Explanation of TV Stannis and hope for the future

[DJIM]

My only big problem in the TV Show Stannis is his portrayal as a religious fanatic. The scene in season 3 where he burns his uncle because he "was an infidel" made no sense and is inconsistent with his character - he is supposed to be an honest man. Davos is an "infidel" and he made him hand. There was no reason to change that from the book, as burning a traitor is something he would do, even if he was family.

[Bayard]

before season 3: "it's okay they are going to fix him in season 3 by showing how conflicted he was about sacrificing Gendry!"

before season 4: "It's okay they are going to fix him in season 4 by showing how he decided to go to the wall!"

and now before season 5: "it's okay they are going to fix him in season 5 by showing his interactions with Jon!"

how much more of this do you people need to just admit to yourself "no, they are not going to fix anything"?

THIS, so much this!!

I have no more hope for S5. How much of Stannis did we see in the trailer?? We also have a leaked outline for the first episode and we know that Stannis is more than willing to forgive Mance Ryder if he bends the knee. So much for his respect for the law.

I'm not saying that people won't like him, how could they not if he fights the white walkers and the Boltons?? But we'll have a different character than in the books. That could be fine with some, not with me. I don't care that much about changes in story, but at least keep the characters the same.

[Lord Davos Baratheon]

THIS, so much this!!

I have no more hope for S5. How much of Stannis did we see in the trailer?? We also have a leaked outline for the first episode and we know that Stannis is more than willing to forgive Mance Ryder if he bends the knee. So much for his respect for the law.

I'm not saying that people won't like him, how could they not if he fights the white walkers and the Boltons?? But we'll have a different character than in the books. That could be fine with some, not with me. I don't care that much about changes in story, but at least keep the characters the same.

My point exactly.

[Tyrell_like_Squirrel]

I'm not saying this is the season where all stanfan dreams come true in a blaze of glory and fireworks. At the very least I think we can be optimistic about some interactions with team Dragonstone and the Night's Watch. And I really believe the lack of direction shows in seasons 3 and 4, not in season 2. I liked how they did Stannis in season 2, overall. I think they had a better plan for what to do with him. And I think that's the case with season 5 as well.

[Failing At Dinner]

Also, it's really nice to see unsullied who like Stannis. It warms my heart like the fires of R'hllor. All my unsullied friends who watch the show with me hate him.

I think there are quite a lot of us who like him (my fellow show-only friend agrees that he's very funny, and in a likeable way, not a mockable way). There's just something inherently amusing about an unbending man of righteousness, stern and stoic, who also has a slight (but not horrible) childishness about him, going in huge long sulks if he doesn't get what he wants, and adhering to a simplistic black and white conception of the world. Maybe that's not the perception book fans would want us to have of him though.

Judging by the funny Youtube "Stannis Hypemeter" vids (made by Unsullieds I would guess) he is popular with the younger viewers 'cause of his archetypal Grumpy Dad qualities. Gritting intensifies!

I can see how if Davos wasn't around it might be fair to say D+D have portrayed him as a villain - dark armour, dark castle, dark musical theme, harsh manners, murdering his brother, using blood magic performed by his death-cult sorceress to destroy his other enemies... Yeah, it does look like the resume of a typical fantasy villain. Somehow I don't see him that way though, and never have.

Also disagree strongly with D+D that he'd make a bad king. Him and Ned seem like the only nobles we've seen so far who would think of the smallfolk as anything other than useful battlefield-fodder or annoying mouths to feed. He has a crabber's son as his Hand, after all, and resents his fellow aristocrats when they have the gall to denigrate him. Stannis is a meritocrat, like Napoleon.

I agree with Ser Pounce FTW on pretty much everything, basically.

[Fiery Heart]

I like Stannis for his weakness, which is his strength & how unbending he is. He'll definitely break. I love the constant references to his clenched jaw in the books.

Lets face it, Stannis is Melisandre's puppet. I like Stannis though, and his crew, but it seems a lot of Stannis' fans don't recognise that she is steering his ship, so to speak. Credit where credits due.

:leaving:

[The Drunkard]

Stannis has never been a puppet of Melisandre. In ACOK he valued her for her powers alone, not her religious teachings or prophecy, and promptly shipped her away when she became a detriment to his cause. In ASOS he spent the vast majority of the book refusing her suggestions while intermittently laughing at her, insulting her, or threatening to kill her slowly should she be deceiving him. In ADWD she offers no significant advice that he hasn't already internalized earlier in his life or received from someone else.

Note that this behaviour is usually inconsistent with that of a puppet's.

[Fiery Heart]

And yet she still bends his will. He's at the wall because of Melisandre.

[The Drunkard]

He's at the Wall because Davos convinced him that he was pursuing his rights at the expense of his duty, and then revealed a situation that allows him to protect the kingdom, further his fight for the crown, and begin the great battle in earnest. Not because Melisandre tugged at a string and sent him to the Wall (that very chapter is where Stannis threatens to give her a slow death should she be lying, incidentally).

Nor does that little comment rebut anything within my prior post.

[Bluetiger]

And yet she still bends his will. He's at the wall because of Melisandre.

Because of Davos who gave him letter and convinced him that he has to defend his kingdom.

Before Davos showed the letter Melisandre didn't even talk about that.

[Fiery Heart]

I'm not trying to rebut anything (do I need to?) Just adding some thoughts to the discussion. No need to take offense by my little comment. But yes, I look forward to seeing where Melisandre takes Stannis next.

[The Drunkard]

I'm not offended, but if I don't seem very polite it's because I don't think telling everyone to "face it" and accept your reading, before lightly disparaging those who don't, is very polite either, or a good way to add thoughts to a discussion.

[Fiery Heart]

It's called humour. Hence the running smiley I put on the end of my post. Relax. They're just words, take them with a pinch of salt. You're entitled to disagree.

[The Drunkard]

I'm quite relaxed, thanks for the affected concern, but this thread isn't about me. :thumbsup:

[Fiery Heart]

:hat: I'm deeply concerned about you.

[Lord Davos Baratheon]

I'm not offended, but if I don't seem very polite it's because I don't think telling everyone to "face it" and accept your reading, before lightly disparaging those who don't, is very polite either, or a good way to add thoughts to a discussion.

I agree. Sometimes that just kills a discussion; it's unbearable.

[Poète Lauréat]

:hat: I'm deeply concerned about you.

I'm concerned about you being concerned.

[aFeastForDragons]

"There is only one reliable leader left in Westeros, Stannis Baratheon"

Whatever blunders S3 had they more than made up for it in S4 with the Iron Bank scene and Smashing the Wildlings. I hope they really big up the Stannis vs Boltons this season.

And yet she still bends his will. He's at the wall because of Melisandre.

Emmm you might want to read ASOS again if you think that.

[Mordos_Kull]

What I like about Stannis is he seems to be the only leader who actually LISTENS to his council, and his actions are often spontaneously based on this.

I can't quite predict how far he gets, but he's been more calculating than most of the other leads, despite his stubbornness.

Whether or not his march to Winterfell is his biggest mistake, we won't find out until TWOW (or the end of S5)

[Ser Pounce FTW]

What I like about Stannis is he seems to be the only leader who actually LISTENS to his council, and his actions are often spontaneously based on this.

I can't quite predict how far he gets, but he's been more calculating than most of the other leads, despite his stubbornness.

Whether or not his march to Winterfell is his biggest mistake, we won't find out until TWOW (or the end of S5)

I doubt his march to Winterfell will be a mistake. Everything is set up for his success at Winterfell. After Winterfell, is another story although I suspect he'll have a bit more success at least until Starks begin to show up.