Suzanna Stormborn Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Did Joanna get raped by Aerys Targaryen and then have the dwarf Tyrion? Or is Tywin Lannister actually his father?Why are Illyrio and Varys (targaryen supporters) so keen to help Tyrion if he is a Lannister?Why were Tywin's dying words to Tyrion "You are no son of mine"?He had also previously told Tyrion he would never have Casterly Rock, even though by law it should have passed to Tyrion since Jaime is in the KG.Why is there speculation that Joanna did in fact have a sexual run-in with Aerys if there is no reason for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Old theory in which I honestly don`t believe.Varys is good to Tyrion because he can use him, and Tywin`s pride is refusing abomination as a son...Aerys was in love with Joanna, but there`s no proof of Tyrion being his son... Unless you count his obsession with dragons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rigatoni Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I for one have always suspected this. Yes it does (sort of) ruin the dramatics of the scene between Tyrion and Tywin in retrospect, but it also is a great semi-redeeming twist if true. Tyrion would no longer be cursed in the eyes of gods and men at least. And it also, if true, makes Tyrion a prime candidate for one of the three heads of the dragon. But to answer your question - why is there all these hints if not true: They could be red herrings, trying to throw us off. If you look closely, Jamie and Cersei could be bastards of Aerys rather than Tyrion. But we won't know until GRRM decides to lift the veil. However, I think it is clear, (whether Tyrion is truly Tywin's son or not) that Tywin believes Tyrion is Aerys bastard. Hence why Castley Rock is never offered, and why Tywin says Tyrion is not his son in his dying breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Crow Come Over Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Did Joanna get raped by Aerys Targaryen and then have the dwarf Tyrion?Or is Tywin Lannister actually his father?Why are Illyrio and Varys (targaryen supporters) so keen to help Tyrion if he is a Lannister?Why were Tywin's dying words to Tyrion "You are no son of mine"?He had also previously told Tyrion he would never have Casterly Rock, even though by law it should have passed to Tyrion since Jaime is in the KG.Why is there speculation that Joanna did in fact have a sexual run-in with Aerys if there is no reason for it?Hello and welcome, this theory is commonly referred to as A+J=T and there are hundreds of topics and threads discussing the possibilities for and against.My personal opinion is that there is more textual evidence in the book to support A+J=T than there is for R+L=J but that a whole 'nother discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woftis Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I don't buy it. Twyin absolutely hated Tyrion. The only reason he was kept around is because he was blood. I think if he was Aerys son - and Tywin knew it - he would be exiled.Although I suppose you could argue that he loved Joanna so much that he kept Tyrion, knowing he was another man's son, but still Joanna's...The above theory could be true, and I'd love it because of how it would reflect on Cat for the way she treats Jon. Honestly though, I don't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FCOS Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I doubt it. I think Tywin is just to proud. As to why he said "you are no son of mine", He had just been shot by him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Winters Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Please don't start another topic about this. Tyrion is a LANNISTER and always will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rigatoni Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Although I suppose you could argue that he loved Joanna so much that he kept Tyrion, knowing he was another man's son, but still Joanna's...That's what I suspect. From the clues throughout the series, it seems Tywin was much different when Joanna was alive. He was a loving and doting husband according to Kevan. So if her last wish was for Tywin to raise Tyrion as his own maybe he would. Also, Joanna seemed to be in Tywin's inner circle of council, meaning he respected her and her wishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzanna Stormborn Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 Hello and welcome, this theory is commonly referred to as A+J=T and there are hundreds of topics and threads discussing the possibilities for and against.My personal opinion is that there is more textual evidence in the book to support A+J=T than there is for R+L=J but that a whole 'nother discussion.really? hundreds of topics already about it? that's a lot. My thing is that in most of the ones I have read no one brings up Tywins last words.So basically the Warden of the West, Tywin Lannister, Hand of the King and Lord of Casterly Rock uses his last breath on this Earth to throw out a meaningless little insult to someone he despises. What a waste. Seems like most of the times Tywin speaks at all, which isn't a lot, he doesn't really waste his words or time insulting people with untrue statements. Just seems really out of character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 As Genna said ....Tyrion is Tywin's son..... end of the story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzanna Stormborn Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 Please don't start another topic about this. Tyrion is a LANNISTER and always will be.Oh ok well if your sure. I guess GRRM texts you all the answers and we shouldn't even discuss anything anymore. And there are 43 threads all discussing the same R+L=J theory so ppl obviously like re-hashing the same topics.Why don't you just not comment on threads you are sick of? problem solved :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woftis Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 That's what I suspect. From the clues throughout the series, it seems Tywin was much different when Joanna was alive. He was a loving and doting husband according to Kevan. So if her last wish was for Tywin to raise Tyrion as his own maybe he would. Also, Joanna seemed to be in Tywin's inner circle of council, meaning he respected her and her wishes.I dunno, it seems a bit out of character I think but it's not something I'd really get into a debate about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarkWolf Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Yes Tyrion is Tywins son. I have never questioned it and I haven't seen an argument against that would convince me otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Oh ok well if your sure. I guess GRRM texts you all the answers and we shouldn't even discuss anything anymore. And there are 43 threads all discussing the same R+L=J theory so ppl obviously like re-hashing the same topics.Why don't you just not comment on threads you are sick of? problem solved :)Well, forum community is growing and the new members are always so keen to give their opinion to R+L=J thread. You have o textual evidence to support your story, and theories with much more textual evidence have been dismissed. Everyone has right on opinion... ANd he just stated you are wrong and that there are tons of threads with the same topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wun Drop Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 More likely IMHO that Jamie and Cersei are the bastards, thereby creating the ironic situation that the deformed son Tywin never wanted is, in fact, his ONLY legitimate child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rigatoni Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 really? hundreds of topics already about it? that's a lot. My thing is that in most of the ones I have read no one brings up Tywins last words.Actually, there probably are hundreds of threads, but who cares. It's always fun to discuss/debate, especially if you're new to the boards. I like your last words theory. It does seem an odd thing to say when your son shoots you (even if you hate him). I find it funny that some people are absolutely convinced he's a Lannister (he probably is but nothing is ever set in stone in fiction) when the only clue that he is is a few characters saying he's Tywin's son because he is smart, quick of wit. But Areys was said to be smart at first before he went mad. Can't really see that as an end-all-debate link that Tyrion is Tywin's son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woftis Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 More likely IMHO that Jamie and Cersei are the bastards, thereby creating the ironic situation that the deformed son Tywin never wanted is, in fact, his ONLY legitimate child. :agree: This would certainly make for more interesting reading; not that I strictly believe that theory either though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzanna Stormborn Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 Well, forum community is growing and the new members are always so keen to give their opinion to R+L=J thread. You have o textual evidence to support your story, and theories with much more textual evidence have been dismissed. Everyone has right on opinion... ANd he just stated you are wrong and that there are tons of threads with the same topic.yeah but it was still rude. i happen to feel very strongly about this, i am an 'iron jawed angel' in my own right, and the first discussion i get cleared I immediately get a hater for no reason. If you think a thread is stupid, don't comment on it, right?'No textual evidence'--what do you mean? i stated several quips straight out of the books, the foremost being Twyin Lannister telling Tyrion that he is not his son. He says it with his last words. not something people just throw around usually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Eater Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Yes, Tyrion is Tywin's son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurkhal Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 As has been said, Tyrion is indeed Tywin's son and they are very similar to each other. Also I don't remember that Aerys had a crush on Joanna but that he made some advances to spite Tywin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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