Is it me, or has the show's general quality diminished?

[JonCon's Red Beard]

This season has reminded me of the Lord of the Rings movies where every time the the film makers left Tolkien and did something on their own to make the text filmable the moves they made and the dialogue they wrote just didn't hold up. They were the worst part of the movies.

Peter Baelish handing over the daughter of the woman he loved, the spitting image of the woman he loved, to the family that killed the woman he loved ranks up there with what Peter Jackson did to Faramir.

Maybe it's because I'm not actually a hardcore Tolkien fan but the changes done in LotR are nothing compared to the changes and the disaster that GoT is now. I thought OotP was a terrible adaptation too, bland in comparison with the book themes but now it doesn't look THAT bad either...

[Wyman Manderly's Meat Pies]

I'm assuming you meant Genna Lannister? Or were you talking about Jaime's dream? Either way, it definitely would have been good to see those characters.

Genna yes. I meant to go check on the name but got distracted and hit post.

[WSmith84]

Jaime wandering around the Riverlands and Sansa doing jackshit in the Vale would've made for boring tv, but what they did in the show is also boring and pretty terrible.

It's a lose-lose situation, is what I'm saying.

But Jaime has some great stuff in the Riverlands; his meetings with Genna and the Blackfish, for example. The show only had to include the high moments. Jaime in Dorne is infinitely worse.

[Good Guy Garlan]

But Jaime has some great stuff in the Riverlands; his meetings with Genna and the Blackfish, for example. The show only had to include the high moments. Jaime in Dorne is infinitely worse.

Oh, I agree. I'm not a fan of his Feast chapters, but whatever they're doing in the show with him and Dorne is perhaps the show's biggest misfire to date.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

What has Jaime done that is impressive in the show?

He defeated Ned Stark in a scene that lasted a minute...

The he had his hand cut (♫ a bear! a bear! and the maiden faaair ♪)

His big one scene is him in a bathtub telling a story. So, it's not that people would get bored by people talking and telling stuff. Jaime in show, as in the books, spent mostly of the time captured or dragged around before he helped Tyrion escape. What got the Unsullied involved, as got us involved, is the power of his words.

It's not that his arc in Feast is boring either. He does a lot of things. First, he's an observer of Cersei going mad (he literally says she reminds him of the Mad King). We probably don't need him being the AreoCamera there but that's quite a powerful line that he needed to say. But of course, Cersei is sane in the show.

When he leaves, he meets Lance. We then see how broken he is and how Jaime is able to make him speak about his affair with Cersei. And this is how Jaime also breaks ("Tyrion wasn't joking! Has she been sexing Moonboy too?").

And we see Jaime the negotiator when he faces the Blackfish. That makes a powerful scene because we see Jaime so full of himself believing he will be remembered as Goldhand the Just and Brynden puts him back on his place: "no, you're the Kingslayer. Fuck you". Then he kinda embraces it and threatens Edmure with the trebuchet speech because deep inside not only he wants to fulfil his vows to Cat but because he honestly wants peace.

It was a very easy thing to adapt, tbh. Not everything needs to be HYPED WITH FIGHTS AND VIOLENCE to be entertaining. Maybe a few action moments between him and his party vs some bandits on the way to Darry but the rest had little issues to deal with.

[Takyon]

What has Jaime done that is impressive in the show?

He defeated Ned Stark in a scene that lasted a minute...

OT, but I recall Ned getting stabbed by one of Jaime's guards. As far as I could tell, Jaime was about to lose that fight.

[WSmith84]

What has Jaime done that is impressive in the show?

He defeated Ned Stark in a scene that lasted a minute...

The he had his hand cut (♫ a bear! a bear! and the maiden faaair ♪)

His big one scene is him in a bathtub telling a story. So, it's not that people would get bored by people talking and telling stuff. Jaime in show, as in the books, spent mostly of the time captured or dragged around before he helped Tyrion escape. What got the Unsullied involved, as got us involved, is the power of his words.

It's not that his arc in Feast is boring either. He does a lot of things. First, he's an observer of Cersei going mad (he literally says she reminds him of the Mad King). We probably don't need him being the AreoCamera there but that's quite a powerful line that he needed to say. But of course, Cersei is sane in the show.

When he leaves, he meets Lance. We then see how broken he is and how Jaime is able to make him speak about his affair with Cersei. And this is how Jaime also breaks ("Tyrion wasn't joking! Has she been sexing Moonboy too?").

And we see Jaime the negotiator when he faces the Blackfish. That makes a powerful scene because we see Jaime so full of himself believing he will be remembered as Goldhand the Just and Brynden puts him back on his place: "no, you're the Kingslayer. Fuck you". Then he kinda embraces it and threatens Edmure with the trebuchet speech because deep inside not only he wants to fulfil his vows to Cat but because he honestly wants peace.

It was a very easy thing to adapt, tbh. Not everything needs to be HYPED WITH FIGHTS AND VIOLENCE to be entertaining. Maybe a few action moments between him and his party vs some bandits on the way to Darry but the rest had little issues to deal with.

Agreed. I really enjoyed Jaime's stuff in Feast. I actually enjoyed a lot of Feast, barring Brienne and Sam's chapters. I enjoyed the Iron Islands and Dorne, I just thought that the mistake there was that there were too many unnecessary PoVs.

Still, not everyone loved it, and there is stuff that could be cut without harming the overall narrative. That's what I was expecting really. Not Charlie's Sandsnakes and 'fookin' and fightin'' Bronn (who, admittedly, I love).

Edit: Bronn could have easily gone with Jaime on his Riverlands tour, just as Ilyn payne does in Feast.

[Primalsplit]

Maybe it's because I'm not actually a hardcore Tolkien fan but the changes done in LotR are nothing compared to the changes and the disaster that GoT is now. I thought OotP was a terrible adaptation too, bland in comparison with the book themes but now it doesn't look THAT bad either...

Forgive the disruption but what is OotP? I don't even know how to send a pm now.

As for the topic. I can't agree with you more brothers and sisters. I can't agree more :cheers:

[protar]

Forgive the disruption but what is OotP? I don't even know how to send a pm now.

Order of the Phoenix, the fifth Harry Potter book/film.

[Richard Hoffman]

My wife, a non-book reader, who asks me for all the info while we watch watch and after had two very succinct moments of clarity:

1) During Sand Snakes: "Holy mother of ... that is cheesy."

2) Needing me to explain every single scene in more detail and context after this episode because the show provided NONE.

I can only imagine the connections the unsullied are making if they have no one to answer the questions. The quality is way down this season and has nothing to do with the books. Has everything to do with writers making crap up.

My wife has the same issue, especially during the first few episodes of a season after a year has gone by and the show mentions anyone that isn't a main POV. I think one of the biggest issues is trying to cram 700-1000 pages of a book (or over 30 hours of audible) into 53 minute x 10 episodes. A show season should be a minimum of 13 episodes, especially one with such a wide range of POV characters and the extended timeline.

As for the hate on this season I can agree with some of it being cheesy, especially the sand snakes (and the fight music wtf?), however with the two books they have to work with I expected this season to be 'meh', as feast and dance were both 'meh' imo. That doesn't mean it stopped me from reading/listening to them both 2 dozen times as I will watch this season over and over. I'm just grateful they are smashing through it rather than dragging it on as GRRM did for several seasons, not to mention pressing fast forward on the Sansa story. Stop expecting diamonds from cubic zirconium! :dunno:

[Stag_legion]

I think, in this video

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WbaslypgyWk

@17:00 GRRM give me an idea why Season 5 possibly failed.

D&D possibly "consulted" with the wrong focus group.

"We have only 2 women who actually fight, women must not just be manipulative"

-hence Sand snakes

"Hmm this semes ok, but the impact can be increased if we throw in some rape of major character"

- hence Sansa

"David, I feel we are concentrating on the same places. New locations will bring in more viewers"

-hence Dorne

Basically, I think they had to listen to a bunch of fools from HBO who demanded them to write according to what they thought will bring more viewers and maximize profit.

I agree. If it was up to D & D they would have killed stannis off in season 2 since he's not a young attractive character with unambiguous good morality.

[aFeastForDragons]

^I'm a bit worried they might axe Stannis early with some stupid Brienne fanfic. Giving the rest of his story to Jon or Sansa or someone else.

[Stag_legion]

^I'm a bit worried they might axe Stannis early with some stupid Brienne fanfic. Giving the rest of his story to Jon or Sansa or someone else.

you never know but if that happens it would be last straw for me with the show.

[Takyon]

I'm beginning to anticipate that Stannis will be killed this season. The Battle of Ice will only have one clear winner and his death would be a good set-up for Shireen's imminent sacrifice (unless Melisandre abandons Stannis, which isn't out of the question).

[Stag_legion]

I'm beginning to anticipate that Stannis will be killed this season. The Battle of Ice will only have one clear winner and his death would be a good set-up for Shireen's imminent sacrifice (unless Melisandre abandons Stannis, which isn't out of the question).

They can't really do that if stannis lives through much of TWOW or even survives the entire book. They can only kill him off if he also dies relatively early in TWOW.

I mean what are they going to do if in the books stannis is eventually going to have a show down with dany? the whole direction of the story could change if stannis is taken out prematurely.

[Metopheles]

^I'm a bit worried they might axe Stannis early with some stupid Brienne fanfic. Giving the rest of his story to Jon or Sansa or someone else.

Brienne is definitely going for Stannis.

They used their magic of foreshadowing to make this a thing that is just waiting to happen.

Either before she is going to rescue Sansa or when they fled WF, she will be close to Stannis and attempt to kill him and might even succeed.

[Stag_legion]

Brienne is definitely going for Stannis.

They used their magic of foreshadowing to make this a thing that is just waiting to happen.

Either before she is going to rescue Sansa or when they fled WF, she will be close to Stannis and attempt to kill him and might even succeed.

stannis is no push over on the show, they had him lead the assault in blackwater and he killed a few guys personally. But by D & D logic brienne can kill just about anyone ( remember the hound).

[Pashernate Reader]

It's not you. ;)

The show's quality took a nosedive toward the end of last season, and they haven't pulled it out yet.

But hope springs eternal.

[BendTheKnee15]

It's not you. ;)

The show's quality took a nosedive toward the end of last season, and they haven't pulled it out yet.

But hope springs eternal.

Take the sand snakes out and it's been a great season.

Stannis is getting his finally. ( he's a damn good actor)

They killed off Mance early ( because he just didn't fit the on screen mold) which was a great call.

The North has been fun to watch.

Dany and her story has boosted.

Dorne sux.

All in all pretty good season that will have epic endings.

[Stag_legion]

Take the sand snakes out and it's been a great season.

Stannis is getting his finally. ( he's a damn good actor)

They killed off Mance early ( because he just didn't fit the on screen mold) which was a great call.

The North has been fun to watch.

Dany and her story has boosted.

Dorne sux.

All in all pretty good season that will have epic endings.

meh while they have shown stannis in a more sympathetic light, they still don't have his characterization right, they haven't emphasized that he's a harsh but just man and that he is not a religious fanatic