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[twow Spoilers] Arianne II, Part 2

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Connington also needs Dorne so I wouldnt be surprised if a marriage to Arianne could be in the works, not to mention the fact that Arianne has proven to be somewhat of a seductress in getting Oakheart to break his vows. The problem with Arianne is the "ick" factor of her and Aegon being cousins, then again he is a Targ so who knows.

I think i would rather marry my cousin than my aunt, but that could just be me because I have hot cousins. :smileysex: Edited by slayer420

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I think i would rather marry my cousin than my aunt, but that could just be me because I have hot cousins. :smileysex:

The whole Targ & Targ didnt even cross my mind, I guess i just assume inbreeding when it comes to them.

Lazy Turtle,

Yeah she has dragons but they're a world away with no indication they're coming to Westeros anytime soon ......... oh and their mommy is currently married already. I forgot to mention it earlier but the fact that Connington has greyscale is going to speed along this invasion and a hasty marriage might be made to secure victory.

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Yeah, Sansa's marriage to Tyrion could be a problem but it was never consummated, and as Massey mentions when speaking about Asha, it is easily set aside. Arriane is the other possibility of course but who else would Dorne side with when they find out Quentyn failed. Anyhoo, just speculation.

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I think i would rather marry my cousin than my aunt, but that could just be me because I have hot cousins. :smileysex:

Tywin married Joanna, his cousin. I don't think there's much of a stigma - certainly not the same as parent-child, uncle-niece or sibling-on-sibling.

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Tywin married Joanna, his cousin. I don't think there's much of a stigma - certainly not the same as parent-child, uncle-niece or sibling-on-sibling.

It seems to be more common, or at least not unheard of, in Westeros for cousins to marry. Besides Tywin and Joanna, there was Cregan Karstark's attempt to force his cousin Alys to marry him and Lysa's suggestion that Sansa should marry Sweetrobin. Neither of those happened for other reasons, but the concept of cousin marriage does not seem to be scandalous, North or South.

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i think Aegon will pull a Theon on her

You mean fail to kill her because she escapes with her direwolf?

That would be sure way to make Dorne join Aegon.

What other choice would they have? If Margaery dies (or Aegon perceives her as cursed) they have no other way of making a Tyrell grandchild sit the Iron Throne.

I think Aegon has been raised to be too honorable for that (Son of Rhaegar). I can see JC getting his hands dirty so that Aegon does not have to.

the raven's in the Godswood at storm's end whispered "Justice for Elia" "true son" "Justice for Elia" "true son", could goad Aegon into murder.

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In response to JC getting his "hands dirty" so YG doesnt have to, im also reminded of the battle of the bells (?) when JC fails in his search to find Robert he says something like "Even Tywin Lannister couldnt have done better" to which Tyrion (?) replies (something like) "yes he would've, he wouldve burned the entire town to the ground." So JC already has regrets, possibly even insecurities, in failing to put down the rebellion--he couldve single-handedly put an end to it by capturing Robert but failed-- and so I do think that because he is acutely aware of having failed Rhaegar, he will go to ANY lengths not to fail Aegon. i.e. he will stop at nothing to seat aegon on the iron throne.

Edited by Lord Tywin's Privy

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Thank you tze. I loved it so much when Ellaria said it out. I never thought about Doran's fire and blood that it is awesome, or he could actually possibly bring justice. I really dislike Doran becuause of his long wait the people who will play willl be innocent ones, and because of it I dont have any respect towards him or towards his plan.

I think it's a misconception that doran's plan needs to be "respected." He is--like almopst everyone else-- playing the game of thrones. Yes, he may seem to be better than a Tywin Lannister or another character considered to be "without honor." After all he is-- or at least claims to be-- avenging Elia and her children..But Cersei was also claiming to be protecting her children when she committed her own heinous acts against Ned Stark, the Merryweathers, Margaery Tyrell, and countless others. It seems that every single character-- except for a very precious few, namely the Starks, are using the excuse of either family, vengeance, or duty to justify terrible power-grabbing acts. Who's to say prince doran is not as much of a schemer as most of the other characters, and simply trying-- probably in conjuction with, but not mutually exclusive of, avenging elia and her children-- to either secure the iron throne for dorne, or more likely, advance his own station, esp over the tyrells, the lannisters, and other enemies, by seeking out and supporting whoever he believes is most likely to sit the iron throne?

Edited by Lord Tywin's Privy

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An explanation for the capture of Storm's End. We know that the Golden Company has taken Greenstone and its lords, the Estermonts. House Estermont has been split since the Battle of Blackwater. The heir Eldon has bent the knee to Tommen. The younger brother Lomas and his son Andrew remained faithful to Stannis. Lomas is in Storm's End, perhaps even as the castellan. Most likely the Golden Company could simply use the hostages it has gained, including the elderly Lord Estermont, Stannis's grandfather.

Edit: Ser Gilbert Farring is the castellan. However Lomas Estermont can be won over using the hostages.

Edited by Bran Vras

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I think Arianne should attack King's landing instead of going to Storm's End. It will be completely unprotected

No it will most likely be protected by a serious Tyrell army, in addition to the Goldcloaks and the few Lannister guards present.

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I've started a reread, am on aGoT. Have been watching for the tapestries. So far at least FOUR GoT chapters reference these tapestries, They are favorite hunting tapestries of Roberts. Depicting hunting scenes from Lys, Qorthos, etc...(dont have book with me am not recalling exactly) places across the sea, The tapestries are listed from 3 places, 2 of the 3 are the same as places Willem Darry hid Dany and Vis before he died. The household that was Targ freindly where the "Lady" death happend was the Darry household. These are facts I can find to quote from.

Now without double checking, I seem to remember a Jaime/Cersei recollection of them having sex at this Darry household with Robert passed out nearby? And wasnt there a reference of blank walls where some tapestrys once hung there? I am waiting to get to this again on the reread to confrim. If I am remembering this correctly, I think Robert took these tapestries from the Darrys, cause he liked them and hes king. I submit maybe Willem D sent these home to his Darry house as souveniers from his exile with the Targ kiddies.

So if my memory is correct (blind luck) LF could use/give them for maybe these purposes:

-Ingratiate Dany to him because she loved W.Darry who smuggled her out of Dragonstone, and they were his and Stolen by the usurper.

-Ingratiate Raymun Darry and his holdings to his cause thus tying another family and a Targ loyalist to his "strength" because Rob stole them.

I dont know where the chapter is that might confirm my thought that Robert stole the hunting tapestries, and It might be months before I finally find it, I think It might be a Cersei chp in aFfC. I skimmed the Jaime chp in aSoS and didnt see the recalled sex scene,

I don't believe the pro-Targaryen tapestries and Robert's favorite hunting tapestries are the same. You know, there's more than one set of tapestries in the world, and more than one castle with tapestries on the walls out there.

I recall Robert's tapestries being depicted as being described (from Cersei's perspective) as being tacky or at the very least, not quite stately/grandiose enough to hang on the wall of a castle. Past that, they were something Robert loved. Robert hated the Targaryens, so he wouldn't have wanted the pro-Targaryen from the Darry castle hanging on his walls.

Tapestries with hunting scenes wouldn't have clued Tyrion in on House Darry's leanings. It seems to me like they'd be tapestries depicting dragons and silver-haired purple-eyed kings winning battles and such.

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Is there an copy of the chapter itself online, or just the tid bits that people remembered and/or wrote down?

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No it will most likely be protected by a serious Tyrell army, in addition to the Goldcloaks and the few Lannister guards present.

She also lacks the manpower to atttack King's Landing. Prince Doran is still in charge the last time I checked and there is no way he is about to authorize that kind of action without a surefire chance at victory.

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An explanation for the capture of Storm's End. We know that the Golden Company has taken Greenstone and its lords, the Estermonts. House Estermont has been split since the Battle of Blackwater. The heir Eldon has bent the knee to Tommen. The younger brother Lomas and his son Andrew remained faithful to Stannis. Lomas is in Storm's End, perhaps even as the castellan. Most likely the Golden Company could simply use the hostages it has gained, including the elderly Lord Estermont, Stannis's grandfather.

Edit: Ser Gilbert Farring is the castellan. However Lomas Estermont can be won over using the hostages.

I think the best explanation is that the GC will be dressed in the colors of the captured Storm Land houses that fought for Stannis (Estermont, Morrigan, Connington, etc.,) and will attack the Tyrell force left to invest Storms End. After defeating it, Connington will offer up the Tyrell commander (Mathis Rowan?) as proof of fealty.

The Tyrells have likely been shooting down any birds traveling to and from Storm's End, so I would not be surprised if no news of the GC and it's conquest have yet reached the defenders.

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/random thought/

Elia sneaks off to play a cave, caves tend to be in mountains...

both Summerhall and Griffins Roost are near Mountains.

So it seems that there was a cave that sacred to the children of the forest in the mountains near Griffins Roost and therefore very close to Summerhall.

The Prince of Dragonflies and Jenny of Oldstones died at Summerhall. Jenny of Oldstones was friends with that dwarf woman on the hill at high heart, and Jenny said that the dwarf was a child of the forest (having seen an actual child of the forest in ADWD, we know they are nothing like that unfortunate creature woman described in ASOS).

/Random thought/

Except that we know some can work a "glamor" and slightly change their appearance. If COTF are still in the south, IMO they wld usually be in hiding. For example, the COTF Leaf we meet in ADWD's in the Bran chapters claims to have walked the southern kingdoms for many years--yet appears to Bran and the others as a COTF. It wld be my speculation that Leaf had walked the south but had done so in a glamored disguise. (And so would assume that there are some more COTF in the south even at the book's time but very, very few.)

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Except that we know some can work a "glamor" and slightly change their appearance. If COTF are still in the south, IMO they wld usually be in hiding. For example, the COTF Leaf we meet in ADWD's in the Bran chapters claims to have walked the southern kingdoms for many years--yet appears to Bran and the others as a COTF. It wld be my speculation that Leaf had walked the south but had done so in a glamored disguise. (And so would assume that there are some more COTF in the south even at the book's time but very, very few.)

Where you guys getting all this stuff from the text from?

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It seems to be more common, or at least not unheard of, in Westeros for cousins to marry. Besides Tywin and Joanna, there was Cregan Karstark's attempt to force his cousin Alys to marry him and Lysa's suggestion that Sansa should marry Sweetrobin. Neither of those happened for other reasons, but the concept of cousin marriage does not seem to be scandalous, North or South.

Considering that the Westerosi had no issues with 300 years worth of mostly brother-sister pairings in their dragonly-appointed Valyrian rulers, I'd say that incest is socially acceptable enough within the ruling classes to make a marriage between cousins worthy of even a lifted eyebrow. Furthermore, even among the slightly-less-incestuous-but-still-cousin-marrying Lannisters, the real problem with the Cersei-Jaime match was the drama concerning Robert's heirs, not so much that Cersei and Jaime were doing it. It was scandalous, but mostly to honorable-ass Ned Stark. Everyone else was more interested in succession than they were grossed out by the fact that Cersei and Jamie were boning.

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The Golden Company probably employed the same tactic as the Boltons did to the Stark loyalists outside of Winterfell. The only difference being that Theon and the ironborn knew it was happening. Entirely probable that the Golden Company raises its banners, surprises and crushes the Tyrell holding force and claims service to Stannis. Stannis garrison opens the gates and BAM! take the keep unawares.

Obviously the first suspiscion should be treachery but Stannis is stuck in the North and snowed in, probably unable to get Ravens out to Storm's End anyway. I can't remember right now but who is the garrison commander at Storm's End? Is he ever mentioned?

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Was there any detail about the CotF drawings in the cave Ella finds. Since they are no longer a myth but real and playing a part in events in the north, are they active in the south or is there some prophecy in the drawings. it seems an odd time to just wander across such things if they aren't significant to current events - possible Summerhall link mentioned above?

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