What is the Official Bolton Narrative of the WOTFK?

[Valkyrja]

I never doubted that 'the North' knows that the Boltons were just as culpable as the Freys, but that they choose to temporarily pretend that they only hate the Freys. The Freys, after all, are less of an immediate danger to despise openly in the North, for they are not the current phony!lords of Winterfell.

I've just thought that 'the North' is temporarily pretending to overlook what the Boltons did, but never thought they would actually overlook their part in the RW forever....

ETA: I don't think there even has to be an 'official narrative' given out to everyone in the North for this to be the case. Even if there were, I think many would see through it, or at least suspect something.

[VaramyrSixchins]

It does say in the book. “How many men did you lose?” Theon asked Red Helm as he dismounted.

“Twenty or thirty.”

My only guess is that once the fighting started Rodrik's men ran off right away. That is why the OP started this post. I think he makes a really good point. It could also be the reason why Stannis has never seemed worried attacking Winterfell. GRRM is probably going to fill in the gaps next book.

IIRC, Ramsay began by offering Cassel his hand, then lopping off Cassel's arm when Cassel took it. I can see 2000 "sweepings of the north", running away after seeing their leader killed in front of them by a supposed ally. At this point, Ned's long dead, their King long leagues away, their liege castle and symbol of Stark power conquered, Ironmen attacking multiple places, their House heirs gone. Don't forget, the commanding Tallheart and Cerwyn were killed by Ramsay as well, though we don't know at what point in the battle. None of these are exactly morale boosters, throw in the fact that you can't even trust Northmen anymore and running away seems the only option for broken men.

[VaramyrSixchins]

I never doubted that 'the North' knows that the Boltons were just as culpable as the Freys, but that they choose to temporarily pretend that they only hate the Freys. The Freys, after all, are less of an immediate danger to despise openly in the North, for they are not the current phony!lords of Winterfell.

I've just thought that 'the North' is temporarily pretending to overlook what the Boltons did, but never thought they would actually overlook their part in the RW forever....

ETA: I don't think there even has to be an 'official narrative' given out to everyone in the North for this to be the case. Even if there were, I think many would see through it, or at least suspect something.

I agree. Manderly, at least, knows Bolton's lying about his part in the RW, and he knows from Wex that Bolton is full of it regarding the other events surrounding the sack of WF. And, if you believe the Brave Dany Flint theory, Manderly also knows about Jeyne Poole. I think much of the the North knows more than they let on, but they don't have the ability to stand up and call B.S. until the hostages are released. So, in that sense, a Bolton narrative is a moot point.

However, the O.P. is right about the North's ignoring Ramsay's "death". This requires SOME kind of explanation, right?

[VaramyrSixchins]

Perhaps Ramsay's "death" wasn't widely known? Can't remember if Robb or Cat got word of that.

[Maxpey]

IIRC in aDWD Roose tells Theon that he knows that the Manderlys and the Umbers know about his "treachery" and that the only reason they have not done anything to retaliate is due to the hostage situation at the Twins. I also assume that most of the North knows what really happened at Winterfell because there were survivors but again cannot do anything about it because of the political/military situation.

Thus, both sides have resorted to engaging in a "mummer's farce" as Sir Manderly put it, pretending that there is no discord or distrust and that the North accepts that Roose/Ramsey share no blame for what happened.

Ed. Totally forgot that Manderly knows exactly what happened because of Wex.

[kg1982]

Actually, releasing Manderlay's son was Cersei's daft move; he cut a deal in return for "killing"' Davos.

However, the North should really send a fruit basket to all the Lannister siblings for their help!!

[E-Ro]

I can see 2000 "sweepings of the north", running away after seeing their leader killed in front of them by a supposed ally.

But the 2,000 were never described as "sweepings" Im prety sure it says most of them were mounted and mailed read my earlier post.

[pamparius]

Even in mass confusion they still would have lost way more men. Sorry, there nothing you can possibly write that will convince me that scene is realistic.

Just to put things into perspective. Even if Ramsey's men stood directly behind 200 of Rodrik's forces and was able to kill each of them in one blow, they would still have to kill anywhere from 400-700 more men.... :dunno:

Because medieval battles were not won by killing every last man, they were won by causing mass routes through panic and fear, something a surprise attack within their own ranks might cause. It would have worked a lot better with cavalry instead of infantry, but, the devil's in the details.

[Mulled Wino]

I didnt see this point yet, but much of the North is aware of his treachery. Especially Robett Glover and all the other survivors from Duskendale.

They all know.

[Maxpey]

I didnt see this point yet, but much of the North is aware of his treachery. Especially Robett Glover and all the other survivors from Duskendale.

They all know.

They sure do know.

[Trebuchet Penguin]

The North Remembers, Bolton.

[Jolene Brown]

Wait, who says word isn't out? Lord Manderly knows the Boltons are lying about what happened at Winterfell, after all. The point is not what the North knows or doesn't know - its about doing something about it.

EDIT: there is a subtle point here that I only recently picked up on - the North wouldn't even be in a position to respond to Bolton and Frey BS - had Jaime not pressed for the release of northern prisoners like Wylis.

That one was Cercei, she did it in exchange for the "killing" of Davos. Jaime is ordering the release of the northern prisoners at the Red Wedding.

[Lau-la Mora]

This reminds of the northern conspiracy theory. And I think that all those mentions of "the north remembers" are more than just the red wedding. The north surely remembers about the Stark flayed by the Boltons, so I wouldn't be surprised if all the northern lords are aware of what happened at the red wedding and the sack of Winterfell.

Sorry if I repeated things said in another post

[Winterfell is Burning]

Because medieval battles were not won by killing every last man, they were won by causing mass routes through panic and fear, something a surprise attack within their own ranks might cause. It would have worked a lot better with cavalry instead of infantry, but, the devil's in the details.

But, like I said, he didn't needed to win the battle alone, but win the battle and make sure that no one leaves alive.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

But, like I said, he didn't needed to win the battle alone, but win the battle and make sure that no one leaves alive.

But, like I said, he didn't. There is a whole bunch of survivors hiding in the Wolfswood. Stannis gathers some of them.

[Ispahan75]

Is Roose not supposed to have had anything to do with the Red Wedding? If so, where was he at the time?

In my view, though it is very understated and subtle, Roose is actually the one who delivers the final stab to Robb. The description most certainly fits (armor, sigil...) and he even says something about Jaime sending his regards. In Harrenhal, a sarcastic Jaime did ask Roose to give Robb his regards when he next sees him. He was though anaware of Roose+Tywin's plans for the upcoming RW at that point in time. When Roose does mention Jaime's regards to Robb at the RW, he most certainly implies that Jaime had a hand (if I may say so...) in the RW to witnesses (eg Cat...).

This makes your question interesting. I'm not sure that all the northern bannermen are fully aware of the extent of Roose's implication, but surely, some heard that he is directly responsible for Robb's death at the RW.

PS : English is not my mother tongue, pls excuse the potential mistakes... Hi to all by the way, I'm new to this forum - this is my first post :)

[Winterfell is Burning]

But, like I said, he didn't. There is a whole bunch of survivors hiding in the Wolfswood. Stannis gathers some of them.

Yes, which makes Ramsay's move even more stupid.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Yes, which makes Ramsay's move even more stupid.

Hey, no one claimed the guy had brains. I've started a thread about Ramsay driving Roose to the RW with his stupidity half a year ago.

[Larry of the Lawn]

The thing with Theon giving away Arya/Jeyne is only because he grew up with the real Arya, so if he gives her away it is a strong argument that she's actually Arya. The Lannisters and Roose know that she isn't Arya, that's the only reason they want Theon there - it's a testimonial that Ramsay is now the legitamte heir of Winterfell.

And all the Northern Lords know that Roose was in on the Red Wedding - that's why so many of them are plotting to turn on him and side with Stannis.

But, yeah, seems like there was a bit of plot armor on the whole custody of Winterfell since ACoK. But like a many others have said, it's not what you know, or even what you can prove, it's what you can do about it that matters in the world of ASoIaF.

[Eira Seren]

maybe Roose isn't going to escape retribution, and nobody plans to move against him right off because they are planning, because of hostages (plus, he's creepy and has the family's flaying reputation working for him). . .

but in the meantime, why not let Ramsey take all the blame for being the icky, nasty, murderous sneak? Roose has safely married a Frey. He could have decided to marry 'arya' himself. it might not be perfect, but he's certainly managed to put Ramsey in the crosshairs instead.