Bobby b's bobby Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 #Totalcrackpot.So why is tyrion a boring Saint and cersei in the right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channel4s-JonSnow Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 So why is tyrion a boring Saint and cersei in the right Both of those statements are incorrect and totally crackpot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Both of those statements are incorrect and totally crackpot. Both are being whitewashed though, while the contrary happens to Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Both of those statements are incorrect and totally crackpot.The first is correct tyrion can do no wrong, I do think cersei is in the right in the show she's missing a lot of her bad moments like not paying the bank bevause she doesn't want to is turned into Lannisters have no gold so it's not a choice or framing margery instead of paranoia about a prophecy it's because margery is trying to replace her and is manipulating/abusing her 13 year old son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channel4s-JonSnow Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 The first is correct tyrion can do no wrong, I do think cersei is in the right in the show she's missing a lot of her bad moments like not paying the bank bevause she doesn't want to is turned into Lannisters have no gold so it's not a choice or framing margery instead of paranoia about a prophecy it's because margery is trying to replace her and is manipulating/abusing her 13 year old son.Tyrions first scene involves him having sex with 3 prostitutes. He is drunk through most of this season. He killed his own father. I mean I could go on, hes not been whitewashed at all. Has he spent this season rolling around moaning and going on about whores, no, but thank god for that.Cercei stupdily armed the Faith Militant, and had Margery and Loras thrown into jail. She also appointed her own small council and tried to turn her son against his wife. Shes not as paranoid and delusional as in the books , which is actually a shame, but shes hardly been whitewashed either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Tyrions first scene involves him having sex with 3 prostitutes. He is drunk through most of this season. He killed his own father. I mean I could go on, hes not been whitewashed at all. Has he spent this season rolling around moaning and going on about whores, no, but thank god for that.Cercei stupdily armed the Faith Militant, and had Margery and Loras thrown into jail. She also appointed her own small council and tried to turn her son against his wife. Shes not as paranoid and delusional as in the books , which is actually a shame, but shes hardly been whitewashed either.I think we have different understandings of what whitewashed means to me it doesn't mean they have no flaws it just means they've took away a lot of the bad and replaced it with good like cersei and tyrion.What wrong with sex with prostitutes he's paying right? and I wouldn't say thank God he got over murdering his father after a few days of self pity and a eunuch stroking his cock/egoI don't get why naming her own council is bad especially when it's not her book council of sycophants and idiots. I'd say shes fine arresting margery and loras and being tricked into arming the faith isnt evil just dumb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channel4s-JonSnow Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I think we have different understandings of what whitewashed means to me it doesn't mean they have no flaws it just means they've took away a lot of the bad and replaced it with good like cersei and tyrion.What wrong with sex with prostitutes he's paying right? and I wouldn't say thank God he got over murdering his father after a few days of self pity and a eunuch stroking his cock/egoI don't get why naming her own council is bad especially when it's not her book council of sycophants and idiots. I'd say shes fine arresting margery and loras and being tricked into arming the faith isnt evil just dumbTyrion isn't evil in the books. Hes just conflicted.Cercei isn't evil in the books, shes just paranoid and bitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Tyrion isn't evil in the books. Hes just conflicted.Cercei isn't evil in the books, shes just paranoid and bitter.Cersei is she killed her friend at 10 for looking at jaime, had plenty of Roberts bastards killed at least one was a baby, chose to cuckold the king which was pretty much always going to cause civil war and death, then when she gets into power she makes up bs about margery to get her arrested using torture, had Robert and the Westerosi pope killedTyrion is probably dark grey but he did commit 2 rapes kill a singer for blackmail want to crown Myrcella just to hurt cersei and murdered shae I'll let him away with tywin there's years of abuse there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Mulder Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Tyrion isn't evil in the books. Hes just conflicted.Cercei isn't evil in the books, shes just paranoid and bitter.You really need to reread the books, one can call her insane and not responsible for her actions due to her insanity. But other than that argument she's clearly evil. Unless murder and torture is not evil in your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channel4s-JonSnow Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 You really need to reread the books, one can call her insane and not responsible for her actions due to her insanity. But other than that argument she's clearly evil. Unless murder and torture is not evil in your eyes. I literally just read it and I disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalerionTheCat Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I literally just read it and I disagree. At 12, she murdered her friend because she said she wanted to marry Jaime. And she is not evil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channel4s-JonSnow Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 In Feast most of her actions are due to paranoia, loss and grief, and she does almost everything to protect her children. Its debatable whether she is pure evil or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGBeyondAsshai Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Tyrion isn't evil in the books. Hes just conflicted.Cercei isn't evil in the books, shes just paranoid and bitter.I actually agree with Tyrion--he's deeply gray, but there are reasons and he has a compassion and intelligence in him that keeps finding its way through. Cersei however? No. In the books she murdered a childhood friend out of jealousy, tortured her baby brother physically, guided her twin into sexual relations (and yes, it was clearly her). She hates being female because of her belief that she would be taken seriously if she was Jaime, so she only uses her sexuality to cause pain or satisfy her egotism. She spoiled Joffrey and mocked Tommen's weakness. She set the entire kingdom back a century with High Sparrow bs for vanity. Just so she could get Margery out of the picture and not have competition for beauty or power. Every time she was given an opportunity for redemption she sneered at it and she cares about herself above all things, despite her constant insistence that its for her children. She wants to burn everything and everyone. Cersei is more Aerys 2.0 than a Lannister. She may not be pure evil, but she seems determined to head in that direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Writhen Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Hmm wonder why Cersei would be much like the Mad King... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TepidHands Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I actually agree with Tyrion--he's deeply gray, but there are reasons and he has a compassion and intelligence in him that keeps finding its way through. Cersei however? No. In the books she murdered a childhood friend out of jealousy, tortured her baby brother physically, guided her twin into sexual relations (and yes, it was clearly her). She hates being female because of her belief that she would be taken seriously if she was Jaime, so she only uses her sexuality to cause pain or satisfy her egotism. She spoiled Joffrey and mocked Tommen's weakness. She set the entire kingdom back a century with High Sparrow bs for vanity. Just so she could get Margery out of the picture and not have competition for beauty or power. Every time she was given an opportunity for redemption she sneered at it and she cares about herself above all things, despite her constant insistence that its for her children. She wants to burn everything and everyone. Cersei is more Aerys 2.0 than a Lannister. She may not be pure evil, but she seems determined to head in that direction. 'Zackly. If for nothing else, one line: "We have a wolf." Any gray she had then just blew right off her, and left her black as pitch, show AND books. Martin writes, "Her voice was very quiet, but her green eyes shone with triumph." It wasn't about any wolf, it was about shaming Robert and hurting the Starks. Because "Lyanna." RIP, Lady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 'Zackly. If for nothing else, one line: "We have a wolf." Any gray she had then just blew right off her, and left her black as pitch, show AND books. Martin writes, "Her voice was very quiet, but her green eyes shone with triumph." It wasn't about any wolf, it was about shaming Robert and hurting the Starks. Because "Lyanna." RIP, Lady. That's a bit too early to leave her beyond being redeemed it's a wolf it's not like she flayed Arya or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primalsplit Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 It's like killing a dog owned by a family you happen to hate only because your spouse wanted to marry someone from that said family. There is room for redemption of course. But this is murder out of unrightful spite. Her unjust spite is not even caused by anything done by that wolf. It's not something to easily shrug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 It's like killing a dog owned by a family you happen to hate only because your spouse wanted to marry someone from that said family. There is room for redemption of course. But this is murder out of unrightful spite. Her unjust spite is not even caused by anything done by that wolf. It's not something to easily shrug. To be fair, many people would object to having a wield animal near their son right after they maimed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TepidHands Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 To be fair, many people would object to having a wield animal near their son right after they maimed him. IIRC Joffrey was the weird animal. It wasn't even the same WOLF! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shitmouth the Wise Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 Well, to be fair, this is not just GoT's problem. A lot of recent media needs to be "explained" by the author/writer after its culmination because they rely on having an off-screen/page way to do it. You're definitely right about that. But I'm of the opinion that it either shouldn't need to be explained, or if it does, it's a failure of the director/writer. First thing that comes to mind is the Sopranos finale; David Chase has dismissed several competing theories (including that it's SUPPOSED to be ambiguous, and that Tony's dead) without ever bothering to explain it. He's treading that line where (for him) explaining it means admitting failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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