SeanF Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 I'm pretty sure Illyrio and Varys had no idea the dragon eggs would hatch. They were fossilized for at least 100 years. Maybe they were given as a wedding gift to be eventually sold to fund a fleet to bring Kahl Drogo's army to Westros. If they have a cache of dragon eggs somewhere, it would be like having a cache of Picassos or moon rocks...priceless, but useless. The hatching of the dragons likely was a result of a combination of unlikely events: Blood magic (death of Rhogo, Drogo, and the witch tied to the pyre) & a girl that could not be burnt to be their mother. Quite so. The dragon eggs were a valuable gift, but Illyrio never expected them to hatch. Illyrio wished the best for Daenerys, but never expected her to survive (let alone her idiot brother). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jory's Shade Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Since some people seem to think Arya might be in King's Landing, and some seem to think Varys could be a Faceless Man... maybe Varys is Izembaro? That was my thoughts exactly. Old Tom being warged by Arya to spy on Tommen is a cool notion as well. Not as cool as Rheaynas warged into the cat, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anarchymilkshake Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 She was in Bravos at her last chapter. Time has passed since then. (And there are other reasons for my thinking this.) Would appreciate less rudeness. Thank you. I agree, She's going to Izembero for her first apprenticeship(DWD847). Perhaps Izembero is a person and they went to Westeros as a test for her loyalty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyron Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Pycelle was loyal to House Lannister and pretty much the only advisor that Cersei had who was actually worth anything. Now the Citadel will have to send a new maester, who will probably be a Tyrell. Maybe there is a certain maester that Varys have had groomed for this purpose, he is too cunning to not have his hand in something at the citadel also. Or as you say maybe a Tyrell, that would stir things up at the Red keep, maybe ease the way in for YG. I'm thinking there might be another purpose to killing Pycelle on top of it, the Citadel is working against the powers of magic, as we have heard many times since maester Luwin, and many have discussed in other threads. Varys on the other hand, he might know more than he has shown about magic, possibly he's a skinchanger, or some say a faceless man, paving the way for the dragons (the magic of blood and fire). He might have tossed the mad king and prince Rhaegar against eachother because he knew they were not "real" dragons, they could not hatch dragon eggs. And Varys knew this had to happen, because of the winter that was coming. Or because he knew something of Rheagars ability to change skins to? Or maybe he just wanted to get rid of the mad king Aerys, helping push him over the edge into madness, for the prince to take over but then Rhaegar was killed from something Varys did not have his hand in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
violet storm Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 Kevan seemed to be the main target, Pycelle is a "cherry on top". I think Varys actually likes messy KL situation, since it helps Targs to come back, and having Pycelle helping Cersei did not mess with his plans. Might mess with Margaery trial though, since he was the one having evidence against her... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterfell is Burning Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 Maybe Varys was just sick of the old man? Who wouldn't after having to see him virtually every day for 20 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellebore Posted October 8, 2011 Share Posted October 8, 2011 I can honestly say I did not see this coming :dunce: .. I thought for sure Kevan would make it through to see Cersei's Trial by Battle andhave some say in Tommen's Reign (however short that may be), and so I was shocked when he was killed, and then for it to be Varys was amazing! I've been wanting to know what he's been up to since the previous death by crossbow in the series..lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hesitantreader Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 I think from this chapter it is safe to say Varys is not a faceless man. First he knew Kevan which would make him the wrong choice to kill him. Second he killed Pycelle as well and faceless men only kill the one person marked for death. As for the actual kill I could not help but notice the parallel with the last Jon chapter with the ring of daggers. Also where those children or others? It is likely that they were children, but what a creepy description. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyron Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 I think from this chapter it is safe to say Varys is not a faceless man. First he knew Kevan which would make him the wrong choice to kill him. Second he killed Pycelle as well and faceless men only kill the one person marked for death. As for the actual kill I could not help but notice the parallel with the last Jon chapter with the ring of daggers. Also where those children or others? It is likely that they were children, but what a creepy description.I agree, I don't think Varys is a faceless man. For the same reasons you state and also it seems likely to me that the FM leave or at least give a coin to the victim, but I'm not entirely sure. I just wrote about it in another thread about Faceless men. Edit: strike the coin thing, I forgot the poison that was connected to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerWilliam Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Deleted as my point is already well covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liathano Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Personally, I believe Varys has gone to way too much effort that points in the direction of helping the realm, to NOT have the realm's best interest in mind. His whole thing playing Rhaegar off against Aerys is due to the fact that Aerys was mad and needed to do something that would doom him, and keep Rhaegar safe. He would've been privy to the knowledge that Baratheon had all the odds stacked in his favour, so Varys likely tried to send Rhaegar away, thinking it'd spare him. Obviously things don't always go to plan, so it didn't spare him. I'd initially wondered by Aegon was hidden the whole time, but it makes sense that Varys was trying not to put all his eggs in one basket, since nothing EVER goes as planned - and instead split them all up. Illyrio gave the eggs to Dany because she's the only one that doesn't get burned by fire (I'm guessing illyrio figured this out at some point, otherwise it wasn't that reasoning, but rather because Aegon isn't a pure Targ). Ill and Var couldn't exactly invest in only one person, as I mentioned before they couldn't risk one of them dieing off and ruining all their hard work. That last point brings me to something else that niggles at me. WHY THE HELL DO SO MANY PEOPLE IN THIS WORLD PUT ALL THEIR EGGS IN ONE BASKET?!!! Surely once you've been living in a world that has no fast means of communication or travel, you'd become accustomed to being really cautious and expecting that you can't just expect things to go exactly as planned?! I mean Cat's whole thing with sending Jaimie off was doomed from the get go. This isn't utopia lady, there's a freaking war going down, what the hell do you expect?!It seems to me that only Tyrion, Varys, and Illyrio grasp this blatantly obvious concept, and all the others are just stone cold fools who deserve their Darwin award. / rant ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liathano Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I certainly lived in a time without cellphones and internet, and remember quite clearly having to make complex arrangements, or making plan B's and C's in case things went wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastKing Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 This is a theory without much basis in fact right now. The children for Varys are some of the Children of the Forest. The Children of the Forest 'probably' want dragons back in Westeros. By helping Varys, they can get Targs back in Westeros with less opposition. My thought is the Children of the Forest want dragons back in Westeros to help fight The Others. But there are no facts at all to support this and is mere speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrionthebest Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 This is a theory without much basis in fact right now. The children for Varys are some of the Children of the Forest. The Children of the Forest 'probably' want dragons back in Westeros. By helping Varys, they can get Targs back in Westeros with less opposition. My thought is the Children of the Forest want dragons back in Westeros to help fight The Others. But there are no facts at all to support this and is mere speculation.Nah, that is too much crackpottery . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyron Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Re: The last king I think Varys children were whitefaced with dark eyes from living in the walls of the Red Keep. Light deprivation. Large pupils because of the darkness. They have nothing in common with the Children of the forest, looks-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastKing Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 Re: The last king I think Varys children were whitefaced with dark eyes from living in the walls of the Red Keep. Light deprivation. Large pupils because of the darkness. They have nothing in common with the Children of the forest, looks-wise. The description of the Children of the Forest in the wiki describe them as "They were smaller than men with nut-brown skin and large ears, they usually had large golden eyes, but a few had green or red eyes". That sounds like a similar description as the children that helped Varys. Large eyes, small like children. They also have lived in caves which are dark, just like the walls of Kings Landing. I agree it is a far out notion but there are some similarities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 My understanding is that Varys's "little birds" are street children (much as he was) who are trained to steal and spy for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyron Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 The description of the Children of the Forest in the wiki describe them as "They were smaller than men with nut-brown skin and large ears, they usually had large golden eyes, but a few had green or red eyes". That sounds like a similar description as the children that helped Varys. Large eyes, small like children. They also have lived in caves which are dark, just like the walls of Kings Landing. I agree it is a far out notion but there are some similarities. But when we actually *meet* the Children in Brans POV I think we get a clear picture that they don't look like regular children at all, in many ways. Kevan would surely have noticed if they looked anything like the ones in Brans chapter. He actually looks at a child and thinks about what age that child is. That suggests it looks like a regular human child to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrosBeforeSnows Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 Kevan seemed to be the main target, Pycelle is a "cherry on top". I think Varys actually likes messy KL situation, since it helps Targs to come back, and having Pycelle helping Cersei did not mess with his plans. Might mess with Margaery trial though, since he was the one having evidence against her... I think it's pretty clear Varys WANTS chaos in Westeros. And based on what Barristan tells us, he may have wanted chaos even when Aerys was sitting on the throne. He supposedly had been "whispering in Aerys's ear" that Rhaegar was plotting to overthrow him. Unless Rhaegar truly was plotting to overthrow his father, it sounds like Varys may have been trying to cause problems between Targs, as well as Lannisters, Baratheons, Starks, etc... everyone. But if Varys is secretly supporting the Targs, why would he have tried to incite Aerys against his own beloved son? Aerys was supposedly going to the Tourney at Harrenhal to confront Rhaegar, but didn't get a chance, because Rhaegar won the tourney and crowned Lyanna Stark the Princess of Love and Beauty. But it seems to have been Varys's intention to turn the two against each other. Team Blackfyre, perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrionthebest Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 I think it's pretty clear Varys WANTS chaos in Westeros. And based on what Barristan tells us, he may have wanted chaos even when Aerys was sitting on the throne. He supposedly had been "whispering in Aerys's ear" that Rhaegar was plotting to overthrow him. Unless Rhaegar truly was plotting to overthrow his father, it sounds like Varys may have been trying to cause problems between Targs, as well as Lannisters, Baratheons, Starks, etc... everyone. But if Varys is secretly supporting the Targs, why would he have tried to incite Aerys against his own beloved son? Aerys was supposedly going to the Tourney at Harrenhal to confront Rhaegar, but didn't get a chance, because Rhaegar won the tourney and crowned Lyanna Stark the Princess of Love and Beauty. But it seems to have been Varys's intention to turn the two against each other. Team Blackfyre, perhaps?He did plan to overthrow him . I think it is implied in one of Jaime's chapters in AFFC . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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