What would a Sansa/Arya redemption arc look like?

[Light a wight tonight]

Does everyone need a redemption arc?

It's the buzz-term du jour. Next up: Butterbumps's redemption arc: can he be redeemed for singing that pornographic song?

[Red Tiger]

Samwell Tarly needs a Darth Vader arc. From butterball to Night King, by Grandmaester Marwyn.

[Roose on the Loose]

Arya owes Sansa a dress but she can't sew. She can cook a little. So maybe with Hot Pie's help, she'll make Sansa some lemon cakes.

[ARYa_Nym]

Arya a serial killer? The things people come up with. This would mean she has a particular preference in victim AND method. Arya is an opportunistic killer which is far different and less towards mental disorder. I believe the case of Dareon was her upbringing (NW deserters are sentenced to death). The other kills have ranged from revenge to survival to her job. Maybe I'm missing some.

Raff and Dareon fit the same description. They are both young fair haired pretty boys who she was attracted to. SPOILER: She uses the same type of weapon and disposes of the body in the same manner. The insurance man was on orders so that doesn't apply. She definitely prefers how she killed Dareon and Raff to how the FM had her kill the insurance man.

The other kills before that weren't murder. Those two were and there is a commonality in it. She also repeated what she did earlier with the repetition of previous crimes.

[Light a wight tonight]

Raff and Dareon fit the same description. They are both young fair haired pretty boys who she was attracted to. SPOILER: She uses the same type of weapon and disposes of the body in the same manner. The insurance man was on orders so that doesn't apply. She definitely prefers how she killed Dareon and Raff to how the FM had her kill the insurance man.

The other kills before that weren't murder. Those two were and there is a commonality in it. She also repeated what she did earlier with the repetition of previous crimes.

From Arya's perspective Raff's and Dareon's deaths were executions, not murders.

[Baela of Pentos]

Arya and Sansa will never going to be like Margaery and her cousins, but there is more than one way to be sisters.

When, if, they found each other again, they will see each other with more appreciation of what other have gone thru to survive against all odds.

[Fae Boleyn]

Raff and Dareon fit the same description. They are both young fair haired pretty boys who she was attracted to. SPOILER: She uses the same type of weapon and disposes of the body in the same manner. The insurance man was on orders so that doesn't apply. She definitely prefers how she killed Dareon and Raff to how the FM had her kill the insurance man.

The other kills before that weren't murder. Those two were and there is a commonality in it. She also repeated what she did earlier with the repetition of previous crimes.

What the hell? She killed Dareon for deserting, Raff for murdering Lommy. Those were executions, their physical type had nothing to do with it. And while she feigned attraction to get Raff alone, where are you getting an attraction to Dareon?

Arya is not a serial killer. She's getting contract killer training, and her kill list is basically an intention to exact vigilante justice. And before someone calls her Westerosi Dexter, Arya doesn't enjoy violence. She might have a grim satisfaction in another name off the list, but that's not the same as enjoying the kill for the kill's sake and channeling that enjoyment.

[ARYa_Nym]

From Arya's perspective Raff's and Dareon's deaths were executions, not murders.

It wouldn't change the fact that they were murders. She was also told she didn't have the right to kill Dareon.

Spoiler

I'm not sure if she saw the latest as an execution as she identifies as a monster in the chapter. Someone who thinks they are doing the right thing has no reason to see themselves as the villain.

ETA: Plus, Raff's actions were no doubt immoral but it might not have been illegal. No one but Arya cared when Mycah was killed as an example. Cat called the smallfolk useless mouths. Ned cared more about the potential murder and past murders of high born children. Sansa didn't care. Raff would not be executed by a lord for killing Lommy.

What the hell? She killed Dareon for deserting, Raff for murdering Lommy. Those were executions, their physical type had nothing to do with it. And while she feigned attraction to get Raff alone, where are you getting an attraction to Dareon?

Arya is not a serial killer. She's getting contract killer training, and her kill list is basically an intention to exact vigilante justice. And before someone calls her Westerosi Dexter, Arya doesn't enjoy violence. She might have a grim satisfaction in another name off the list, but that's not the same as enjoying the kill for the kill's sake and channeling that enjoyment.

That just explains her motive not that it wasn't murder.

She said Dareon had a fair face but was foul of heart.

As for Raff she called him pretty in her internal monologue.

She feels powerful when she kills which is all she needs. And I disagree that she doesn't enjoy it. Plus, she's supposed to get to a point where killing is almost a game. Someone who sees killing as almost a game would enjoy what they're doing.

I resisted it before the Mercy chapter but after it I shifted my opinion on it. She didn't have a pattern before but she's showing one now. I don't have a problem with it though. After all I also like mass murderer Dany.

[Trigger Warning]

From Arya's perspective Raff's and Dareon's deaths were executions, not murders.

So? Serial killers use lots of things to justify their crimes.

[ImpinDornish]

Does everyone need a redemption arc?

No. I find this whole "Arya and Sansa will meet up and be bestest friends forever" thing utterly ludicrous. Firstly, unless Arya is sent to kill Baelish by the FM (highly unlikely) there's no other reason for their plots to intersect. Secondly, why would Arya be friends with Sansa? She was super irritated with Sansa's constant quest to be a proper lady and now Arya has moved as far away from that ideal as humanly possible. You might as well expect Rhaegar and Robert to go skipping off into the sunset together

[Pod The Impaler]

It would be hard for them to reconcile - not impossible.

However, I think they would have to have an inkling of just how much their personalities have evolved since they last met. And the same power dynamic they had before will simply not exist.

It will be testy, and apologies (plural) will be involved - mostly from Sansa to defuse Arya's anger.

Wait, they need redemption arcs because they didn't like each other as kids? Seriously?

"Reconciliation arc" might be the word the OP was looking for.

[Kristen Rode]

Guys they'll put everything aside and work together for REVENGE, it's obvious.

[GoldieRPBoslem]

If their paths were ever to cross again, it likely wouldn't be for a long time. By then Sansa is likely to have fully stepped into her new role, which is a kind of twisted version of what she always wanted growing up that Arya loathed.

I think Arya too will have fully stepped into her new role and lost her identity completely, which again is a kind of twisted version of what she always wanted growing up that Sansa hated.

Question is, if that happened what would George R R Martin be more likely to write for an outcome?

Their two roles would be more distinctly different than ever before.

[juanml82]

If their paths were ever to cross again, it likely wouldn't be for a long time. By then Sansa is likely to have fully stepped into her new role, which is a kind of twisted version of what she always wanted growing up that Arya loathed.

I think Arya too will have fully stepped into her new role and lost her identity completely, which again is a kind of twisted version of what she always wanted growing up that Sansa hated.

Question is, if that happened what would George R R Martin be more likely to write for an outcome?

Their two roles would be more distinctly different than ever before.

I don't know. They could complement each other in terrifying ways. But they will need to learn to tolerate each other differences.

[Dragon's Daughter]

It wouldn't change the fact that they were murders. She was also told she didn't have the right to kill Dareon.

Spoiler

I'm not sure if she saw the latest as an execution as she identifies as a monster in the chapter. Someone who thinks they are doing the right thing has no reason to see themselves as the villain.

ETA: Plus, Raff's actions were no doubt immoral but it might not have been illegal. No one but Arya cared when Mycah was killed as an example. Cat called the smallfolk useless mouths. Ned cared more about the potential murder and past murders of high born children. Sansa didn't care. Raff would not be executed by a lord for killing Lommy.

That just explains her motive not that it wasn't murder.

She said Dareon had a fair face but was foul of heart.

As for Raff she called him pretty in her internal monologue.

She feels powerful when she kills which is all she needs. And I disagree that she doesn't enjoy it. Plus, she's supposed to get to a point where killing is almost a game. Someone who sees killing as almost a game would enjoy what they're doing.

I resisted it before the Mercy chapter but after it I shifted my opinion on it. She didn't have a pattern before but she's showing one now. I don't have a problem with it though. After all I also like mass murderer Dany.

This. It is possible to be a serial killer who is also a vigilante.

[Light a wight tonight]

So? Serial killers use lots of things to justify their crimes.

Arya doesn't need to justify her killings. She's the wolf child, the blood child. It's what she does.

[Light a wight tonight]

It wouldn't change the fact that they were murders. She was also told she didn't have the right to kill Dareon.

By the leader of a crew of religious assassins? That does't carry a lot of weight. Maybe the Kindly Man meant that nobody had paid for Dareon's killing so it shouldn't have been done.

[The Reckoner]

Why does either need a redemption arc?

[Mycah Bluth]

Why does either need a redemption arc?

I think this thread is serving to illustrate that "redemption" is not the term that should be used in reference to Sansa and Arya. "Reconciliation" is more like it, but the idea of a "redemption arc" does seem to have become a meme.

[cocoalover1956]

No. I find this whole "Arya and Sansa will meet up and be bestest friends forever" thing utterly ludicrous. Firstly, unless Arya is sent to kill Baelish by the FM (highly unlikely) there's no other reason for their plots to intersect. Secondly, why would Arya be friends with Sansa? She was super irritated with Sansa's constant quest to be a proper lady and now Arya has moved as far away from that ideal as humanly possible. You might as well expect Rhaegar and Robert to go skipping off into the sunset together

Martin can make up any reason to being Arya back in Sansa's path.

Really, Arya wouldn't want to reunite with her sister, whom she missed and believed to be the one last of her family, because of differences in personality? And somehow that's comparable to the war between Robert and Rhaegar?