IS Dany still the Unburnt?

[DaveRoid]

And did you really believe that Stannis´sword was lightbringer for two books?

No I thought Danny was the obvious AA after she hatched the dragons. That was such a huge thing sticking out in the prophecy. I knew stannis was a fake of some sort.

[Lord of Cheese]

Fluked a spell? prove it. She should never have known a fire protection spell.A blood for blood spell was all the witch knew and she burned in the fire herself.

Yes. Fluked it. Look at Tze's great analysis here:

Dany seemed to have a plan to hatch her dragon eggs even though she has no clue about magic or anything. But nevertheless it worked out for her.

I think what Tze's wrote in her op shows clearly that her fireproofness was one time magical.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

No I thought Danny was the obvious AA after she hatched the dragons. That was such a huge thing sticking out in the prophecy. I knew stannis was a fake of some sort.

The joke here is that Dany is herself a red herring and probably not AA.

I'm also glad to see that someone else called you out on your insults. If you can't make an argument without resorting to that, you're not worth responding to.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

George never stated she isn't resistant. Neither dragons nor danny are immune to fire. But they are extremely resistant. You know how vague he is when he answers questions its an old SSM and the evidence is more piled up that she is resistant. I'm sure if she was blasted with flame she would burn. But I don't think heat effects her the same as it effects us. Sorry that I disagree so much. But I don't see it plausable that she would go through so much hell and not burn. You can argue anything to any point if you word it right. But if she isn't resistant than george is definitely trying to confuse us.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

George never stated she isn't resistant. Neither dragons nor danny are immune to fire. But they are extremely resistant. You know how vague he is when he answers questions its an old SSM and the evidence is more piled up that she is resistant. I'm sure if she was blasted with flame she would burn. But I don't think heat effects her the same as it effects us. Sorry that I disagree so much. But I don't see it plausable that she would go through so much hell and not burn. You can argue anything to any point if you word it right. But if she isn't resistant than george is definitely trying to confuse us.

I think he's actually being very direct and people just allow themselves to be confused by it rather than accept what he's trying to tell them. There's nothing confusing about it — Targaryens, and Dany, are not immune to fire. Period. End of. What is so confusing about that?

But let's say that she has an otherworldly tolerance to heat, for shits and giggles. If she, as you seem to admit, would still burn if she was blasted with fire, what good does that heat resistance do? GRRM has said, in the examples that Dragonfish provided, that the Targs do have a higher tolerance of heat — basically, they like hot baths and can stand warmer climates. One of the Targaryens we know of who liked hot baths and could stand Dornish summers was Aegon V. Do you know how he died? In a fire.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

Okay you are completely missing my point and I'm sick of explaining it over and over and over again. I have my opinion. You have your reasons. Let's agree to disagree

[Gar Weg Wun Sygerrik]

I have my opinion. You have your reasons.

Unintentional no doubt but this is the first thing you've said that has made any sense. You have an opinion. We have lots of reasons why that uninformed opinion is wrong. Yet you're still unwilling to change it because it's your opinion.

Cool beans.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

Unintentional no doubt but this is the first thing you've said that has made any sense. You have an opinion. We have lots of reasons why that uninformed opinion is wrong. Yet you're still unwilling to change it because it's your opinion.

Cool beans.

Wow you are totally hilarious!!!! Just cause you are all blind to see it from my perspectives and theories/indications proves why my opinions have such strong possibilities. I've had enough of the disrespectable back and forth lashing as people jump in to fan flames or fight fire with fire. All I want to hear is more canon text proving dany isn't resistant. Stuff that hasn't been named already a hundrred times through the forum. I'm sick of everyone nameing the same miniscule things over and over agin

[dark sister]

Wow you are totally hilarious!!!! Just cause you are all blind to see it from my perspectives and theories/indications proves why my opinions have such strong possibilities. I've had enough of the disrespectable back and forth lashing as people jump in to fan flames or fight fire with fire. All I want to hear is more canon text proving dany isn't resistant. Stuff that hasn't been named already a hundrred times through the forum. I'm sick of everyone nameing the same miniscule things over and over agin

You're not going to get any canon text that says Dany isn't fire resistant because firstly, you've said that you won't be swayed by anyone but GRRM -- so why should we try to sway you? Secondly, the scene in Daznak's Pit was very vague, IMHO, and perhaps it was meant to be described in a vague sort of way. To say that someone "ducked underneath flames" is the vaguest, and hardest-to-swallow sort of prose writing, because it just doesn't make much sense. If, for instance, there had been something like this:

"Drogon saw Dany and from about 300 yards away, blew flame at her head. Dany was watching Drogon's eyes and saw it coming, and as she saw the flame coming towards her she ducked underneath just in time, and the flame crashed into the sands. The sand absorbed the flame immediately and Dany found herself a yard away from the smoking sand."

THEN we would know where the flame had been. That's the problem, we don't know exactly where it was in the air and all we do know is that her hair burned after she somehow avoided the flame.

I think what this poster is trying to say is that we have to believe in the magical, mystical qualities of ASOIAF -- particularly as it relates to Dany and her integral role in the series -- and confine it to that FEELING in and of ITSELF. I've read the way liam stark has been writing these past few pages, and it's obvious that he/she is not reading the facts, whether it has to do with canon (literature), the tv show, GRRM speaking about it (s/he says the only way his/her mind will change is if he refutes Dany's "resilience" to fire), chemistry, science, etc. etc.

This poster won't accept the chemistry-related reasons of how Dany ended up how she did. Well, let's forget chemistry for a minute -- even though the explanation was perfectly valid -- science IS sort of hard to apply to ASOIAF, because it contains many ingredients that don't exist in our world, in this instance, dragons. Now if we go to science and say "well in ASOIAF the pyromancers/maesters say that the hottest things on their planet are the sun, the lava from the planet's core, dragonfire, and wildfire", and then we also say "it's possible that Dany could be burned by the sun, or by lava", this poster will say "but this is my opinion and it makes more SENSE that Dany be resilient to fire". I think the point is, why continue to argue with the poster? Everyone has tried to explain to liam stark and DaveRoid about the unreliable narrator, and everything else -- esp. the part about Martin making a comment about Dany's "fireproof-ness" while writing AFFC -- and it doesn't matter.

Ironically, this type of thinking is called "magical thinking" and can't be persuaded through lengthy, logical arguments. And I mean no disrespect to liam stark, either. I think it's fine that you have your opinion, just realize that you're not backing it up with anything substantial, but rather your feelings. And that's okay. Keep on thinking that she is unburnable if that is what you believe: I guess we'll just have to see what happens in the end! There's no other way to know or even argue about it.

No I thought Danny was the obvious AA after she hatched the dragons. That was such a huge thing sticking out in the prophecy. I knew stannis was a fake of some sort.

As for DaveRoid, have some respect for veterans such as Apple Martini and Dragonfish, who have been here for a long time and always have well thought out, logical, and original arguments. They are also not swayed by character prejudice, as you so accuse them. This isn't their first rodeo. To call them blind and stupid is just really unclassy.

[DaveRoid]

As for DaveRoid, have some respect for veterans such as Apple Martini and Dragonfish, who have been here for a long time and always have well thought out, logical, and original arguments. They are also not swayed by character prejudice, as you so accuse them. This isn't their first rodeo. To call them blind and stupid is just really unclassy.

Ye apple martini is the virtue of unbiase. If you didn't notice he just said this:

The joke here is that Dany is herself a red herring and probably not AA.

So the person that births dragons in a 100 years & one of the central characters in the book is a "red herring".

And he is in the "Why people hate danny thread" saying how he hates her character and hopes she and her dragons die somehow before getting to westroes & bending or killing her challengers to the throne.

Lets be honest here if you dislike a character intensely you would try to find anything good/badass about them and strip it away anyway you can. In this case Danny being the obvious AA candidate, the more vague fact that she is fire proof, the fact that she is a head of a dragon etc etc. In the case of the fire aspect Martine is ambigious and leaves ample wiggle room for such folks to dismiss Danny in that department. And they do it with delight, too bad they will be wrong when it all concludes.

[Mr. E]

This thread has now officially blown my mind.

Apple Martini's a dude? Even though her tag says she-wolf and her gender listing is Female?

Holy God, What a TWIST!

[Dragonfish]

It doesn't matter whether any given poster has a bias or not. Our arguments stand on their own. And if you can't win by addressing our arguments, and instead have to whine about how mean people are being to Dany, then you should really just give up now.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

You're not going to get any canon text that says Dany isn't fire resistant because firstly, you've said that you won't be swayed by anyone but GRRM -- so why should we try to sway you? Secondly, the scene in Daznak's Pit was very vague, IMHO, and perhaps it was meant to be described in a vague sort of way. To say that someone "ducked underneath flames" is the vaguest, and hardest-to-swallow sort of prose writing, because it just doesn't make much sense. If, for instance, there had been something like this:

"Drogon saw Dany and from about 300 yards away, blew flame at her head. Dany was watching Drogon's eyes and saw it coming, and as she saw the flame coming towards her she ducked underneath just in time, and the flame crashed into the sands. The sand absorbed the flame immediately and Dany found herself a yard away from the smoking sand."

THEN we would know where the flame had been. That's the problem, we don't know exactly where it was in the air and all we do know is that her hair burned after she somehow avoided the flame.

I think what this poster is trying to say is that we have to believe in the magical, mystical qualities of ASOIAF -- particularly as it relates to Dany and her integral role in the series -- and confine it to that FEELING in and of ITSELF. I've read the way liam stark has been writing these past few pages, and it's obvious that he/she is not reading the facts, whether it has to do with canon (literature), the tv show, GRRM speaking about it (s/he says the only way his/her mind will change is if he refutes Dany's "resilience" to fire), chemistry, science, etc. etc.

This poster won't accept the chemistry-related reasons of how Dany ended up how she did. Well, let's forget chemistry for a minute -- even though the explanation was perfectly valid -- science IS sort of hard to apply to ASOIAF, because it contains many ingredients that don't exist in our world, in this instance, dragons. Now if we go to science and say "well in ASOIAF the pyromancers/maesters say that the hottest things on their planet are the sun, the lava from the planet's core, dragonfire, and wildfire", and then we also say "it's possible that Dany could be burned by the sun, or by lava", this poster will say "but this is my opinion and it makes more SENSE that Dany be resilient to fire". I think the point is, why continue to argue with the poster? Everyone has tried to explain to liam stark and DaveRoid about the unreliable narrator, and everything else -- esp. the part about Martin making a comment about Dany's "fireproof-ness" while writing AFFC -- and it doesn't matter.

Ironically, this type of thinking is called "magical thinking" and can't be persuaded through lengthy, logical arguments. And I mean no disrespect to liam stark, either. I think it's fine that you have your opinion, just realize that you're not backing it up with anything substantial, but rather your feelings. And that's okay. Keep on thinking that she is unburnable if that is what you believe: I guess we'll just have to see what happens in the end! There's no other way to know or even argue about it.

As for DaveRoid, have some respect for veterans such as Apple Martini and Dragonfish, who have been here for a long time and always have well thought out, logical, and original arguments. They are also not swayed by character prejudice, as you so accuse them. This isn't their first rodeo. To call them blind and stupid is just really unclassy.

You couldn't be more off the mark on the point I am making. I know all the facts and have read the series several times. And your right I won't be convinced unless its george but trying to change my mind with pointless repetitive and verbose paragraphs about an interview (that only says she isn't immune) and slight details over and over again won't do it. Its much more likely she has a resistance to fire or that george is making her believe she has a resistance to fire so that she can die by it. Other wise he is writing contradictily to what most of you have stated. Ask a doctor what happens to your scalp when your hair burns all the way to your skin. Ask a doctor what happens to your skin when a furnace wind blisters it. Drogo's breath would most likely burn other characters if he attempted too. I think dany withstood the hot breath because of her heat reistance. Sure her statements like "I am fire made flesh" could be unreliable narrorating but you can say that about almost anything in this book. My point is its usually more obvious when the POV is being an unreliable narrorator, this case is especially strange because of all the details that point to the truth of what she said. So I'll leave it at the next two books will answer my question and either disprove or approve of my ideas. There is no reason to shoot down my ideas that are only possibilities in such a harsh manner. Sure disagree but all I've heard time and time again is that its impossible...in a world where anything is possible.

[dark sister]

Ye apple martini is the virtue of unbiase. If you didn't notice he just said this:

So the person that births dragons in a 100 years & one of the central characters in the book is a "red herring".

And he is in the "Why people hate danny thread" saying how he hates her character and hopes she and her dragons die somehow before getting to westroes & bending or killing her challengers to the throne.

Lets be honest here if you dislike a character intensely you would try to find anything good/badass about them and strip it away anyway you can. In this case Danny being the obvious AA candidate, the more vague fact that she is fire proof, the fact that she is a head of a dragon etc etc. In the case of the fire aspect Martine is ambigious and leaves ample wiggle room for such folks to dismiss Danny in that department. And they do it with delight, too bad they will be wrong when it all concludes.

Sellsword, you don't even know that Apple Martini is a woman. I thought you might be a long-time lurker and therefore knew the "players" on this board, but wow!

My point is, everyone has his or her own opinion about characters, but the long-time people rely on logical arguments rather than JUST feelings about such and such character. So far, you haven't contributed any good arguments, only insults, which I think is a bad idea. That's all.

[dark sister]

You couldn't be more off the mark on the point I am making. I know all the facts and have read the series several times. And your right I won't be convinced unless its george but trying to change my mind with pointless repetitive and verbose paragraphs about an interview (that only says she isn't immune) and slight details over and over again won't do it. Its much more likely she has a resistance to fire or that george is making her believe she has a resistance to fire so that she can die by it. Other wise he is writing contradictily to what most of you have stated. Ask a doctor what happens to your scalp when your hair burns all the way to your skin. Ask a doctor what happens to your skin when a furnace wind blisters it. Drogo's breath would most likely burn other characters if he attempted too. I think dany withstood the hot breath because of her heat reistance. Sure her statements like "I am fire made flesh" could be unreliable narrorating but you can say that about almost anything in this book. My point is its usually more obvious when the POV is being an unreliable narrorator, this case is especially strange because of all the details that point to the truth of what she said. So I'll leave it at the next two books will answer my question and either disprove or approve of my ideas. There is no reason to shoot down my ideas that are only possibilities in such a harsh manner. Sure disagree but all I've heard time and time again is that its impossible...in a world where anything is possible.

Ok, so let me ask a doctor...

But let's accept what's impossible in a world where anything is possible.

Do you realize how weird your "argument" sounds, when it's read over? That's my POINT. I don't know if it's because English isn't your first language or because of magical thinking, but I clearly stated that it's totally fine for you to think that she is resistant to fire. I said you're not going to come across as a legitimate Dany apologist because you're not making any sense. Sorry, but it's true.

[Empire]

Dany has magic she doesn't know how to use. Like Mirri, Melisandre, Thoros...

I read the entire event as unintentional and very magical.

Dany has some magic, but it's subtle. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar...

[the Iron Bank]

May be I'm wrong but I understood that on book 5 she showed her immunity to fire in a big way as she "flew" out of that pit/arena

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

Ok, so let me ask a doctor...

But let's accept what's impossible in a world where anything is possible.

Do you realize how weird your "argument" sounds, when it's read over? That's my POINT. I don't know if it's because English isn't your first language or because of magical thinking, but I clearly stated that it's totally fine for you to think that she is resistant to fire. I said you're not going to come across as a legitimate Dany apologist because you're not making any sense. Sorry, but it's true.

Oh most certainly!!! Please allow me to bow down to your wise judgements.

[Cruella]

"ask a doctor" bit was actually addressed already, where people pointed out, scientifically, how your hair can burn without your scalp being burned also.

Oh most certainly!!! Please allow me to bow down to your wise judgements.

I am glad you've seen reason now. :cool4:

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

May be I'm wrong but I understood that on book 5 she showed her immunity to fire in a big way as she "flew" out of that pit/arena

She did prove her resistance in my eyes, not immunity. Everyone is drawing their conclusions from an old SSM where he states she isn't immune. Not even the dragons are immune. This leaves a huge gap still there. I believe her statement "He is fire made flesh, and so am I" is reliable narrorating. Cause who better would explain herself than dany. Now if what she said is from the "taint" that everyone keeps pointing out, that means she is going mad and will most likely burn. I highly doubt that though. It'd be poor substance for the end of her story. I belive in dany and have high regard for her character. But I can stand alone with my theories it makes no difference. I think that its obvious in a subtle way to make it questionable. But for all I've noticed of her she is reisitant to fire, she doesn't understand it, but her blood is special similarly to the stark blood.