Why do people hate Euron despite his small appearence so far?

[Tumnas the Torpid]

I just reread Feast and for the life of me I can't remember these things. I recall that he was going to marry Asha off but rape? And didn't he send Victarion to treat for Dany's hand? I don't recall him ever sending him to kidnap her.

As to Asha: the argument is that her eventual bedding is implicit to the marriage, so the logical conclusion of his actions is that she will be forced to sleep with the Anvilbreaker, whether she wants to or not.

As to drug abuse/addiction: the argument is that he has a shade-of-the-evening habit. It may be fair to say that he is addicted, but as we do not yet know whether he is getting any practical magical benefit from his habit, it may be unfair to treat this as a personal deficit.

As to kidnapping Dany: I suppose it all depends on whether you imagine Victarion and the Ironborn will behave like Quentyn Martell when met with refusal.

[Queen Cersei I]

Reasons why Euron is hated:

1. Because he almost certainly raped Victarian's wife

2. Because he may well have raped his brother

3. Because he has a reputation for brutality and sadism even amongst the ironborn. Seeing as how the Ironborn are a people whose very culture is built upon reaving, looting, rape, and brutality, it follows that Euron must be pretty damn bad to have a reputation as a "scary guy" amongst them.

4. Because he cuts out the tongues of all his crew

5. Because he cut out the tongue of the "dusky woman" for no apparent reason.

6. Asha, Victarian, Damphair, and others indicate that he is known for his random acts of shocking violence. For instance, Asha suggested, in all seriousness, if someone were to suggest Euron were getting soft (or whatever), he'd kill one of his bastard children just to prove them wrong. Could have been hyperbole, however, given what we've seen of the guy thus far, it could just have easily not been.

7. His appearance, words, and overall characterization seem to carry more than a whiff of residual cheesiness. Personally, this is what really throws it over for me. At times he seems like bloody Darkstar with an eyepatch.

8. Because overall, the Ironborn chapters strike some people as a waste and unnecessary; padding the books where time would be better dedicated to more well rounded, interesting, and necessary characters. For some (myself included) Euron, Victarian, and especially Damphair are utterly unnecessary for the storyline and, worse, uninteresting in and of themselves.

Just my two cents. :leaving:

[Kittyhat]

Come to think of it, I'm not sure there's anything in particular that makes Euron meaningfully worse than any other ironborn. Sure, there are things that they think make him worse, but ironborn in general are basically culturally assholes.

But then again, he is ironborn. That's probably a good enough reason to hate him.

[The Storm Queen]

Hmm, let's see: He screwed his brother's wife, and told him about it, he had his other brother killed, he comes back from a (deserved) exile as a slaver addicted to drugs, only to goad people into another war, decides to have Asha raped to teach her manners, decides he wants a dragon queen kidnapped to serve as trophy wife, but hasn't the balls to go himself first, and he most probably also raped Aeron when he was young.

A sterling piece of humanity.

Giving his rapey M.O it is entirely possible that Victarion´s wife did not sleep willingly with him......

[jlk7e]

As to kidnapping Dany: I suppose it all depends on whether you imagine Victarion and the Ironborn will behave like Quentyn Martell when met with refusal.

Is anyone willing to argue with a straight face that Victarion will behave like Quentyn Martell when met with refusal?

[Queen Cersei I]

He raped his brother Aeron.

Which also makes him responsible for the whole "creaking of the door, squeak of the rusty hinges" thing repeated obsessively throughout the damphair chapters in AFFC.

And perhaps even Aeron's beyond ridiculous characterization in general.

Damn you, Euron.

[Tumnas the Torpid]

Is anyone willing to argue with a straight face that Victarion will behave like Quentyn Martell when met with refusal?

Exactamundo.

[butterbumps!]

Okay, Okay!!! I now see that you all have some valid points. Still, his actions seem relatively normal compared to people like Ramsay and Joffrey

Hahaha- that's kind of like saying something is "less wet than water."

To be honest, I hear it said alot that he's this great mastermind genius with a plan, but I don't really see it. He appeals to the lowest common denominator of the Ironborn in the kingsmoot by appealing to the basest senses and urges (yes, I know- it's what gets you elected, but it's also a good way to completely exhaust your resources quickly), and his overall policy is one of brute force. I think what he does- the carrot and the stick so to speak- speaks to a certain "low cunning" that earns him some degree of loyalty and control, but in what way does this make him a genius? Is it the way he puts his "competitors" into high positions, and other pawns into various positions (Victarion getting Dany, Faceless Man potentially at Citadel, friends close, enemies closer)?

[Ser Hippie]

If you don't believe us about why Euron isn't liked, just see what the Dusky Woman has to say about him.

[the Scorpion Knight]

Okay, Okay!!! I now see that you all have some valid points. Still, his actions seem relatively normal compared to people like Ramsay and Joffrey

the cursive is what makes his more dangerous IMHO

[Tumnas the Torpid]

Hahaha- that's kind of like saying something is "less wet than water."

To be honest, I hear it said alot that he's this great mastermind genius with a plan, but I don't really see it. He appeals to the lowest common denominator of the Ironborn in the kingsmoot by appealing to the basest senses and urges (yes, I know- it's what gets you elected, but it's also a good way to completely exhaust your resources quickly), and his overall policy is one of brute force. I think what he does- the carrot and the stick so to speak- speaks to a certain "low cunning" that earns him some degree of loyalty and control, but in what way does this make him a genius? Is it the way he puts his "competitors" into high positions, and other pawns into various positions (Victarion getting Dany, Faceless Man potentially at Citadel, friends close, enemies closer)?

I think it's too early to declare him ingenius, but yes, his political maneuvers so far go into that column. His invasion of the Reach may or may not be a great folly, but we don't yet know enough to judge. The big unknown, however, is the extent of his knowledge of the supernatural goings-on in the world. In addition to the Warlocks and alleged trip to Valyria, there's a bit of dialogue in Victarion's last chapter in Feast that tantalizes with the possibility that Euron may be a skinchanger or greendreamer, or at least have had some contact with Bloodraven. If he is the first major player in the game of thrones to also have real, direct knowledge of the magical forces gathering, then I expect great (and terrible) things of the Crow'seye.

[Brienne the Beauty]

Where do you want me to start? Kinslaying, sleeping with his brother's wife, probably molesting Aeron, cutting people's tongues out, slaving, drowning innocent people, butting in on Asha and Theon's rightful claim to the Seastone Chair, having peons blow his hellhorn for him, and yes, attempting to marry Dany and steal her dragons.

Other than that, complete peach.

A more interesting question is "Why do so many people like him?"

He's got the morals of Ramsay Snow, but more charisma.

[Kittyhat]

Which also makes him responsible for the whole "creaking of the door, squeak of the rusty hinges" thing repeated obsessively throughout the damphair chapters in AFFC.

And perhaps even Aeron's beyond ridiculous characterization in general.

Damn you, Euron.

Okay, you convinced me. Euron is officially the worst thing since whomever was responsible for Areo Hotah.

[The Meeraculous Third Reed]

Euron is an immoral asshole. He's also one of the most intriguing and seemingly "superhuman" for want of a better word characters I've read about.

[Lord Over]

To state what everyone's said

- He's an Ironborn, they're all idiots

- He's cruel and a douchebag, he raped Victarion's wife and forced a mother and her girls to serve his men, naked

- He's a kinslayer (heavily implied)

- GRRM is forcing the fact that he is COOL down our throats

- He has a silly gimmick in which he as a blue eye and (also heavily implied) a red eye, each one to indicate his mood...it's hard to take him seriously after that.

[The Bastard of Summer]

I don't hate him. I'm not saying he's not a horrible person.

[The Mother of The Others]

He disrespected the beach community.

[Queen Cersei I]

Where is Lord LF's Lash when you need him with his refrain:

Eur :pirate: n

Eur :pirate: n

Eur :pirate: n!

I think that way of writing the name was the best thing that ever came of this character.

And Lord LF's lash-- you've repeated that post 5 times already, but y :pirate: u fail to come through for us all now? :pirate: For shame. :thumbsdown:

[Tumnas the Torpid]

He disrespected the beach community.

Him and his gold-brickin' bastards...

[Hamilton]

The series needs a good villain now that Ramsay and Roose are on the outs. He's a great villain. A evil pirate, viking, sorcerer king bent on conquest... or is he? The best part is that you don't know what he's up to. Yes, he is an evil character but I still root for him. This is because he is a fictional character in a fictional series that had you happy a child was poisoned to death.

As for this raping Damphair I still don't buy it. I believe that the creaking hinge will be a bit more important to the story then Euron molesting Aeron.