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falcotron

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  1. falcotron

    GoT Actors in Other Stuff - Part 2

    Yeah, he played Richard I at least twice, but to be fair, he's played just about everyone in English history (starting with Aethlstane, the king before whom there was no such thing as English), so he had to double up somewhere.
  2. In regards to the Critiques of ASOIAF thread. I posted last night "find some common cause" between you and Walda. This morning I reread and realized I was just posting a "lite" version of what you posted, framing it as "can't we all be friends?"

    My apologies for this redundancy...

    Cheers

  3. falcotron

    Casterly Rock Why?

    Also, I think he still really, really wants to take Casterly Rock away from Cersei, because he was supposed to be the heir—far more so than he consciously realizes, which may have distorted his judgment a bit.
  4. falcotron

    Casterly Rock Why?

    WoIaF says "Legends says that Visenya Targaryen, upon seeing it, thanked the gods that King Loren rode forth to face her brother Aegon on the Field of Fire, for if he had remained within the Rock, even dragonflame would not have daunted him.” But in the novels, Casterly Rock isn't just a castle on top of a mountain, it's a castle carved out of the mountain. The halls and chambers are built by digging out areas around the mineshafts. Even the port is in a cave in the mountain. The only thing on top of the mountain is a small ring for that they use for surveying and scouting. In the show, it's a pretty standard castle, and I don't think it would hold up to a serious dragon attack nearly as well as the one in the books.
  5. falcotron

    GoT Actors in Other Stuff - Part 2

    Speaking of Doctor Who, David Bradley (Walder Frey), after playing First Doctor actor William Hartnell in the 50th anniversary docudrama An Adventure in Space and Time, is now playing the actual First Doctor in this year's Christmas special. A friend of mine who doesn't watch GoT regularly wanted to know why Ashildr was impersonating the Doctor at the start of this season. Also, someone posted a list of GoT/DW crossovers earlier, but only included connections from the 2005 series. Most of the older cast members were on the classic (1963-1989) series or involved in the "wilderness years" between 1989-2005 in some way, just because most British actors old enough to play an older person were on the show at some point in its 26+ years. Rather than list them all: Earliest (I think): Julian Glover (Pycelle) playing Richard the Lionheart in The Crusade in 1965 (he's also Scaroth in City of Death, maybe the most famous one-off villain in the classic series, the one who was unstuck in time and secretly had a head made of green spaghetti). Last: RIchard E. Grant (Izembaro) playing the Ninth Doctor in the 2003 animated pilot Scream of the Shalka. Most crossovers: Richard E. Grant (Izembaro), Jim Broadbent (Archmaester Ebrose), and Jonathan Pryce (High Sparrow) as Ninth Doctor, Tenth Doctor, and Master in the 1999 semi-official parody The Curse of Fatal Death. Also, the shortlist for the Eighth Doctor included Jonathan Pryce (High Sparrow), Liam Cunningham (Davos), and Tim McInnerny (Robett Glover).
  6. falcotron

    GoT Actors in Other Stuff - Part 2

    Has anyone mentioned DIana Rigg joining Victoria this season? I've only watched the first episode, but it's pretty strange casting. Diana Rigg is basically written as Olenna Tyrell. The real Duchess of Buccleuch was 30 years old, deeply religious, a "lifelong romantic", and an agreeable woman who became Victoria's best friend. It's also the only role I've seen her in since her return from retirement in 2013 (for Doctor Who) where she's basically just playing Olenna. It seems like a waste, given her range. But maybe she'll do more with it in later episodes. I think the only other actor Victoria and GoT have in common is Guy Oliver-Watts, who had a minor recurring role as Sir James Hayter in S1 of Victoria, and was a unnamed Lannister general this year, although I think his scenes were cut from all but the last episode. (Victoria and Doctor Who, on the other hand…)
  7. falcotron

    Casterly Rock Why?

    Yeah, people tend to forget that Tyrion has been away from Westeros for a few years, and couldn't possibly know about the amazing strides made in transmat technology. When he left, you could only transmat a single person, and only if he was a kind of small person; now, an entire navy can go from one side of the continent to the other.
  8. 1 hour ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

    Useful is not all it's cracked up to be. I'd love the details. I'm a total history nerd. Feel free to send them in a PM if you like.

    If I were smart, I would have just started at Plantagenet England, realized that it fit pretty well, and have been done. But instead…

    The most famous cadet house traditions are the early modern HRE ones, I'm pretty sure GRRM didn't borrow from there, because the reason they're famous is all the the wacky results that still persist to modern times, like the British royal house being a cadet branch of a cadet branch of a Wettin duchy and the German imperial house being a cadet branch of the County of Hohenzollern. There doesn't seem to be anything like that in Westeros.

    So, next, medieval France, which is the original basis for most other European systems (since they had strict primogeniture before anyone else, so they needed it). The heraldic rules fit, and the few descriptions we get of cadet houses seem to work, but there's a huge problem: In France, if you can't acquire a new territory through marriage or conquest to give to your second son, you almost always split off a new fief within your main holdings for him. In Westeros, acquiring territory through marriage seems to be actively discouraged rather than encouraged. Conquest may be about as common as in France (like House Lannister of Darry) but that's not very common. And we don't see subdivision every generation—it's rare enough that it's presumably something you only do if you really like your second son or are really worried about him rebelling, rather than it being expected.

    Norman England directly brought over the French appanage traditions, but William immediately ran into the problem of his heir trying to overthrow him twice, so he ended up leaving everything to his second son, William II. Meanwhile, William II and Henry I were trying to flatten out the aristocracy and shrink all the old and new earldoms down, so nobody wanted to subdivide their domains either, because that would just make it easier for the kings to turn everyone into little more than barons. But when it did happen (often after acquiring new territory—e.g., Edward II conquered north Wales and part of Scotland, then his son gave York and Lancaster to his cadets), they followed the French rules. Which is basically the same thing we see in Westeros.

    And if you assume that GRRM borrowed this system for cadet houses, everything works, including the heraldry.

    What about bastard houses? They weren't very common in Plantagenet England, but they were common a few centuries later. And if you look at the Westerosi heraldic pattern—the father's arms quartered on a plain field with a baton sinister—that was invented by the King of Arms standardizations in the late 16th century. At that time, it was clear that bastards were not considered cadets—this was explicit with Charles II's bastards. Appanage was pretty much dead at that point, but if it had still existed, I don't think it would have applied to bastards. At that time, appanage was pretty much dead anyway, but also, Charles II's bastards were explicitly not called cadets.

    So, my guess is that Westeros's cadet house system is borrowed from Norman to Plantagenet England, but its bastard system is borrowed from Stuart England.

    As you can see, there's a lot of guessing here, but I think it all fits.

    1. Lady Blizzardborn

      Lady Blizzardborn

      Very cool! Thank you for sharing all of that with me.

  9. To be fair, half the people who've heard about this mission have insisted on joining it. No idea why, but given that track record, would you tell Winterfell about it? You'd probably end up with Sansa Stark and Lyanna Mormont in the party. Or Littlefinger.
  10. But then the child actors would be 3 years older by the end. They can't just pretend the characters aren't aging even though the actors are—nobody can suspend disbelief well enough to take Isaac Hampstead Wright as a pubescent teen. So instead, they've turned 3 years of book story into 7 years of show story. On top of aging everyone up 2 years at the start. That's already stretching things to the breaking point. Jon isn't a teenager in over his head like Robb before him, he's a man in the prime of his life. Dany can't pull off her "but a young girl" speech anymore. Arya is not a damaged young adolescent, she's a crazy young woman. Push things out another 2 or 3 years and it would get even worse.
  11. If we're talking about time, did anyone notice Sansa saying it had been weeks since she'd seen Jon? Are the writers really plotting this out so each episode takes place over about a week? So Cersei's "in a fortnight" wasn't a fluke; if it's 5 weeks for us since Jon left Winterfell, then it's 5 weeks for Sansa too? Does that mean that means between the seasons, there's 10 months where nothing happens (since the characters are still aging a year every season)? The travel times have always been implausible and inconsistent in the show, and even in the books, but somehow it's more annoying to realize they actually have a rule they're following that guarantees implausible travel times, instead of just not paying enough attention.
  12. Bah, limited screen time is no excuse. The books for this part of the story don't exist, so it shouldn't take more than 0 minutes for this entire season. In fact, just turn off your TV and look at the blank screen for 0 minutes, and you've got a 100% faithful adaptation. Why can't HBO just release that? It would certainly save on budget! Personally, I care more about whether the show is enjoyable than whether it's identical to the books (which I generally like much better, but it's not like they're sacrosanct scripture), even before we got to the point where the books don't exist. So I'd rather watch the 48 minutes of this actual episode than the 0 minutes of the faithful adaptation. But real true book snobs should try it the other way.
  13. falcotron

    [Spoilers] EP704 Discussion

    I'd say the possibilities, in decreasing order of likelihood, are: Bronn fishes him out of the water downstream. Tyrion points him out and the Dothraki fish him out and take him prisoner. He washes up on his own somewhere unconscious but inexplicably alive, and has to do the long crawl back to civilization that every male character does on this show (most recently Theon) even though he's actually only a few miles from KL and can march half a continent in under a week. He washes up on his own somewhere unconscious and also amnesiac and builds a new life for himself as a happy smallfolk farmer until he's implausibly spotted by Tarly months later in episode 7 and brought back to work for his sister, still without his memories. He drowns but comes back to life so now he can challenge Euron to a new Kingsmoot. The Lannisters are secretly descended from the legendary fish-people of the sunken ruins of whichever Rhoynar city that was, so Jaime discovers he can breathe underwater. D&D actually killed off one of their favorite characters in the middle of S7 with his arc left unfinished.
  14. falcotron

    [Spoilers] EP704 Discussion

    Come on, it's going to be hot. A bloodless undead fire wight, what part of that isn't hot? I mean if you skip the bloodless, undead, and wight parts, it's fire, and fire is hot. Dany: My dragon, Viserion, is dead. Jon: Speaking of dead, have I mentioned the Army of the Dead in the last 3 minutes? Dany: And I'm sad about this. Jon: <grim silence> Dany: Because I have emotions. Jon: I too have emotions. About the Army of the Dead. Dany: So we'll have sex now. Jon: <grim silence> Dany: Oh, Daenerys Targaryen, Stormborn, Unburnt, Mother of Dragons. Jon: <grim silence> Tyrion: You know, Jon, most people couldn't pull off looking so brooding while having sex with a beautiful girl, but somehow it works for you. Dany: Oh, Queen of the Andals and the First Men, Khaleesi of the Great Grass Sea. Tyrion: You guys forgot we were here, didn't you? All that intense concentration, I guess. Which is not how people normally do this, but whatever works for you. Dany: Oh, Queen of Meereen, Breaker of Chains. Tyrion: Also, calling out your own name and titles is weird enough, but doing it in that flat monotone is even weirder. You could at least get a little breathy or something. Davos: Hey, Missandei, that reminds me, I've been meaning to ask what sex is like back on Naath. Missandei: I really can't tell if you're being creepy, or are just really into ethnology. Davos: I'm not sure myself. All I know is, as long as King Snow is getting laid, nothing else matters. Tyrion: Now that's creepy. Also, how did you survive all those years under Stannis? Davos: King Baratheon? He used to nail Melisandre on the map table. Tyrion: Remind me not to take my lunches at the map table anymore. Dany: Oh, Protector of the—we're done. Jon: <grim silence> Dany: As I was saying, if you will bend the knee, I will defend the North with my three dragons. Missandei: Two dragons, my Queen. Dany: Oh, yes, that is the thing I was having emotions in regard to. Jon, did we have sex because of that? Jon: I think so. Have I mentioned the Army of the Dead?
  15. falcotron

    [Spoilers] EP704 Discussion

    I literally forgot that one had happened by the end of the episode. I asked my friend, "So, now that Theon is the entire pro-Dany Ironborn faction, he's obviously going to have to meet one of the Starks, how do you think that will go?" and only remembered halfway through the last word…
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