Who is the Hooded Man in Winterfell?

[Tharvot]

I'm trying to think of who it could be, and I keep going back to the Manderlys.

When Theon asks the spearwives about one of the recent killings, they claim to have nothing to do with that killing. I don't think they knew about it and neither did Mance. IMO, that rules out Mance.

Theon himself is far too weak to have committed some of the crimes, its not him.

The timeline doesn't add up for it to be the Blackfish.

It seems completely unreasonable for it to be Benjen. He would have gone to Castle Black with his findings from his long ranging first...priorities.

The killings go completely against what Davos is about.

So, as possible major players are crossed off, I keep thinking it has to be a Manderly lackey whose job is to sew discontent between the people in WF. IIRC, the only people who die are Freys and Bolton loyalists. No Manderlys seem to be targeted by the mysterious killer(s).

[three-eyed monkey]

I have enjoyed reading some of the HM theories on this and other related threads. I for one don’t buy the HM is insignificant argument, I think GRRM picks his words carefully and has given us a great puzzle here.

Farther on, he came upon a man striding in the opposite direction, a hooded cloak flapping behind him. When they found themselves face-to-face their eyes met briefly. The man put a hand on his dagger.

"Theon Turncloak. Theon Kinslayer."

"I'm not. I never... I was ironborn."

"False is all you were. How is it you still breathe?"

"The gods are not done with me," Theon answered, wondering if this could be the killer, the night walker who had stuffed Yellow Dick's cock into his mouth and pushed Roger Ryswell's groom off the battlements. Oddly he was not afraid. He pulled the glove from his left hand. "Lord Ramsay is not done with me."

The man looked, and laughed. "I leave you to him, then."

The timelines are hard to follow but I do think they rule out some candidates like Jaime, Sandor and possibly The Blackfish. That still leaves a lot of suspects but a few things struck me while re-reading the passage. This is just my interpretation and I know others will interpret things differently.

1 …striding… I question whether the light-footed Howland Reed would “stride”. Not a great argument, I admit, but it just doesn’t feel right to me.

2 The man put his hand on his dagger. “Theon Turncloak.” This makes me think the HM’s first instinct was to kill Theon on the spot for being a turncloak and a kinslayer, so I’m in favour of it being a stark loyalist. It also means that the HM recognised Theon so it can’t be someone like Alliser Thorne or Davos.

3 “Theon Kinslayer.” It also suggests that the HM thinks Bran and Rickon are dead, imo. As Davos and Robett Glover know that Bran and Rickon are alive by way of Wex, I’m not sure they’d call him a kinslayer. The same might well apply to Theon Durden too as Theon obviously knows he didn’t kill the boys.

4 “False is all you were.” To me the were here as opposed to are, suggests he knows Theon from the past, when Theon displayed loyalty to the Starks, which the HM now knows in retrospect to have been a false display. I can’t decide if Theon recognised the HM or not, but I think if he didn’t it was someone he should have recognised. “…their eyes met briefly,” might mean that Theon looked away or lowered his eyes so he might not have paid too much attention to the HM’s face. He certainly didn’t describe him. I’m wondering if Theon even bothered to take a close look at the HM at all.

5 “Lord Ramsay is not done with me.” Whoresbane seems a likely go between for the Northern Conspiracy but his reaction in putting his hand on his dagger just seems a bit odd to me as it’s not the first time he’s seen Theon. Then again, Theon’s line here might be a reference to their encounter at the Dreadfort.

Of the other suspects I’m not sure what to think of Mance. I read on one post that he was in the hall playing music at the time but I’d have to re-read the chapter to be sure.

Benjen? I hadn’t considered him before coming to these boards. But would he be able to move around Winterfell unrecognised, even with the hood? The HM did risk eye contact with Theon when they came face to face, and I agree with the idea that if Benjen was inside the walls he'd be keeping his head down.

Harwin and Hallis Mollen? I can’t remember if Harwin was with the BwB last time we saw them but if the timeline allowed then he could be there on behalf of Lady Stoneheart who obviously wants revenge on Roose and some Freys. And as we’ve had no news of Hallis in a while he cannot be discounted from being part of the Northern Conspiracy. Both men would have reason to be there, possible knowledge of ways to access the castle, and neither would be as recognisable as the likes of Benjen.

And while I really like the Stark from the swordless crypts theory for the killer, I’m not so sure about him/her/it being the HM.

[Fender]

[...]

Harwin and Hallis Mollen? I can’t remember if Harwin was with the BwB last time we saw them but if the timeline allowed then he could be there on behalf of Lady Stoneheart who obviously wants revenge on Roose and some Freys. And as we’ve had no news of Hallis in a while he cannot be discounted from being part of the Northern Conspiracy. Both men would have reason to be there, possible knowledge of ways to access the castle, and neither would be as recognisable as the likes of Benjen.

[...]

Cool, I totally started a thing. Great post, by the way. Let it be known henceforth; Harwin has become the most likely candidate for the identity of the Hooded Man, followed by Hallis. I really don't buy Theon Durden, but whatever, others can decide the rest of the ordering for themselves. Was there really no information anywhere about Hallis since he was sent north with Eddy's bones?

[Cat of the Canal Girl]

ok this makes me think of a question. When Melisandre sent Mance to Winterfell, did she remove the bracelet that was casting an illusion?

Perhaps he can remove/replace the bracelet at will to switch his appearance from Mance to Abel? That way he can walk around as the hooded man without jeopardizing Abel's cover?

[RenlyIsNotRight]

...wondering if this could be the killer, the night walker who had stuffed Yellow Dick's cock into his mouth and pushed Roger Ryswell's groom off the battlements...

I forgot about those parts. That changes things, because from everything we've heard of Howland he's too honorable for that shit.

I'd go with Whoresbane except Theon knows him.

[Fender]

I forgot about those parts. That changes things, because from everything we've heard of Howland he's too honorable for that shit.

I'd go with Whoresbane except Theon knows him.

So what you're telling us is that you support the theory that he is Harwin or Hallis. Good to know!

[The Lanky Umber]

Yea, I forgot those details too...doubt Howland would be that ruthless, he's too honorable for that stuff. Good point

[Valyrian Spoon]

@ three-eyed monkey Very well summed up.

3 “Theon Kinslayer.” also suggests that the HM thinks Bran and Rickon are dead, imo. As Davos and Robett Glover know that Bran and Rickon are alive by way of Wex, I’m not sure they’d call him a kinslayer. The same might well apply to Theon Durden too as Theon obviously knows he didn’t kill the boys.

This seem's very logical, It would imply that as you say the HM believes Theon killed Bran and Rikon. I think I'm in the Harwin/Hollis camp.

Or, and admittedly this could be a stretch 'Kinslayer' could still apply to the Theon Durden theory.

It may still apply as earlier in DwD Roose pretty much told Theon that his capture of Winterfell was what made him betray Rob. So know Theon may blame Robbs death at the Twins on his earlier actions, indirectly making him a 'kinslayer'. Like I said it's a bit of a stretch on my part.

[three-eyed monkey]

@ three-eyed monkey Very well summed up.

This seem's very logical, It would imply that as you say the HM believes Theon killed Bran and Rikon. I think I'm in the Harwin/Hollis camp.

Or, and admittedly this could be a stretch 'Kinslayer' could still apply to the Theon Durden theory.

It may still apply as earlier in DwD Roose pretty much told Theon that his capture of Winterfell was what made him betray Rob. So know Theon may blame Robbs death at the Twins on his earlier actions, indirectly making him a 'kinslayer'. Like I said it's a bit of a stretch on my part.

No, I sort of agree with you on the Theon Durden thing here. If it's one part of a split Theon, the more decent half, chastising the other part then it makes sense that he would be striding, want Theon dead, consider him a kinslayer due to his betrayal of Robb, etc. Confusing.

[Valyrian Spoon]

No, I sort of agree with you on the Theon Durden thing here. If it's one part of a split Theon, the more decent half, chastising the other part then it makes sense that he would be striding, want Theon dead, consider him a kinslayer due to his betrayal of Robb, etc. Confusing.

Although I am starting to believe that the HM is a straight forward Stark loyalist, I do love the Idea that Theons conscience, guilt, rage and self loathing may have manifested in a split personality. It would make very interesting reading in future novels.

[Cat of the Canal Girl]

Even tho Manderley knows Bran isn't dead, HM could still be one of Manderley's men who simply wasn't told about Wex's discovery.

[RenlyIsNotRight]

So what you're telling us is that you support the theory that he is Harwin or Hallis. Good to know!

Wouldn't Theon know Harwin though? Otherwise I could believe that.

[three-eyed monkey]

Wouldn't Theon know Harwin though? Otherwise I could believe that.

Yeah, there are a couple of things here that are really open to interpretation.

If we decide that Theon would have recognised someone he knew but as he did not then the HM must have been someone Theon didn't know, then Harwin and Hollis get eliminated.

If we decide that "Theon Kinslayer" is just a general jibe and doen't necessarily mean the HM thinks Bran and Rickon dead, then Davos and Robett Glover come back into the reckoning.

If we say that "striding" could accurately apply to Howland Reed, then he's back in, and so on.

When I weigh these things up the most plausible option imo is that Theon didn't take too much notice of the HM's face and didn't recognise him, even if he could or should have.

[Scarlet Seastar]

May be Harwin did arrive in Winterfell with the help of Howland Reed and hid in the crypts after laying Ned's bones to rest?

And then when Lady D and Theon go to the crypts he hides in the shadows and listens to their conversation and decides to go on a mad revenge at Northeren Conspirators?

For the sake of crackpot-the hooded man could be Ned himself-if he really was freed by Varys(that little eunuch always seemed fond of Ned-or at least understood his situation) may be Varys felt bad for him and released him, made him promise to hide, and we know how Ned is fond of promises. Since he promised not to go to the aid of his son, he went to Winterfell, found it in ruins and stayed there. However, upon hearing the way some of his own people talk about him, especially since Lady D seems to have a very good insight into how things are at that moment in Winterfell, he says 'screw the honor' and becomes the ghost of Winterfell.

[RenlyIsNotRight]

Yeah, there are a couple of things here that are really open to interpretation.

If we decide that Theon would have recognised someone he knew but as he did not then the HM must have been someone Theon didn't know, then Harwin and Hollis get eliminated.

If we decide that "Theon Kinslayer" is just a general jibe and doen't necessarily mean the HM thinks Bran and Rickon dead, then Davos and Robett Glover come back into the reckoning.

If we say that "striding" could accurately apply to Howland Reed, then he's back in, and so on.

When I weigh these things up the most plausible option imo is that Theon didn't take too much notice of the HM's face and didn't recognise him, even if he could or should have.

I just think the manner of the crimes is more Harwin than anyone else. Howland Reed by all accounts is an honorable man. Robett Glover seems to be a bit outspoken and brash, but not sadistic. Davos...that's definitely not Davos. Harwin on the other hand stuck around with the new BwB who do a lot of grizzly shit. Arya did point out that Harwin has grown a beard and generally is more grizzly looking these days so maybe he doesn't recognize him.

[Fender]

I just think the manner of the crimes is more Harwin than anyone else. Howland Reed by all accounts is an honorable man. Robett Glover seems to be a bit outspoken and brash, but not sadistic. Davos...that's definitely not Davos. Harwin on the other hand stuck around with the new BwB who do a lot of grizzly shit. Arya did point out that Harwin has grown a beard and generally is more grizzly looking these days so maybe he doesn't recognize him.

We're never told that Theon doesn't recognize the person. We have absolutely no indication that he does, but we don't have any that he doesn't, either. Actually, I find interesting that whoever HM is, he was able to recognize Theon, what with his white hair, lack of teeth, lack of muscles and everything. And this is obviously the first time that he sees Theon, so he wasn't told by anyone else beforehand who that "old man" was; he was familiar enough with Theon to recognize him despite the changes.

[three-eyed monkey]

Fender, I think I'm becoming convinced it is Harwin. Apart from all the 'evidence', it would tie UnCat and Riverrun back into the Winterfell and revenge on Roose Bolton storylines. I'm sold.

Edit: I do love the Theon Durden thing too so I won't despair if it turns out to be the case. I'd see it as a nod to Chuck Palahniuk's masterpiece.

[Fender]

Fender, I think I'm becoming convinced it is Harwin. Apart from all the 'evidence', it would tie UnCat and Riverrun back into the Winterfell and revenge on Roose Bolton storylines. I'm sold.

I know! And it fits so well, too. Can't believe I was the first to mention it on this thread.

[Pope Killdragon]

I'm convinced that he's an unleashed King of Winter, despite everything.

[Garion Snow]

1) HM has to know Theon pretty well to recognize Reek. This suggests someone from Winterfell or maybe a Greyjoy.

2) He called him a kinslayer. Only someone from Wf or his family would do that (since Greyjoys never considered him one of their own)

Theon didn't seem surprised to see him there. I don't know if this means he just didn't care anymore or if it was someone who was supposed to be in WF. Maybe GM is introducing a completely new character(?).