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Emperoreddy

[BOOK SPOILERS] Mel and Jon Snow

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Talk about events at the wall.



Do we think Jon Snow's offer to become legitimized by Stannis is still coming? Feel like it would be a HUGELY powerful scene to just cut.



Also Mel's odd question about Jon's virginity. The show itself up tot his point has only shown Mel to be interested in "King's Blood and King's Power". So was this our first show clue that R+L=J? Why else would she be so interested in Jon?


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It's one of the first clue to show the TV show watchers that Jon may have some special type of lineage... depending on who his mother is. The hard part is clueing the viewers to think outside the box (i.e. Ned ain't even his dad you fools)


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Talk about events at the wall.

Do we think Jon Snow's offer to become legitimized by Stannis is still coming? Feel like it would be a HUGELY powerful scene to just cut.

Also Mel's odd question about Jon's virginity. The show itself up tot his point has only shown Mel to be interested in "King's Blood and King's Power". So was this our first show clue that R+L=J? Why else would she be so interested in Jon?

In the synopsis for the next episode it says "Stannis temps Jon", so I bet it's in.

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Wouldn't Jon's Stark blood be sufficient as royal blood? The Starks were king's in the north for thousands of years (since the arrival of the first men). Do they lose one war then cease having royal blood?

As well as Robb being declared KITN

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Jon's whole "I want to be a real Stark" thing was the first thing they established about his character, and they hammered it home, and they're still making a point to refer to him as "the bastard" as often as possible 5 seasons in; there has to be a reason for that, and unless they're planning to reveal R+L=J this season or something, I can't see what else it could be but Stannis's offer.

Also, I suspect D&D would find Jon's struggle at the end of the book too subtle for their users to get, unless they make sure to remind us, earlier in the same episode, of him having rejected Stannis's offer.

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I have a feeling this season we will be getting clues to lead us to Jon's parentage. This is a start, of course.


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I have a feeling this season we will be getting clues to lead us to Jon's parentage. This is a start, of course.

The show doesn't really like to drop subtle hints like the book. I'm pretty sure they want to drop R+L=J as a bombshell at some point, but if they did so right now, it wouldn't be so much a revelation as a "Huh? Who's that?"

Seriously, when little Cersei said she was promised to the Prince, my unsullied friends thought she meant 2-year-old Viserys. When I asked if they remembered why the Mad King and the Starks had gotten up in arms with each other, they thought that Littlefinger had something to do with stirring it up but they couldn't remember what it was about.

If the show follows its usual patterns, they're going to want to sledgehammer that backstory into us repeatedly, almost once/week for a whole season. And I don't really see enough possibilities to do so this year. Barristan and Dany can talk about it once or twice, but beyond that? Sansa may end up in a great location to learn about her aunt, but who's around to tell her? Arya's unlikely to hear anything about Stark or Targ history unless they somehow work in a meeting with Aemon and Sam. Bran is out of the story until next year, and Rickson at least that long (on TV, he's with the Greatjon, not off on Skagos, right?). Howland hasn't been cast yet. I suppose Jamie and one of Elia's relatives in Dorne could have a long talk about how Rhaegar betrayed Elia, but how would that be relevant to them?

I wouldn't entirely put it past D&D to come up with something clever, or just to shoehorn in something clumsy, but I'm not expecting it until next year. In which case, until then, Jon's king's blood will only count as a clue to the book readers, because his KitN blood already explains it perfectly for the unsullied.

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I have a feeling this season we will be getting clues to lead us to Jon's parentage. This is a start, of course.

There is an interesting theory that we might be revealed something through Sansa, assuming that she is on her way to Winterfell.

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The show doesn't really like to drop subtle hints like the book. I'm pretty sure they want to drop R+L=J as a bombshell at some point, but if they did so right now, it wouldn't be so much a revelation as a "Huh? Who's that?"

Seriously, when little Cersei said she was promised to the Prince, my unsullied friends thought she meant 2-year-old Viserys. When I asked if they remembered why the Mad King and the Starks had gotten up in arms with each other, they thought that Littlefinger had something to do with stirring it up but they couldn't remember what it was about.

If the show follows its usual patterns, they're going to want to sledgehammer that backstory into us repeatedly, almost once/week for a whole season. And I don't really see enough possibilities to do so this year. Barristan and Dany can talk about it once or twice, but beyond that? Sansa may end up in a great location to learn about her aunt, but who's around to tell her? Arya's unlikely to hear anything about Stark or Targ history unless they somehow work in a meeting with Aemon and Sam. Bran is out of the story until next year, and Rickson at least that long (on TV, he's with the Greatjon, not off on Skagos, right?). Howland hasn't been cast yet. I suppose Jamie and one of Elia's relatives in Dorne could have a long talk about how Rhaegar betrayed Elia, but how would that be relevant to them?

I wouldn't entirely put it past D&D to come up with something clever, or just to shoehorn in something clumsy, but I'm not expecting it until next year. In which case, until then, Jon's king's blood will only count as a clue to the book readers, because his KitN blood already explains it perfectly for the unsullied.

I'm expecting this year. Next year is too late. Dany and Barristan now have the perfect opportunity to illuminate much of the story...and I've also heard that Sansa could be a way to do it, as well. Mel being near Jon gives the show the perfect opportunity to shine a light on his lineage, as well.

Basically, it's now or never for the show, imo.

Also, the books aren't subtle in the slightest with the R+L=J stuff. Look at my signature...I have a 18 page document of clues from the books about Jon's parents and backstory related to it. The show has been much more subtle about it because they can't introduce it in season one and then not reveal it until season 6 (which is my guess for the reveal).

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I'm expecting this year. Next year is too late. Dany and Barristan now have the perfect opportunity to illuminate much of the story...and I've also heard that Sansa could be a way to do it, as well. Mel being near Jon gives the show the perfect opportunity to shine a light on his lineage, as well.

Basically, it's now or never for the show, imo.

Why is season 6 out of 7½ too late for the show to drop the bombshell if book 6 out of 7 isn't too late for the novels?

(Of course the books have given us all kinds of subtle hints along the way, and the show hasn't—but that's because the books are always all about dropping subtle hints so when the surprise comes you can look back and see the foreshadowing, while the show rarely is. I don't see any reason to expect that part to change.)

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They could do it like they did when Ice got melted down. They showed every scene of the sword then went straight to Tywin having it reforged. So you could flash from Lyannas statue in the crypts to a Dany and Jorah convo about Rheagar to Oberyns mention of Rheagar setting his sister aside to one more possible hint from this season then drop the bomb.

Edit: they could sneak in the snow on the throne from the HotU scene too

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Why is season 6 out of 7½ too late for the show to drop the bombshell if book 6 out of 7 isn't too late for the novels?

(Of course the books have given us all kinds of subtle hints along the way, and the show hasn't—but that's because the books are always all about dropping subtle hints so when the surprise comes you can look back and see the foreshadowing, while the show rarely is. I don't see any reason to expect that part to change.)

I never said that. I said that waiting until season 6 to DROP CLUES pointing to the bombshell is too late if they are going to reveal it in season 6 (which, as I also said, is my guess for the reveal).

And the books didn't have 'subtle' hints all the way through. It had way too many in the first book and the rest sparsely scattered throughout the next four. The show is obviously waiting later to lay the groundwork because there's no reason to copy the book and give it away in the first season when the reveal won't come until closer to the end.

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To add to my earlier post they could show the scene where Ned tells Jon the next time they see each other they'll speak of his mother. The clues are scattered enough that they could open an episode the way I mentioned.

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To add to my earlier post they could show the scene where Ned tells Jon the next time they see each other they'll speak of his mother. The clues are scattered enough that they could open an episode the way I mentioned.

They could, I'll have to keep an eye out for that clip in the 'Previously on' shit at the start of the episodes. Mel obviously knows something is up, as well as the possibility of other characters getting history lessons (which I feel is very likely) from on both continents. Hell, even the hint last season was huge. All we've heard on the show is how Rhaegar kidnapped her & she died. Then we got Oberyn's sexy ass come fucking his way into Kings Landing on his war path talking about how "the beautiful & noble Rhaegar Targaryn left her for another woman". Then we see Oby & his paramour having massive orgies so that leads me to believe that Elia was cool with it

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I fully expect the last scene of the season being a big clue. Personally I think it ends with Jon's stabbing. He calls out for Ghost, his eyes roll back like a Warg. Then we as the viewers see several flash backs of Ned and Jon's final words, then Lyanna's tomb from season one. Then it fades to black. Bonus... if DD really wanted to give it away. They show a dragon, waking up. Then fade away.

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I have no idea why Mel asks if Jon is a virgin. I've not seen any hint virginity has anything to do with her magic or worship. It just seems to arbitrary just to be idle chatter on the part of the writers, though.


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