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P. frontalis chiripepe

Dornish Disappointment

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^^^ Yet another great way to describe how this season fails to deliver in the quality department


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The problem with this (which doesn't sound bad, actually) is that the QM plot has a purpose. We're meant to feel sorry for Arianne because Arianne was, in a way, continuing his uncle's wishes. It was Oberyn who suggested the Queenmaker plot (although I don't think he was serious, it was nothing but a ruse to me) and Tyene and Arianne believed him. And it's also the fact that he died and the first time we saw Doran he says "well, he put himself in that position". Considering Oberyn is quite a popular character, it makes sense we cheer for Arianne and Oberyn's daughters.

But after the plan is botched, we are told exactly what is behind Doran's mind and actions. That's what make him a badass to the eyes of those who -like me- like him, because he says "You think I have no plan. I've had a plan for the last 17 years and I even got to fool you, Arianne". Which is true, as no one in KL suspects he was hoping to back up a Targaryen and kill them all.

That's why I like Doran and I feel that's the reason GRRM likes him too (or that's why he created him in that way): anyone can jump and kill a person out of rage. It would have taken little for him to capture Jon Arryn, kill him and declare war to the Iron Throne. He had to swallow the bitter taste of feasting with one of the architects of the rebellion that got his sister and his niece and nephew not only killed but butchered. Oberyn's rage is something we can understand but as soon as he stepped on KL, he started to think with his lance (the real one). He jumped at the very first opportunity to kill Clegane and, had they hadn't been given Myrcella, walking away with the man they accused of killing the King, would have meant war against Dorne one way or another.

The QM plan is something that is also show us how making assumptions is wrong. Arianne feels many Lords would back her up in her rebellion. Only six people worked with her, and while one of them was not even noble, another one was not completely on agreement. Every other lord seems to be in good terms with Doran, even those who are historically his enemies. Because Doran has kept them away from the war and protected. They all were on the plan of keeping Balon Swann entertained and those who were parents of Arianne's friends accepted the punishment or gave some of their own. It was a way to portray how close Doran is to his Lords and Ladies.

Of course, D&D only got the Queenmaker plan because "awesome!".

I agree with all that. I love the snake and the grass metaphor Doran uses. I'm just not sure the show cares as much about those motivations. Part of the issue is the fact that Doran, as far as we know, only has one heir, not 3. So his long-term plans can't be the same as the books. I think I still prefer the book version but going to try to withhold judgment to see how they play it out. But he obviously can't do both Queenmaker and send the Sand Snakes on covert ops, which is a plot j am really looking forward to see develop in TWOW.

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I'm talking about the way she does it. She never tries to avoid violence.

She offered the Hound mercy and said she didn't want to kill him.

BookBrienne actually tried to avoid getting into a fight, she didn't relish them with outright bloodlust at times. She even felt bad about killing a crazy clown rapist. She was a nobler character. ShowBrienne is so easygoing with killing people left and right you wonder how she got started. I'd be surprised if Tarth weren't full of mysteriously missing squires. Her first on-screen kills she dispatches so ruthlessly, her only mourning spared for Renly.

Book Brienne is years younger than Show Brienne. She is more innocent and has had less life experience. It's true that she was greatly pained when she made her first kills. But by the time she killed Rorge, her initial horror at having taken a life had lessened. It stands to reason that an older Brienne would be less sensitive.

Moreover, Show Brienne does not relish indiscriminately in bloodlust. She slays cruel murderers. She kills in self-defense or to protect others. She offers mercy when she can. Nothing you’ve mentioned makes her a thug. It just puts her on par with pretty much any male hero fulfilling the role of a knight.

Compared to BookBrienne, ShowBrienne is a slightly nicer version of the Hound with honor.

She's never slaughtered an innocent child and enjoyed it. Show Brienne and the Hound remain worlds apart.

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I've been trying to go into the TV version of Dorne with optimism up until now, but by episode 506 I can say that I think I'm a bit disappointed with it. I'm not very impressed with how they've portrayed the Sand Snakes so far. They resemble the Three Stooges more than the competent war machines they were built up to be. Even Jaime and Bronn's arc has been underwhelming for me. I felt it was a bit contrived that they just happened to arrive at the exact right time, right down to the minute, to intervene in the sand snakes' plot. Anyone else feeling slight disappointment here?

On a side note. I think that was Tyene that sliced Bronn. She's the poison expert like her father. Could this be the end for Bronn?

Dorne has been a huge disappointment (and I came into this storyline with an open mind). Ellaria comes off like an irrational fool. The Sand Snakes are embarrassing. Their fight scene even more so. I honestly feel like Power Rangers had better choreography. Trystane looks like he should be in a boy band. I can't take him seriously. Doran and Areo Hotah have potential, but they've barely had anything to do.

To make matters worse, Jaime hasn't had a crumb of character development yet. While not awful, Jaime and Bronn's interactions haven't been as funny as I would have thought (underwhelming is spot on). And I don't care for new Myrcella. She feels bland to me. I liked Aimee Richardson better.

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This plot was such a disservice to Jaime's character. Not only because he's had zero character development, but because he's hardly recognizable as his witty, sardonic self. His aFfC chapters are meandering and dull, but at least he remains entertaining through them all.

In the show he's boring as dirt, though. And I love show!Bronn, I do, but he's stealing Jaime's spotlight from his own storyline to the point that he resembles book!Jaime even more than show!Jaime, which is insane.

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This plot was such a disservice to Jaime's character. Not only because he's had zero character development, but because he's hardly recognizable as his witty, sardonic self. His aFfC chapters are meandering and dull, but at least he remains entertaining through them all.

In the show he's boring as dirt, though. And I love show!Bronn, I do, but he's stealing Jaime's spotlight from his own storyline to the point that he resembles book!Jaime even more than show!Jaime, which is insane.

they've weirdly mellowed out jaime since season 4 imo (with the exception of the rape scene ofc). in the books he always had this biting, sarcastic, funny attitude even after his redemption. when he and cersei argued in AFFC it was an equal thing, two lions going at each other. while in the show, he just makes these stupid puppy eyes lol. and god he's just so fucking stupid, bronn is so much smarter than him.

I know people complain about show cersei all the time here, but she's still so much more entertaining and interesting than show jaime and show tyrion imo. nikolaj's acting has been bland as fuck this season and peter is phoning it in. with the exception of a couple of questionable line deliveries, lena has been great imo

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This plot was such a disservice to Jaime's character. Not only because he's had zero character development, but because he's hardly recognizable as his witty, sardonic self. His aFfC chapters are meandering and dull, but at least he remains entertaining through them all.

In the show he's boring as dirt, though. And I love show!Bronn, I do, but he's stealing Jaime's spotlight from his own storyline to the point that he resembles book!Jaime even more than show!Jaime, which is insane.

What are you saying? Jaime is not in the show this season. He might be solving his differences with Stoneheart or Bran... that would be a more interesting plot.

And speaking of which, Jaime's thoughts are hilarious. Also his whole "yeah, I fucked my sister and killed a child due to that. What? Are yo gonna tell anyone, eh?" attitude towards Payne. I mean, a part of me wants us and him to find out he learned to write or something and he's telling everybody that Jaime indeed confessed to have sex with his sister and he becomes the most popular beloved guy from Westeros or something :lol:

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they've weirdly mellowed out jaime since season 4 imo (with the exception of the rape scene ofc). in the books he always had this biting, sarcastic, funny attitude even after his redemption. when he and cersei argued in AFFC it was an equal thing, two lions going at each other. while in the show, he just makes these stupid puppy eyes lol. and god he's just so fucking stupid, bronn is so much smarter than him.

The first couple seasons he was such an interesting character in the show. The actor knocked it outta the park, and love him or hate him, he was damn interesting to see on-screen.

Now, I have no idea what they're asking him to portray on-screen.

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Jaime's part in books was one of the few that could have been translated in the show just as it was because we aren't just discovering that Jaime is not an idiot but completely the other way around: he turned out to be quite a diplomat and very smart despite his own doubts about being Tywin's "true" heir despite he doesn't fill like he would fit the rule nor he wanted to.



They changed "I'm threatening a man to send his son to him with a trebuchet because fuck, I'm Tywin's son" to "omg, they're after us! they're gonna destroy it! Carol! Do something, Carol! The Dornish! The Dornish!!!".


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The Dornish arc feels entirely too... structured. Like it was boiled down and revised by a screenwriter. Obviously it was but this feels way more contrived than Sansa's arc (which has elements derived from the books).



If Jaime had to go to Dorne for whatever reason, they should have kept it in line with the books: have him go to Dorne to deliver Doran the head of Ser Gregor Clegane. Like Balon Swann, have Jaime secretly plot to steal away Myrcella.



A lot of people like Show!Bronn but I'm not feeling it. His prowess depends too much on what the plot requires. How can he defeat mounted soldiers but struggle against two Sand Snakes? It's illogical. Who send the viper statue and why?


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How did they get Myrcella's necklace in the first place anyway? I thought it represented a some kind of bond between her and Carol. Myrcella doesn't even seem to miss it. I mean what the heck :dunno:


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