Book and show spoilers: how could they do the finale w/o

[Seneti]

If half of onion is rotten it's a rotten onion.

Hm... I guess this is one part where the I (and the other "show apologists") have to disagree with Mel, you and many other posters on this forum. If half an onion is black with rot, I cut of the bad half and enjoy the rest. Waste not.

But then again, different strokes for for different folks...

[sati]

Hm... I guess this is one part where the I (and the other "show apologists") have to disagree with Mel, you and many other posters on this forum. If half an onion is black with rot, I cut of the bad half and enjoy the rest. Waste not.

But then again, different strokes for for different folks...

Haha I'd cut the rot too, it was just the only metaphor that came to my mind when writing the post. The meaning was - shit editing in the ending of the scene can beak that scene :)

[igrewupinKL]

For me that scene only worked because of Iain Glen's terrific acting, he was really wonderful in this scene

Iain Glen was fantastic, he's changed the character of Jorah but remained consistent. i actually like Jorah's character in the show, with Glen's fantastic voice and handsomeness there's much to love about his portrayal.

Word. She's emotional in the books, that's essential to who she is. Whereas in show she seems to mainly do the 'I will be Queen' shtick. Sigh.

I felt hollow and let down after Tyrion/Tywin. And this is a first for me with the show. I'd been waiting for that scene for ages but as you say, it fell flat. Tyrion's rage, Tywin's cold dismissal.. it just didn't play out that way. It seemed more like Tyrion was a kid pitching a fit, and Tywin a resigned father placating him with shit like 'I admire you'. Shit.

I haven't rewatched the finale and I do rewatches every single time. I even put it on a couple of nights ago and just switched it off; sounds overdramatic I know. But yeah.

Yeh, i'm actually re-reading ADWD at the moment and it actually surprised me how much of a teenager Danaerys was. She constantly kisses Selmy and other friends on the cheek. She shows a lot of physical affection and in the show Dany is very stiff, frigid almost. I guess because Emilia is older that they decided not to portray that aspect of her personality, but imo it adds value to her character. Without Dany's soft side people will not sympathise with her, and start to hate her story in Mereen.

I feel the same way about the finale, and the Tywin/Tyrion scene. It just didn't work with his anger being because of Shae when she just tried to kill him. And very pissed they left out Tyrion's line to Jaime. I thought they were setting it up with the Jaime/Cersei scene before hand but nope.

The finale was an average episode that i felt was more suited to the middle of the season than the end because it lacked tension and suspense. And it didn't leave me wanting more. That's just the harsh truth.

Ahh, Crixus, sounds like you're the one I should be watching this show with, except it would be too boring if we agree too often. Anyway, I 100% agree with both your points, and strongly.

Yes, the dracarys scene with Dany as a bad-ass conqueror queen was all kinds of awesome, maybe the best scene the show was had . . . but the show-runners seem to have loved it so much that they've decided that's the only character trait she can have. All the self-doubt, teen-aged angst and emotional breakdowns that keep her character interesting in the books even when her plot action bogs a bit have been abandoned to keep hitting the bad-ass queen note over and over. I'm not among those who like to blame it on Emilia Clarke's acting, either: I think she's excellent when she gets good material (i.e., dracarys). Nobody was complaining about her acting in Season 1 when her story was interesting.

And I had exactly the same reaction to you to the Tysha omission. I just hate it, and it's the very first change in the show that I can't easily get over. I'm by no means a purist; I think most of the changes have made the show into a better TV show (e.g., the Hound-Brienne scene was fantastic). But here, they're adapting some really classic source material, and they have really one of the richest characters in the history of literature, and I just don't think they have the right to change his story so radically.

So they took the story's most interesting character, Tyrion, and one of the most interesting characters, Jaime (interesting because he was set up as a (literally) gold-plated moustache-swirling villain in episode one but is then placed on a long, tortuous and thoroughly believable step-by-step redemption arc) and flip their brotherly relationship around 180 degrees. I just hate it that they do that. It's not something like leaving Lady Stoneheart out of a particular scene, when she can be brought in at any later time. Tysha's out of the pre-murder scene, and that just can't be undone. I really hate it, and I'm still sulking here nearly 2 weeks later.

I agree 100% about your evaluations. No Tysha inclusion and no Moonboy for Jaime really made Tyrions trip to the hands tower not make much sense. And completely changed both of their arcs in a way that is unforgiveable, especially for Jaime.

I don't blame Emilia for the acting either, it's definitely the writing. When she has greatly scripted scenes she excels and she played Dany really well in season 1..so D&D just need to think 3-D characters not 2-D which is what they're doing.

[Low Sparrow]

OMG! I cannot believe there are still apologists left who are still defending the ill-conceived and ill-executed Dreadfort scene. If that scene doesnt' define "horrible butchered disaster" then I don't know what the hell does. :ack:

And in support of semantics tangent, said phrase is not hyperbole. Saying the scene was the most horribly butchered disaster since Fonzie jumped the shark tank would qualify as a "hyperbole." And still, it could be argued that it is not a hyperbole wihtout merit.

[Mountain Tribesman]

OMG! I cannot believe there are still apologists left who are still defending the ill-conceived and ill-executed Dreadfort scene. If that scene doesnt' define "horrible butchered disaster" then I don't know what the hell does. :ack:

And in support of semantics tangent, said phrase is not hyperbole. Saying the scene was the most horribly butchered disaster since Fonzie jumped the shark tank would qualify as a "hyperbole." And still, it could be argued that it is not a hyperbole wihtout merit.

Yeah, that scene was a bit childish... and wildly unrealistic, as somehow Yara fought with shirtless Ramsay, but neither of them got so much as a wound and Yara and her boys managed to simply leave the Dreadfort like they were leaving a restaurant.

There are a few scenes like that, sadly. And the whole beetle-squashing dialogue was... well, useless. Perhaps the most boring moment in all 4 seasons.

[Woofless]

Personally, the season ended exactly as I hoped it would - with Arya setting sail for Braavos.

Re LS I won't be bothered if she's not in the show, but I'm pretty sure she will be - if only to lead up to the confrontation with Brienne where she sentences her to death.

Yara's trip to the Dreadfort was stoopid.

Beetle squishing - pointless time waster.

[Pipewrenched]

As a show watcher, after watching Walder gloating with Roose in the aftermath of the Red Wedding, I could NOT wait to see him get pummeled with some payback....

But this entire season flew by without hardly even a mention of Frey's. One or maybe 2 times it was mentioned,, but left me with a serious feeling of WTF man....

Not ONE scene of Walder the whole season....*sigh*

[Pipewrenched]

Not to mention Black Fish and Edmure?

Nothing....at all