Why Tyrion?

[3idcrow]

The two dragon riders Dany is looking for will also be her husbands.

Is it really set in stone?

"Three heads" sentiment was misinterpreted before. Rheagar thought that his children were three heads; we know how it turned out.

We know (from the House of Undying prophesy) that Dany will have three husbands and one of them is dead already. It can be that her other two marriages won’t be concurrent either. Can it be that a dragonrider is not necessarily her husband but just a loyal and trusted advisor? Based on the same prophesy I suspect that her two other husbands will be Victarion and Jon but surely someone has to ride a dragon before Dany meets Jon, right? And what if she only has one husband, then one of her dragons is grounded? I find it somewhat impractical.

[Dougsmum]

Is it really set in stone?

"Three heads" sentiment was misinterpreted before. Rheagar thought that his children were three heads; we know how it turned out.

We know (from the House of Undying prophesy) that Dany will have three husbands and one of them is dead already. It can be that her other two marriages won’t be concurrent either. Can it be that a dragonrider is not necessarily her husband but just a loyal and trusted advisor? Based on the same prophesy I suspect that her two other husbands will be Victarion and Jon but surely someone has to ride a dragon before Dany meets Jon, right? And what if she only has one husband, then one of her dragons is grounded? I find it somewhat impractical.

In regards to Dany being the inverse of Aegon, I think that there must be some wiggle room to this theory. Tyrion may not be husband material, but he sure is a handy guy to have around. Smart. Funny. Tactful. Educated. Good things come in small packages!

[Celebuial]

Do you really think the Tyrion we've all grown to know and love with be satisfied with, or even accept, a sexless marriage with the most beautiful woman in the world? Especially given his taste for beautiful women, and how the last sexless marriage to a beautiful woman turned out (she framed him for murder to escape)?

I'm predicting disaster when Tyrion and Dany meet.

You may have a point there... However until we know more about how Tyrion is coping(or not) and how his world view may ahve changed we can't really predict his behaviour in this regard. For all we know he may decide to vow never to have sex again(although I very much doubt that!), and then that wouldn't be an issue.

I also don't think that Sansa intentionaly framed Tyrion for the murder, how could she have done when she wasn't fully aware of what was going to happen and what her hairnet was for/made of? Even if she did know everything(which we know she didn't) I doubt that she would have framed him. Whilst finding him repulsive and hating her situation I think she did realise that Tyrion did not force her to bed when he was entitiled to as her husband(or indeed bed her when she was prepaired to let him on the wedding night), and so she must have been at least a little grateful for that.

[BigFatCoward]

Tyrion is an ugly little dwarf, that is honestly completly overrated on these boards, hes not as intelligent as everyone makes him out to be. Off the top of my head

Littlefinger, Varys, Euron, Stannis, Mel, Doran, Randyl Tarly, Tywin, Davos, Roose, and many more lesser bannerman I rather have at my side than Tyrion.

I'll discuss LF and Varys as the others you have named are so patently ridiculous it would be pointless. you are assuming that they are better because of where they are in the game right now, i'm pretty sure that 'The Game of Thrones' is a marathon, not a sprint. lets see where everyone is at the end of the competition.

the second issues is this. Tyrion has not been playing the same game as those other 2 so far. they had their own agenda. and it wasn't out in the open. you cannot best an enemy who you cannot see. if they had been out in the open with there plotting while tyrion was setting kings landing to rights and making a huge contribution to the battle of the blackwater then i'm sure he would have been to juggle more eggs and give at least as good as he got.

[Alexia]

I also don't think that Sansa intentionaly framed Tyrion for the murder,

I don't think she did either but I do think Tyrion believes that she did. He believed through their entire marriage that she hated him.

[Mad Monkey]

I don't think she did either but I do think Tyrion believes that she did.

I bet that was part of the Tyrell master plan too. By disrupting Tyrion's and Sansa's passionate love affair, they could disorient and confuse their Stark and Lannister enemies.

[3idcrow]

In regards to Dany being the inverse of Aegon, I think that there must be some wiggle room to this theory. Tyrion may not be husband material, but he sure is a handy guy to have around. Smart. Funny. Tactful. Educated. Good things come in small packages!

Absolutely agree with this!

It would be an ultimate Beauty and the Beast fairytale if an ugly dwarf who is despised, tortured and betrayed by everyone all over sudden wins a heart and a hand of a beautiful victorious queen… We know how well such stories sit with the SOIAF. No chance. However, he still can be her advisor and a loyal subject and a dragonrider besides, IMO. I just hope he won’t fall in love with her. I’m afraid he will.

[Alexia]

Personally, I'm hoping more for Tyrion to inherit Casterly Rock than for him to become a dragonrider. I'm not sure why...maybe because Tyrion's character feels so real, mired in all his dirty politics, and dragonriding feels much more fantastical?

While reading, I've become very absorbed by the War of Five Kings and have started feeling like ASOIAF is really three books merged into one. The War of Five Kings, which could almost be thought of as alternative history in some ways (just rename a couple characters and there you are!), Dany and her dragons, and Jon and his zombies. Its going to be a bit jolting to watch the stories begin to merge together, I think, especially when characters I favor begin to meet up with our more fantasy characters.

[KAH]

Do you really think the Tyrion we've all grown to know and love with be satisfied with, or even accept, a sexless marriage with the most beautiful woman in the world? Especially given his taste for beautiful women, and how the last sexless marriage to a beautiful woman turned out (she framed him for murder to escape)?

I'm predicting disaster when Tyrion and Dany meet.

Given that Tyrion has a prize on his head that probably could raise armies, and has almost no friends alive or any personal power remaining...hell yes? Tyrion does have a pragmatic side.

Mind you, I don't think marriage is in the cards for him, not with Dany.

What kind of disaster do you predict from the meeting? Dany is really his last chance, with the rapsheet he's got. Another disaster he can ill afford...

[Alexia]

Given that Tyrion has a prize on his head that probably could raise armies, and has almost no friends alive or any personal power remaining...hell yes? Tyrion does have a pragmatic side.

A pragmatic side when it comes to women? This is the man who thought he was in love with Shae, of all people.

What disaster do I predict? Pretty much what everyone is worried about - Tyrion falling in love with an outrageously inappropriate woman again. Here is Happy Ent's theory of Tyrion's downfall...I'm not sure if that's exactly how it will go down but I rather expect something like that.

[Celebuial]

theory of Tyrion's downfall

Now that I can most definitly see happening!!!

[KAH]

A pragmatic side when it comes to women? This is the man who thought he was in love with Shae, of all people.

What disaster do I predict? Pretty much what everyone is worried about - Tyrion falling in love with an outrageously inappropriate woman again. Here is Happy Ent's theory of Tyrion's downfall...I'm not sure if that's exactly how it will go down but I rather expect something like that.

OK, I had not read that theory...interesting take. I can't say I fully agree with HE's take on Tyrion, tho.

If not pragmatic, I daresay Tyrion now definitely will fall into the cynical category when it comes to women...or, perhaps rather, when it comes to love in general.

Let's face it, Tyrion is damaged goods, emotionally speaking. His horrible years as a kid were bad enough, but not enough to break him. Probably because he did have people who cared about him, in particular Jaime.

Shae's betrayal in and of itself was harsh enough, but Jaime's confession wrt Tysha is what truly broke him, IMO. The repressed guilt of what he did towards her has been bubbling right under the surface all this time, and it will be all the worse for his knowing the truth now. The escape routes from this mental stage of Tyrion's are few...alcoholism might be one, altho alone that would make for rather boring reading. Another is the emerging character of Tyrion the Mercenary.

HE predicts that Tyrion would fall in love with Dany, be rebuffed, and become the Evil Overlord. I think at this point, Tyrion falling in love with anyone simply is not going to happen. He will offer Dany his services, such as they are...and in that lethal cesspit that is Meereen, his services will be just what Dany needs. Clever, cunning, cynical and cruel - all characteristics Dany will find useful within her context... but relationshipwise, I daresay the bond between Tyrion and Dany will remain strictly professional.

Of course, that does not mean Tyrion can't betray her. I just don't think he'll betray Dany for love of Dany. I rather think Tyrion will bounce back and be able to heal in some form...but this may require him to secondguess his alliance. Jaime, Tommen and Myrcella could all be key in that scenario.

[Errant Bard]

Jaime, Tommen and Myrcella could all be key in that scenario.

If you followed the suvudu "cage matches", all the write-up from GRRM about Jaime had Tyrion avenging him if he died, and always helping him. It appears somewhat probable to me that Tyrion could betray anyone for the love of Jaime, following that.

[Dougsmum]

A pragmatic side when it comes to women? This is the man who thought he was in love with Shae, of all people.

What disaster do I predict? Pretty much what everyone is worried about - Tyrion falling in love with an outrageously inappropriate woman again. Here is Happy Ent's theory of Tyrion's downfall...I'm not sure if that's exactly how it will go down but I rather expect something like that.

I had a look at it. It definately holds water. I think Dany will be able to see past Tyrion's kinslaying of Tywin because she grew up with Viserys slapping her around and pulling her hair all the time. She knows what it's like to feel threatened by a family member. I really don't want Tyrion to betray Dany, but that would be a plot development that would have us all biting our fingers saying NNNOOOO! UGH! Martin is such an awesome writer. Whatever happens will be eye-popping and spectacular.

[nana&crow]

But Dany hasn't been portrayed that way. So far she seems like the sort to actually think things through (a bit at least) and not automatically kill somebody just because he's ugly. I think she would at least listen to him to see if there was any use she could find for him. Unless she really hates the Lannisters for what Gregor Clegane did during the sack of Kings Landing. But Dany seems very pragmatic and open to suggestions, until a person messes with her himself. Then she cuts him off. She even is willing to accept Barristan Selmy and he served the Usurper as Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. I think a lot would depend on how Tyrion approached her, if he ever does approach her.

I agree with this. it would be out of character for Dany to refuse Tyrion on that basis. despite her inexperience as a ruler she has shown a lot of common sense and very good judgment in the few decisions she has made. she also seems compassionate and just and above such things as "little ugly dwarves must die" statements.

[nana&crow]

This comment is so patently ridiculous I'm surprised people are making the effort to reply to it.

actually, Heal's comments are so blatantly anti-Tyrion and so ludicrous in their arguments that

I was thinking this was a mock-thread to get all Tyrion fans incensed and run to his aid.

[nana&crow]

The big problem with killing Varys and LF is their networks. He made the major mistake of trusting Varys (as did Tywin for that matter) and even if he didn't, the fact remains that he needed Varys' network of little birds and his information. As for LF, he wanted to take him down but LF had far too much personal power to move against immediately. He thinks in ACOK that he's going to start getting his own men appointed to replace LF's to start reducing his power. But he couldn't afford to take them down at that particular moment, when Stannis and Renly were preparing to march on KL, he had no army, and no political allies in KL to help him keep control.

And of course, he simply underestimated the depth of the threat and betrayal both men represented.

Do you really think the Tyrion we've all grown to know and love with be satisfied with, or even accept, a sexless marriage with the most beautiful woman in the world? Especially given his taste for beautiful women, and how the last sexless marriage to a beautiful woman turned out (she framed him for murder to escape)?

I'm predicting disaster when Tyrion and Dany meet.

I admit that Tyrion has a weakness for women, just like most male characters to a certain degree (except Renly and Loras perhaps). it's just natural that he should feel attracted to a beautiful woman like Dany, but I don't think he's the falling-head-over-heels type. Tyrion is much too cynical and realistic for that and he is not imposing or bothersome with women. he clearly respected Sansa, even if he wanted to bed her (which again, is only natural). his only intimate relationships have been with prostitutes, because he is all too aware that women don't favor his looks.

so my point is I don't see disaster in that direction, but it doesn't mean it won't come from other sides. :)

[Alexia]

I admit that Tyrion has a weakness for women, just like most male characters to a certain degree (except Renly and Loras perhaps). it's just natural that he should feel attracted to a beautiful woman like Dany, but I don't think he's the falling-head-over-heels type. Tyrion is much too cynical and realistic for that and he is not imposing or bothersome with women. he clearly respected Sansa, even if he wanted to bed her (which again, is only natural). his only intimate relationships have been with prostitutes, because he is all too aware that women don't favor his looks.

so my point is I don't see disaster in that direction, but it doesn't mean it won't come from other sides. :)

1. He married a commoner and still believes she loved him

2. He decided he was in love with Shae

3. He really wanted Sansa to love him and was quite upset by his belief that she hated him

4. As for Tyrion not being imposing or bothersome with women, he threatens the life of a sex slave and decides to have sex with her specifically because he didn't think she wanted to, all so he could feel like he had some power over somebody.

The absolute last thing I would call Tyrion with respect to women throughout the series is "not the falling-head-over-heels type" or "cynical and realistic." It remains to be seen how he will be now that he's killed Shae and believes Sansa betrayed him, but he still believes Tysha loved him and I see him as being very similar to Sansa in his view of romantic relationships.

[Mr Lynx]

I have to agree to certain extent with the orginial poster. Tyrion's skill in the Game of Thrones is overrated on this board IMHO. Up to his downfall with Joff's murder he's one of the POVs with the most luck. How many situations did he manage to survive mostly due to luck? At least three to four maybe more.

But his chapters are a good read.

[3idcrow]

I just came upon this quote last night:

"Even a stunted, twisted, ugly little boy can look down over the world when he's seated on a dragon's back"

Isn't it awesome? I hope it's a foreshadowing of Tyrion's dragonriding!