Books of the Fallen: Malazan thread

[polishgenius]

Finally, there is almost nothing that can ruin the ICE books for you in working your way through the rest of the MBOTF. There may be some snippet or two that you know more about, but not much more that I can think of.

There's definitely a major spoiler for Return of the Crimson Guard that works its way into the main series at some stage, though I can't remember when. But yeah, regarding the reading order: as long as you read RotCG and Stonewielder before Crippled God, you're good (Night of Knives sets up some ongoing ICE plot, but it's not necessary, it's mostly a reveal of backstory, and it isn't that good imo. Though it is short).

It won't make a huge difference to enjoying SE's work if you don't read any ICE first- like I say there are things in Stonewielder that make the final book make more sense, but it won't ruin it.

I actually found some of ICE's books to be stronger than any of Erikson's books in the second half of the main series - RotCG and Blood and Bone especially - and find him better at writing character than SE in a lot of ways, so I've gotta disagree with Wilbur on that one....

[Ghjhero]

Ok so what should my reading order be after I finish tBH?

[Toblakai]

Stonewielder

OST

DoD

TCG

B&B

Assail

You can move OST after TCG if you wish. That is the only point of contention but it doesn't really matter. More preference.

[Ghjhero]

What happened to Toll the Hounds and Reapers Gale in that order?

[End of Disc One]

What happened to Toll the Hounds and Reapers Gale in that order?

NoK

TBh

RG

RotCG

TtH

[Ghjhero]

And then follow his order after TtH?

[Toblakai]

Removed post due to my confusion.

[Toblakai]

Sorry, combine End of Disc One and my order together. I read the question as after TtH instead of Bonehunters. But still, did someone advise RG after TtH?

[Snowborn]

I think TtH is the book where the spoiler for RotCG will show up, so if you read RotCG first you should be ok. NoK is better read before TBh, because some of NoK's characters show up in that book, iirc. I read it right after Deadhouse Gates.

In my opinion, Esslemont gets better with each book he writes, except at the beginning. I liked NoK better than RotCG, I struggled to finish that one, it took me more than a month. There was a character I couldn't stand, and had a hard time telling his secondary characters apart. Stonewielder is better, and OST is great. I still haven't read Blood and Bone.

I agree with Wilbur, ICE's books are good, and he has good stories to tell, but he has some problems writing the support cast, and some of his writing quirks can get annoying.

I can't stand how his characters feel the need to namedrop so many different gods when they're trying to swear, it feels clumsy and unnecessary :lol:

Anyway, his stories are worth reading imo, and like I said I think he gets better with each book.

[polishgenius]

I read the question as after TtH instead of Bonehunters.

Same here, apologies Ghjhero. If you're only on Bonehunters, you're absolutely fine- the only ICE book you could have read by now really is Night of Knives. Return of the Crimson Guard, the first full ICE book, is next on my order anyway. So, for clarity:

The Bonehunters

Night of Knives (since you've not yet)

Return of the Crimson Guard

Reaper's Gale

Toll the Hounds

Dust of Dreams

Stonewielder

The Crippled God

Orb Scepter Throne

Forge of Darkness

Blood and Bone

is my recommendation. And like people have said, Assail which is just out (can't read it for at least a month because of money issues, boooooooo) on the end.

[Toblakai]

In my opinion, Esslemont gets better with each book he writes, except at the beginning. I liked NoK better than RotCG, I struggled to finish that one, it took me more than a month. There was a character I couldn't stand, and had a hard time telling his secondary characters apart. Stonewielder is better, and OST is great. I still haven't read Blood and Bone.

I am just about to finish OST, and I agree completely with this. He wrote NoK and RotCG around the same time, so that is likely why no improvement was noted.

[polishgenius]

I am just about to finish OST, and I agree completely with this. He wrote NoK and RotCG around the same time, so that is likely why no improvement was noted.

Where did you get that info? Night of Knives was published four years before RotCG, and I've never seen it claimed anywhere that he was sitting on it for all that time before it was released.

RotCG is probably my favourite of his, anyway.

[Toblakai]

Where did you get that info? Night of Knives was published four years before RotCG, and I've never seen it claimed anywhere that he was sitting on it for all that time before it was released.

RotCG is probably my favourite of his, anyway.

ICE answered questions during the Tor Malazan Reread.

http://www.tor.com/blogs/2013/04/ian-cameron-esslemont-answers-your-return-of-the-crimson-guard-questions

Key excerpt below:

Tufty: There's been a lot of rumours/anecdotes that RotCG was originally written quite a while before it was published. Would you care to explain what truth there is to this, what (if anything) was changed between the original writing and release, etc?

Ian C: Sure, I’ll address this. Knives and RotCG were written way back. They were among the earliest (if not the first) prose explorations in the world, contemporaneous with Steve and my screenplay writing, including Gardens of the Moon (if I remember correctly). When these two works were accepted for publication I had to rewrite RotCG to bring it up to speed and to adjust the main narrative lines, including certain events and character lines, etc. Other than this however, the broad thrust of it, its arc and main events, remained as originally envisioned.

[End of Disc One]

RotCG is one of my favorites but I do think that the writing gets much smoother starting with Stonewielder

[polishgenius]

ICE answered questions during the Tor Malazan Reread.

http://www.tor.com/blogs/2013/04/ian-cameron-esslemont-answers-your-return-of-the-crimson-guard-questions

Key excerpt below:

Tufty: There's been a lot of rumours/anecdotes that RotCG was originally written quite a while before it was published. Would you care to explain what truth there is to this, what (if anything) was changed between the original writing and release, etc?

Ian C: Sure, I’ll address this. Knives and RotCG were written way back. They were among the earliest (if not the first) prose explorations in the world, contemporaneous with Steve and my screenplay writing, including Gardens of the Moon (if I remember correctly). When these two works were accepted for publication I had to rewrite RotCG to bring it up to speed and to adjust the main narrative lines, including certain events and character lines, etc. Other than this however, the broad thrust of it, its arc and main events, remained as originally envisioned.

Fair 'nuff. Cheers.

RotCG is one of my favorites but I do think that the writing gets much smoother starting with Stonewielder

Yeah, his actual writing does improve as he goes, and none of his other books have the trainwreck that is that one character in RotCG. I do agree with the broad assertion that there's an improvement in his works book-by-book in general, but RotCG bucks that trend for me, despite its flaws I thought it was great.

In large part this was because I really liked all the characters who weren't that one character, most especially Nait or however he spelled it.

[Toblakai]

Yeah, his actual writing does improve as he goes, and none of his other books have the trainwreck that is that one character in RotCG. I do agree with the broad assertion that there's an improvement in his works book-by-book in general, but RotCG bucks that trend for me, despite its flaws I thought it was great.

In large part this was because I really liked all the characters who weren't that one character, most especially Nait or however he spelled it.

The writing and unevenness just made it harder for me to appreciate. I also thought there were too many piled on endings at the end. Basically, instead of one massive convergence as Erikson often does, there is convergence after convergence after convergence that started to seem contrived. Hopefully, no one considers that spoilerish.

That said, Nait's arc is one of the absolute best in the entire Malazan series (both authors).

[Ghjhero]

Ok thanks guys! I'll pick them up today hopefully!

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

I went ahead and started Stoneweilder, about 100 pages into it. Now, its not going to ruin anything in Dust of Dreams is it. I just seen PG suggest it after DoD.

[Snowborn]

As far as I remember, no, it won't spoil anything from DoD.

[Toblakai]

I went ahead and started Stoneweilder, about 100 pages into it. Now, its not going to ruin anything in Dust of Dreams is it. I just seen PG suggest it after DoD.

Based on everything I researched, there are no spoilers. I can't personally say as I still need to read Dust of Dreams. I am finishing OST first, which I also moved up based on my research. I heard there may be one small spoiler for Dust of Dreams in OST, but I decided I didn't care, as I don't want to break up Dust of Dreams and Crippled God, or have to read 3 Esslemont books after finishing the Erikson series.

The only reason I know of to read Dust of Dreams before Stonewielder is because that was the actual publication order.