Does anyone actually support the Greens?

[Craving Peaches]

To be honest I think the writing for the Dance dropped the ball a bit, and could have used a few more revisions because a lot of it doesn't make much sense.

[csuszka1948]

Is the vote during the Great Council secret? Do great Lord get one vote as well as smaller lords?

Because considering that the Starks and their major vassals, the Blackwoods (please George :D) the Baratheons and most Crowlander houses supported Laenor, the 20:1 rate makes little to no sense.

 

That said, I agree that it makes little sense that the Greens - after seizing power - didn't try to call a Great Council, because the experience of the last council (even if Laenor didn't win that 20:1) shows that they would have a decent chance at winning. Rhaenyra would understandably reject it, and the war would start not long afterwards.

[csuszka1948]

6 hours ago, Craving Peaches said:

To be honest I think the writing for the Dance dropped the ball a bit, and could have used a few more revisions because a lot of it doesn't make much sense.

 

 

 

Honestly, even the roots of the Dance are a bit weird.

Why is Otto so desperate to name Rhaenyra heir over Daemon when he hopes Viserys will soon marry her daughter?

It would make more sense if Aemma seemed to be unable to birth a healthy child and (after one of Daemon's poor jokes) Otto convinced Viserys to make Rhaenyra his heir, but Aemma got pregnant and died birthing another unhealthy child or died from another cause.

 

Similarly, I think it would make more sense if (say) Alicent and Rhaenyra came to some sort of agreement, and it was the Aemond-Lucerys incident that made relations between them forever broken and war would have followed not long after. The only problem is that it would have made Daemon having two children with Rhaenyra who inherit (because Daemon is George's favorite) problematic.

Edited June 30, 2023 by csuszka1948

[Lord Varys]

8 hours ago, csuszka1948 said:

Is the vote during the Great Council secret? Do great Lord get one vote as well as smaller lords?

Because considering that the Starks and their major vassals, the Blackwoods (please George :D) the Baratheons and most Crowlander houses supported Laenor, the 20:1 rate makes little to no sense.

One imagines that voting is secret, but before it there are debates and deliberations with various lords championing this or that claim. Most likely it is one vote per ruling lord, with, perhaps, some more votes given to lords paramount - although there is no actually proof for this nor is it necessary. Might also be that landed knights got votes if they attended.

The support for Viserys clearly would be easily explained by both many bannermen of the Starks and Baratheons leaning towards Viserys and casting their votes ... but mostly because we can imagine that the Westermen and the Reach and the majority of the Riverlords and the Vale supported Viserys.

Lady Jeyne Arryn was already ruling in the Vale, but still a little girl not attending the council, and her Lord Protector, Yorbert Royce, spoke for her, so there was likely no passionate speech for female line inheritance there ... even less so in light of the fact that Viserys was married to Aemma Arryn and Daemon to Rhea Royce - who may have been Yorbert's daughter or granddaughter.

8 hours ago, csuszka1948 said:

That said, I agree that it makes little sense that the Greens - after seizing power - didn't try to call a Great Council, because the experience of the last council (even if Laenor didn't win that 20:1) shows that they would have a decent chance at winning. Rhaenyra would understandably reject it, and the war would start not long afterwards.

After crowning Aegon II it would have been futile. A crowned and anointed king doesn't need votes. If they wanted to go with a Great Council it should have been between Viserys' death and the coronation.

And thinking more about it - the story could have also profited from things if Viserys I had convened another grand ceremony/council-like gathering to have the lords renew their vows to Rhaenyra ... only to die suddenly and unexpectedly before this came about ... with the lords travelling to KL being welcomed (and arrested) by the new king, Aegon II.

Then we would have a setting where Rhaenyra and her supporters definitely would accuse the Greens of having murdered Viserys I because they would have profited most from his sudden demise - even if he actually died suddenly of natural causes.

9 hours ago, csuszka1948 said:

Honestly, even the roots of the Dance are a bit weird.

Why is Otto so desperate to name Rhaenyra heir over Daemon when he hopes Viserys will soon marry her daughter?

It would make more sense if Aemma seemed to be unable to birth a healthy child and (after one of Daemon's poor jokes) Otto convinced Viserys to make Rhaenyra his heir, but Aemma got pregnant and died birthing another unhealthy child or died from another cause.

The timeline is pretty crammed there. It may have made more sense if Rhaenyra was Viserys' preferred heir even before Aemma's death, and him making it official caused a real rift between him and Daemon. Otto making Alicent the new queen should have been independent of the succession issue.

9 hours ago, csuszka1948 said:

Similarly, I think it would make more sense if (say) Alicent and Rhaenyra came to some sort of agreement, and it was the Aemond-Lucerys incident that made relations between them forever broken and war would have followed not long after. The only problem is that it would have made Daemon having two children with Rhaenyra who inherit (because Daemon is George's favorite) problematic.

Big problem in the narrative there is that nothing important seemed to have happened between 120 and 129 AC ... when realistically things should have gotten really bad in those years as the children grew older and really started to hate each other.

Rhaenyra-Alicent is totally the evil stemother thing since Alicent is ten years older than Rhaenyra in the book ... and there is just no chance that an 8-12-year-old starts this kind of toxic quarrel with her stepmother. Even if Rhaenyra grew into a troublesome adolescent it would the fucking duty of her stepmother to not let that get to her, to not pick on her, to not bully her, etc. ... and all we actually see in the early phase of the quarrel is that Alicent picks on Rhaenyra, never the other way around.

[Lord of Oldstones]

Black fandom are insufferable claiming widow law BS, my god that law was just property law so that children of older wife wasn't overlooked and  it doesnt mean everything belonged to kids of 1st wives & it was likely a law for peasants. Next is calling Green Targaryens as Hightowers, claiming more Targ bloodline while Strong boys have less Targ blood than Greens. 

I wont even talk about that stupid show.