Aegon/fAegon

[Howlin' Howland]

I think (f)Aeogon is fake, but not a Blackfyre. I think Jon and (f)Aegon are fraternal twins separated at Starfall so that if one was discovered the other would still be safe. This means he is a Targ and Rhaegar's heir, but not the real Aegon. The reason for pretending to be Aegon is twofold, the people of Westeros know about Aegon so they would be more likely to accept him as Rhaegar's heir with that name, and if his invasion fails Jon would still be safe.

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

There is no Viserys POV, so for all we know, Dany could be fake.

Westeros doesn´t seem to question her legitimancy.

. “We have these tales coming from the east as well. A second Targaryen, and one whose blood no man can question. Daenerys Stormborn.”

“As mad as her father,” declared Lord Mace Tyrell.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I believe that Aegon VI has his head bashed on a wall and died at the age of 1yo. The boy who appears as Rhaegar's son is Illyrio's son with Serra Blackfyre. But I quite like Veltigar's Brightfyre theory.

[Chebyshov]

I think (f)Aeogon is fake, but not a Blackfyre. I think Jon and (f)Aegon are fraternal twins separated at Starfall so that if one was discovered the other would still be safe. This means he is a Targ and Rhaegar's heir, but not the real Aegon. The reason for pretending to be Aegon is twofold, the people of Westeros know about Aegon so they would be more likely to accept him as Rhaegar's heir with that name, and if his invasion fails Jon would still be safe.

That would make claims to the IT get a bit hairy, unless Lyanna happened to mention to Ned which one was born first..unlikely given the circumstances. But if what your saying is true (I'm hesitant), then how did Varys/Illyrio get a hold of him (did Ashara or Ned decide weirdly to trust them)? And why wouldn't he have been told the truth? He'd still be Rhaegar's son either way, so why lie to him about which son he is and make him think he's a different age than he is?

[Howlin' Howland]

That would make claims to the IT get a bit hairy, unless Lyanna happened to mention to Ned which one was born first..unlikely given the circumstances. But if what your saying is true (I'm hesitant), then how did Varys/Illyrio get a hold of him (did Ashara or Ned decide weirdly to trust them)? And why wouldn't he have been told the truth? He'd still be Rhaegar's son either way, so why lie to him about which son he is and make him think he's a different age than he is?

We know that the Daynes are close to the Martells, and we know that the Martells were working with Illyrio to put Viserys on the throne. If Ashara reached out to Prince Doran about going into hiding overseas, without telling him the reason, he might have put her in touch with Illyrio. There's know way to know for sure, too much is unkown.

By not telling Aegon who he really is they protect Jon in case the invasion fails. If Lyana's son shows up it's almost certain that Varys and Littlefinger would remember Eddard's bastard who showed up at about the same time they found out Lyana gave birth. Even if the invasion succeeds Jon would be in danger at least until (f)Aegon could reach him.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Assuming that's what happens then:

1. What's the plan with Dany? I somehow doubt she will stand aside and let a Blackfyre take her throne. And she has dragons.

2. How will the rest of Westeros react? Given the general reaction towards bastards I doubt they would be too welcoming and indeed too happy at being decived.

3. I can't see the Martells being too pleased either given that they supported the Targaryens in the Blackfyre rebellion.

And lastly how will Aegon himself react?

The way I see it, if Aegon takes the throne as a Targaryen then the only way he can keep is by remaining a Targaryen, which for me makes any Blackfyre ancestory pointless.

1. Well, Illyrio's plan is to wed Daenerys to her "nephew."

2. Black or red a dragon is a dragon. The smallfolk don't matter. The lords will do whatever is best for their parochial interests.

3. Aegon doesn't know so the Martels and Dorne wouldn't have cause to be upset with him. And keep in mind House Yronwood rode with Bittersteel. How JC and Arianne will be important here.

Poor Aegon will cut himself on the IT.

[Ser Eric]

As Illyrio says, Black or red, a dragon is still a dragon. He wouldn't bring up the "black dragon" unless it's relevant to the story. The second Dance of the Dragons has been foreshadowed in some of the books, and most obviously in the

Arianne TWOW sample chapter when one of the daughters of the Lady she stays with has a dream of two dancing dragons and brought death everywhere they danced. And dragons, in dragon dreams, are symbolic as Targs.

Well, you are taking the quote out of context here.

It was Tyrion who brought up the topic of why the GC, who were created to seat a Blackfyre a on the Iron throne would now lend support to Dany. to do the same.

[Ser Eric]

1. Well, Illyrio's plan is to wed Daenerys to her "nephew."

2. Black or red a dragon is a dragon. The smallfolk don't matter. The lords will do whatever is best for their parochial interests.

3. Aegon doesn't know so the Martels and Dorne wouldn't have cause to be upset with him. And keep in mind House Yronwood rode with Bittersteel. How JC and Arianne will be important here.

Poor Aegon will cut himself on the IT.

1. I very much doubt marriage will make Dany any happier when she learns of Aegon's betrayal.

2..I wasn't talking about the small folk. We've seen the attitude towards Bastards in Westeros. If it came to another rebellion most of the major houses would flock to Dany's cause than Aegon's, if the last rebellion is anything to go by.

3. Maybe not, but I doubt they would take tooo kindly to him. Let's not forget it's Elia's son he would be impersonating.

So on the whole it seems rather pointless to take the throne as a Targaryen before revealing he is a Blackfyre and then promptly getting beaten again.

[Lost Melnibonean]

1. I very much doubt marriage will make Dany any happier when she learns of Aegon's betrayal.

2..I wasn't talking about the small folk. We've seen the attitude towards Bastards in Westeros. If it came to another rebellion most of the major houses would flock to Dany's cause than Aegon's, if the last rebellion is anything to go by.

3. Maybe not, but I doubt they would take tooo kindly to him. Let's not forget it's Elia's son he would be impersonating.

So on the whole it seems rather pointless to take the throne as a Targaryen before revealing he is a Blackfyre and then promptly getting beaten again.

1. You asked what Illyrio's plan was assuming Aegon is his son and Daemon Blackfyre's heir not what Daenerys might feel. If Daenerys weds Aegon she will be Queen Consort not Queen Regnant. If she weds Aegon to secure her father's throne and later learns the truth she can keep quiet or protest. If she protests Aegon can lock her in the Maidenvault.

2. I wasn't sure whom you were talking about. My point was the small folk pray for good harvests and long summers. Lords do what they do to advance their own interests. Many would be upset about a Blackfyre. Others will be perfectly happy. None will act for or against unless it is in their own interest or for the betterment of their House.

3. I'll try not to forget it. But like I said the reactions of Jon Connington, Arianne and the Yronwoods will be key.

I know you think it's pointless. Illyrio disagrees.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

1. I very much doubt marriage will make Dany any happier when she learns of Aegon's betrayal.

Wait, how FAegon betrayed Dany?

[joluoto2]

I've noticed that the general opinion on these boards is that Aegon is fake (especially a Blackfyre), to the point where some seem to consider it as a fact despite there being very little evidence pointing to it.

Regardless, assuming that's true (whch I don't think it is) what is the point in Aegon being a blackfyre if:

1. He himself seems to think he's a Targaryen.

2. IF he does sit on the Iron Throne, it will be as a Targaryen.

3. House Blackfyre get's no recognition at all and history will show him as a Targaryen.

Doesn't really make much sense to me. I'd say there's a greater chance of him being some peasant from Lys than a Blackfyre.

P.S I've only read the books twice so there's a chance I might have missed obvious hints.

House Blackfyre are Targaryens, a Cadet branch. Being called Targaryens is getting recognition, even if people doesn't realize they're recognizing them.

[Waylin Stark]

I've noticed that the general opinion on these boards is that Aegon is fake (especially a Blackfyre), to the point where some seem to consider it as a fact despite there being very little evidence pointing to it.

Regardless, assuming that's true (whch I don't think it is) what is the point in Aegon being a blackfyre if:

1. He himself seems to think he's a Targaryen.

2. IF he does sit on the Iron Throne, it will be as a Targaryen.

3. House Blackfyre get's no recognition at all and history will show him as a Targaryen.

Doesn't really make much sense to me. I'd say there's a greater chance of him being some peasant from Lys than a Blackfyre.

What I think is that being a Blackfyre only contributes to him being able to ride a dragon, resulting in Dance 2.0

And many people believe that he's real, which will probably result in Dany get bad public reception when she kills her "nephew", along with whichever dragon he stole.

I don't think we may ever find out if Aegon is a fake or not.

[Ser Eric]

1. You asked what Illyrio's plan was assuming Aegon is his son and Daemon Blackfyre's heir not what Daenerys might feel. If Daenerys weds Aegon she will be Queen Consort not Queen Regnant. If she weds Aegon to secure her father's throne and later learns the truth she can keep quiet or protest. If she protests Aegon can lock her in the Maidenvault.

2. I wasn't sure whom you were talking about. My point was the small folk pray for good harvests and long summers. Lords do what they do to advance their own interests. Many would be upset about a Blackfyre. Others will be perfectly happy. None will act for or against unless it is in their own interest or for the betterment of their House.

3. I'll try not to forget it. But like I said the reactions of Jon Connington, Arianne and the Yronwoods will be key.

I know you think it's pointless. Illyrio disagrees.

A plan to seat Aegon on the Iron Throne must include plans to combat any threat to his reign once (if ever) it is revealed that he's Blackfyre. Or do you expect all Targaryen loyalists to say "ah fuck it, who cares".

Dany is powerful in her own right, in fact right now more powerful than Aegon so I am not too sure locking her up would even be possible. Just like the Blackfyre rebelllion the lords of westeros will take sides and if the first one is anything to go by things don't look good for Aegon if it has to come to war between him and Danny.

Jon Connington will likely be dead so I doubt it matters what he thinks.

It would be pointless if Aegon, a blackbyre, continued to rule as a Targaryen and eventually died as a Targaryen. What would be the point of him being a Blackfyre at all (which he most probably isn't)?

[Ser Eric]

Wait, how FAegon betrayed Dany?

Well, not directly of course, but you surely don't expect Dany to sit around and do nothing if she finds out?

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Well, not directly of course, but you surely don't expect Dany to sit around and do nothing if she finds out?

But that doesn't really explain why you said about FAegon's betrayal. If Dany wish to be all MotherTeresawithDragons like her fans think that she is she should step down since FAegon, if real, has a better claim that she has. Heck even Stannis could have a better claim than Dany.

[Ser Eric]

What I think is that being a Blackfyre only contributes to him being able to ride a dragon, resulting in Dance 2.0

And many people believe that he's real, which will probably result in Dany get bad public reception when she kills her "nephew", along with whichever dragon he stole.

I don't think we may ever find out if Aegon is a fake or not.

He could ride a dragon even if he was Aegon, son of Rhaegar. And Dance was a war of succession between two Targaryens, so a Blackfyre has nothing to do with that.

I am talking about a situation where in it's revealed that Aegon is a Blackfyre,.

[COYStars]

In response to the OP: The Blackfyre loyalists would know. All of them. They would have won. No need to flaunt it, or risk problems later... it's only the reader who wants the big reveal, the best frauds and swindles are done without the victim ever finding out.

[Ser Eric]

But that doesn't really explain why you said about FAegon's betrayal. If Dany wish to be all MotherTeresawithDragons like her fans think that she is she should step down since FAegon, if real, has a better claim that she has. Heck even Stannis could have a better claim than Dany.

I agree with that. I am talking about a situation where in Aegon is king (and perhaps Dany the queen) and it's revealed that he's a Blackfyre.

Basically, the end game for Aegon doesn't make sense if he's Blackfyre.

[Ser Eric]

In response to the OP: The Blackfyre loyalists would know. All of them. They would have won. No need to flaunt it, or risk problems later... it's only the reader who wants the big reveal, the best frauds and swindles are done without the victim ever finding out.

All two of them?

[Twilight Dragon]

It will be important when Dany comes to Westeros and as Slayer of lie, understands who he is and starts Dance of dragons 2.0

I still believe that for DoD we need two sides with Dragons. OTher way - another Blackfyre rebellion.

There is no Viserys POV, so for all we know, Dany could be fake.

Who cares? xD

I think (f)Aeogon is fake, but not a Blackfyre. I think Jon and (f)Aegon are fraternal twins separated at Starfall so that if one was discovered the other would still be safe. This means he is a Targ and Rhaegar's heir, but not the real Aegon. The reason for pretending to be Aegon is twofold, the people of Westeros know about Aegon so they would be more likely to accept him as Rhaegar's heir with that name, and if his invasion fails Jon would still be safe.

Oh yes, Jon is copmletely safe at the Wall with all these desappearance of the scouts, whights, ICewalkers, wildling and with all those brigands called Night Watch.

I agree with that. I am talking about a situation where in Aegon is king (and perhaps Dany the queen) and it's revealed that he's a Blackfyre.

Basically, the end game for Aegon doesn't make sense if he's Blackfyre.

IF they are king and queen, and Dany can't have children a Blackfyre is her last chance (As soon as they are one of the purest Targs descendants). IF she can make heir... let's hope the eldest will be Aegon's son to avoid DoD.