GRRM Seemingly Confirms Euron Went to Valyria

[Springwatch]

4 hours ago, Frey family reunion said:

Schrödinger’ s cat

At least the cat has to make its mind up eventually...

7 hours ago, butterweedstrover said:

Or maybe it wasn't a mystery and you just thought it was to make the narrative fit the story you want told. It was never framed as a mystery, he comes back with ancient magic, knowledge, and skills to help conquer Westeros. Hence plot. 

There's plenty of mystery. How Euron got in and out of Valyria without physical harm is very mysterious, given Valyria's record of killing everybody. And the narrative purpose of the Reader and his challenge, that's mysterious too.

7 hours ago, butterweedstrover said:

The historical questions of "how, when, where," are meaningless as this isn't a historical investigation, its character building. Valyria exists to shape the characters, not vice versa. It can take whatever form the narrative needs it to take, it isn't an independent body separate to the story. 

Good characters need a good fictional universe to express themselves in, to be moved and shaped by. You can't have the lethal nature of Valyria suddenly not apply to Euron. There's a story to be told, and we deserve to hear it.

Edited May 18, 2023 by Springwatch
word

[sweetsunray]

4 hours ago, Springwatch said:

I've listened to it several times and the above is accurate.

So. To support the statement that Euron went to Valyria, GRRM uses exactly the one item that the official app says Euron did not get from Valyria.

#unreliableauthor confirmed.

No he does not explicitly say that Euron got the horn from Valyria.

[chrisdaw]

9 hours ago, Craving Peaches said:

I don't care either way actually, it was just a suggestion...

And if we were supposed to 100% believe that Euron went there then why does he run out the room shortly after being asked whether he's really been to Valyria? If the author's intent is that Euron has undoubtedly been to Valyria then why include that interaction between Rodrick and Euron?

You're right it was meant to be doubted, so that it could overwhelmingly crushed by the reveals in the forsaken.

Also the Reader's standing up and challenging Euron brings Euron to a realisation. Euron came with a plan, the Reader's interaction makes Euron rethink and change his plan, that's why he's pissed.

Euron seated himself and gave his cloak a twitch, so it covered his private parts. "I had forgotten what a small and noisy folk they are, my ironborn. I would bring them dragons, and they shout out for grapes."

GRRM wants Euron's course correction on page, wants us to know it, and something was required to bring it about. To speculate he wanted Euron to stay in Westeros and Vic to go to Dany and this was how he brought it about when the logical thing would be for Euron to just go himself. Another reason I would suggest is he wants to ram home the point Euron doesn't care about worldly loot to the point where he forgot regular men do, because he's built different, he is perusing something grand and supernatural.

[Springwatch]

8 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

No he does not explicitly say that Euron got the horn from Valyria.

The horn has no place in the sentence except to support the idea of Euron being in Valyria. That is how the language is understood. Possibly GRRM is being devious, but that's still a deception.

[sweetsunray]

4 hours ago, Springwatch said:

The horn has no place in the sentence except to support the idea of Euron being in Valyria. That is how the language is understood. Possibly GRRM is being devious, but that's still a deception.

That is your interpretation based on the assumption that GRRM is a liar, both when interpreting text in the novels, with George's choice and collaboration with illustrators and with interviews.

Edited May 19, 2023 by sweetsunray

[Springwatch]

22 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

That is your interpretation based on the assumption that GRRM is a liar, both when interpreting text in the novels, with George's choice and collaboration with illustrators and with interviews.

Before we get down to quarrelling - what about illustrators?

[sweetsunray]

6 hours ago, Springwatch said:

Before we get down to quarrelling - what about illustrators?

A topic on which you already expressed your opinion in another thread. Basically, you cherry pick what must be canon depending on your own hypothesis, and in a very inconsistent way. Because here you are both trying to argue that George deceives and lies, while simultaneously making your interpretation of the words in an interview factual. Your argument makes no sense to me. And that's all I'm going to say about it. I have no interest in a back and forth over this.

ETA: after checking up on the illustration comments, I must retract my mention of "illustrators" as I confused Springwatch with another poster.

Edited May 19, 2023 by sweetsunray

[YeniAy_Ottoman]

20 hours ago, Yaya said:

@YeniAy_Ottoman

 

it is hard to hear & the closed-captions are whack.

this is what i can hear:
-----------
(someone asks:  another quick question?)

GRRM:  i don't promise any answers - haaahahahaahahaaahahaaahaha.

(a voice interrupts - 'sorry have to go?')

GRRM:
Motions to the question asker: ask your question.

QUESTION:
Just quickly, since the Doom of Valyria no one has been able to step into it or sail near it but there are rumours someone was able to so is there any magic strong enough to withstand the curse that is placed up on Valyria & if so which magic is that?

GRRM:
I don't know about magic ... but there are people who have gone to Valyria & you know one of them is present in the book, Euron with his horn ... ah which is definitely of Valyrian manufacture and you may find out more about Valyria & who's gone there and some people go there and they don't get to leave again - haaahahahaahahaaahahaaahaha ...
-----------

one must remember the time context:  this was in December 2016.  
all the canon is published, the "dump-truck full of money" was into season 7.

 

 

Thank you, GRRM seems to have confirmed this. He used a very clear expression, I don't think it's open to discussion. Thanks again.

[Springwatch]

4 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

A topic on which you already expressed your opinion in another thread. Basically, you cherry pick what must be canon depending on your own hypothesis, and in a very inconsistent way. Because here you are both trying to argue that George deceives and lies, while simultaneously making your interpretation of the words in an interview factual. Your argument makes no sense to me. And that's all I'm going to say about it. I have no interest in a back and forth over this.

Rude as ever, I see. I won't miss you. And I get the last word, lovely!

I don't see any contradiction in checking the truth of GRRM's statements. 

Sorry about the cherry-picking and inconsistency and illustrators, but I have no idea what you're talking about. And to be totally, totally clear, I'm not running multiple user names. It's just me.

[Springwatch]

5 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

That is your interpretation based on the assumption that GRRM is a liar, both when interpreting text in the novels, with George's choice and collaboration with illustrators and with interviews.

Liar is a strong word, implying malice. I don't think GRRM is malicious. He is capable of making statements that turn out to be false when checked against the books - I gave the example of him saying Sansa is a more sympathetic character now she's taken responsibility for her part in her father's death. She didn't have a part in her father's death, and she's not shown any signs of taking responsibility for it. He's said other odd things about Sansa, and so I guess probably he's not totally reliable on other topics either.

Like this one. 

there are people who have gone to Valyria & you know one of them is present in the book, Euron with his horn ... ah which is definitely of Valyrian manufacture

It's just one sentence - the definitely Valyrian horn does support the assertion that Euron went to Valyria, that's how the sentence reads. Why mention it otherwise? If the horn came from the warlocks, it serves no function in that sentence, it would be hopelessly misleading.

Which brings us to collaborators. We're told the official app states that the horn came from the warlocks. Here's the thing: no collaborator has permission to mess around with major characters or important items such as the dragon horn, because that would have a severe impact on GRRM's writing. So we must assume that nugget of information came from GRRM himself. And the effect of that nugget is that the interview statement becomes questionable, and we can carry on arguing Euron and Valyria just as before.

Which brings us to my original point: it is most likely GRRM prefers a live topic to a settled and dead one.

 

Edited May 19, 2023 by Springwatch
word, attempted formatting...

[Springwatch]

 For what it's worth, if the app is correct, then Euron is telling lies to the Ironborn:

Quote

"That horn you heard I found among the smoking ruins that were Valyria, where no man has dared walk but me. You heard its call, and felt its power.[...] With this horn, ironmen, I can bind dragons to my will."

 

Edited May 21, 2023 by Springwatch

[hnv]

GRRM's world has rules, and its hard to trespass them, when one does that it's usually with a degree of cunning but with a price.

 

I think Euron wearing the armour might have ventured into Valyria, but it also cost him going completely mad, or perhaps even be possessed by something magically evil