dany chapters where she travels half the world. GRRM would have to fast-forward the most part of and there I don't trust that he will do anything like that.

I just wish we would get a timejump of 1 year or at least half a year.....

[Arthanis]

Dany is travelling on Dragon, she may send her army/people in one direction, and visit other part of world at the same time.

[VaramyrSixchins]

i strongly support the notion of the Shadow of Asshai being a parallel to the Wall in the ice/fire balance. I think the "passing beneath the shadow" that Quaithe is so fond of advising Dany to do is referring to the knowledge Dany must learn, not necessarily physical entry into Asshai. I agree with the thoughts of the above posters in that there's just too much to resolve already to have room for an Asshai trip. We know from HOTU visions that Dany receives the fealty of the crones from the Dothraki city, so she must at least make a trip there, too. Besides, Jorah tells us early on that Asshai is much further south than anywhere Dany's been so far.

[Tharvot]

Why can't Dany head to Asshai after the battle in Mereen? But, like others, I think Westeros is the next destination for Dany & co after Mereen.

The Yunkai and other armies who have Mereen under siege are caught between a hammer (Victarion's fleet) and an anvil (the walls of Mereen). The series of events, and logic, should dictate that Victarion and Selmy will smash their enemies, somehow Selmy will discover Tyrion (who no doubt has raised enough support for an inner revolt to prove his worth as an ally), and Dany will head back to Mereen with her new khalasar + Drogon.

All these forces combined would be a formidable army heading across the sea to Westeros. The biggest question marks in my opinion are going to be the other dragons and how they react to the blowing of the dragon horn. Will they flee and to to Euron, will it enrage them, or will Victarion actually be able to capture them? IMO, Victarion (as much as I like him) is a pawn and will not last long into the next book. Of the 4 POVs in that area, he is the most likely to die off.

I think Tyrion will become an invaluable asset to Dany. He will be able to out-wit Euron, enabling Dany and Selmy to catch him in a trap and earning Dany control over her 2 lost dragons (assuming Euron is using Victarion as a pawn to get the dragons for himself). And, I think I will find it very satisfying if Cersei sees Tyrion landing in Kings Landing on the back of Rhaegal.

[Miriel]

I have a vague recollection of GRRM saying no characters were going to go any further East than they have already gone ( so in other words, not to Asshai). Anyone else remember that?

[darrylzero]

i strongly support the notion of the Shadow of Asshai being a parallel to the Wall in the ice/fire balance. I think the "passing beneath the shadow" that Quaithe is so fond of advising Dany to do is referring to the knowledge Dany must learn, not necessarily physical entry into Asshai. I agree with the thoughts of the above posters in that there's just too much to resolve already to have room for an Asshai trip. We know from HOTU visions that Dany receives the fealty of the crones from the Dothraki city, so she must at least make a trip there, too. Besides, Jorah tells us early on that Asshai is much further south than anywhere Dany's been so far.

I like this too, but how does this symmetry work? When the seasons punish Asshai, is it summer or winter in Westeros?

It's possible, for example, that the "long winters" are actually just periods of extreme temperatures, right? Colder in the northern hemisphere and hotter in the southern hemisphere, for example (though here we've got magical rather than scientific "hemispheres"). By this logic, it's roughly the same thing that threatens both places, and restoring balance is good for both places.

Under these circumstances, Mel's role is a little confusing. I firmly believe that R'hllor and the Great Other are human constructs invented to help explain fire magic, the Others, and the seasons, but she'd still be sewing the seeds of less heat and light and shadow in Asshai and neighboring lands by "defeating" the "Great Other." It would indicate, at the least, that her faith has things pretty mixed up. I think, though, what this disjuncture indicates is that this both seasonal extremes ebbing and flowing with the rise of magic is the wrong way of looking at it. Rather, the entire world gets either colder or warmer simultaneously, depending on the season, regardless of hemisphere.

So, if the long seasons are planetary or system-wide phenomena, then you would assume that the "good guys" in Asshai want long winters, right? (However, we can assume that just as there are summer snows in the north, "winters" are still quite hot in Asshai). In this way, Mel's agenda is bad for Asshai and she's the semi-sinister figure she appeared to be before Dance (and very well may be the fire-equivalent of the Others). However, she is actually good for Westeros (at least in the short term). By contrast Quaithe is probably less compromised and more moral, but what she wants most (no more long summers) may contradict Westerosi interests.

I think this is an interesting juxtaposition. It would imply that the key (contra to what we assume the Others, on the one hand, and Mel/Moqorro/Benerro, on the other want) is balance. The happy ending to the song of ice and fire, if there is one, is the restoration of balance. That's not so different from what many other people have theorized, but I found it helpful for myself at least to lay it out in this way. The interesting question, as far as Asshai goes (assuming no new character introductions), will be whether Quaithe is aware of this and can serve as an enlightened adviser, or whether she just wants winter in the north to relieve conditions in Asshai. I'm not sure which I would find more interesting.

[SetecAstronomy]

This is a pretty neat theory. My only problem would be the Unsullied. I simply don't see them leaving Meereen without Dany at the head of the pack.

[BoldAsYouPlease]

I think Tyrion will become an invaluable asset to Dany. He will be able to out-wit Euron, enabling Dany and Selmy to catch him in a trap and earning Dany control over her 2 lost dragons (assuming Euron is using Victarion as a pawn to get the dragons for himself). And, I think I will find it very satisfying if Cersei sees Tyrion landing in Kings Landing on the back of Rhaegal.

I was not a fan of the Dany chapters in ADwD and Tyrion's chapters in ADwD also weren't the best parts of the book. Hopefully Tyrion's introduction into her chapters (or her introduction into his) will enliven both of their storylines. Neither Dany nor Selmy has any reason at all to trust Tyrion - for Dany, he's a Lannister now in the employ of the sell-sword who betrayed her.

It'll be interesting to see what exactly his relationship with Dany will be - trusted counselor (which seems to be the general assumption), enemy, passing stranger. For all his wit and knowledge, and for all his skill at reading and manipulating people, Tyrion has a large blind spot when beautiful women are involved.

[Tharvot]

It'll be interesting to see what exactly his relationship with Dany will be - trusted counselor (which seems to be the general assumption), enemy, passing stranger. For all his wit and knowledge, and for all his skill at reading and manipulating people, Tyrion has a large blind spot when beautiful women are involved.

It's his fatal flaw.

[Archmaester]

Due to prophercy Dany must meet Kraken, dark Flame, Griffin and Lion first. Surely, she may do it via Asshai-westerlands direction, but simple return to Mereen is much, much easier option. Also, she is definitely determined to save Mereen AND she has no reason to go Asshai (except prophecy). Dany going west at this moment of book is completely illogical.

I believe the prophecy is her exact reason to go to Asshai. Although she does have several ties to Meereen, I think the final scene in ADWD is a turning point for her - after bumping into the Khalasar she may understand what is meant by "to go forward you must go back", and so she will heed the other parts of the prophecy as well ("to go west you must go east"). Also, Drogon is very hesitant to return to Meereen, which may be a deciding factor for her.

But my biggest concern is that this is just too much travel and plot advancement to happen in the next book. There are too much POVs for the next book and no space for another 10 Dany chapters where she travels half the world. GRRM would have to fast-forward the most part of and there I don't trust that he will do anything like that.

I just wish we would get a timejump of 1 year or at least half a year.....

Lets not forget that Dany had just 4 or 5 chapters in ACOK, and I think only 6 in ASOS as well, and plenty happened in those chapters. Also cast your mind back to the second ever Dany chapter in AGOT - in just one paragraph Dany describes the journey from Pentos all the way to the Dothraki sea, via the forest of Qohor and all the rest. I just hope and pray to R'hllor that GRRM can remember this and apply a similar pace to some of the journeys to be made in TWOW.

There is no reason why Dany can't just spend 1 establishing chapter with the khalasar, 1 or 2 journeying to Asshai, maybe 3 in Asshai itself and one flying over the sunset sea and landing in Westeros (6 or 7 chapters in total).

In addition, there are so many POV characters amongst the rest of the Meereen band heading West (if my theory proves correct) that the chapters can be shared between the lot of them so no one character has more than say 8 or 9 POV chapters (with Tyrion having the most, and the rest shared between Victarion and Barristan).

regarding a possible timejump - I believe this is the worst thing that could happen to the series (barring another character split). Whatever poor decisions GRRM may or may not have made during the writing of the previous 2 books, scrapping the 5 year timejump was certainly not one of them IMO. This, as GRRM rightly pointed out, would create the need for far too many retrospective internal monologues to explain what's happened over the course of the gap. Plus, it would be wholly unrealistic to have noone die or nothing major happen in this time, and if something did happen or someone did die then that would be even worse because we would have missed it!

[Valar Flaturis]

I have a vague recollection of GRRM saying no characters were going to go any further East than they have already gone ( so in other words, not to Asshai). Anyone else remember that?

Great question - does anyone know? I'd love to hear what GRRM said or didn't say about going further East.

[dansnow]

I really want this to happen. That is all.

[Arthanis]

GRRM somewhere said NO POV will visit Asshai in his books.

On top of that even only reason to visit Asshai, prophercy, is very unclear. We are trying to interpret it geographically, and it may be huge mistake. "Go east" may be interpreted in multiple ways - maybe it's suggestion what to do AFTER invading westeros? We do not knowactual Dany geographical position when prophercy will trigger.

Also, Deanny really has no reason to visit Asshai. Prophercy is completely unclear, it do not promises anything. It is not "go asshai to conquer westeros", its just unclear info of East and Shadow and some enlightement waiting here. Enlightenment for Dany possibly can come from Asshai WITHOUT visiting Asshai, and it's much easier to explain with current storyline then trip to other side of the world with no idea what to do here.

Danny no1 problem is Mereen siege, she will not abandon her people unless someone imprison her (not possible since same person will be forced to do something with her dragon). Prophercy also mention incoming meetings with Kraken, Dark Flame, Lion, Mummers Dragon and Griffin - all these persons are ATM West to Mereen.

Whatever happen to Mereen, natural next target of both Danny and all her supporters is Westeros. Choosing travel in the different direction mean loosing allies (huge part of people support her because they expect benefits after entering Westeros) and loosing chances of achieving her main goal (Iron Throne).