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References and Homages

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[quote name='Other-in-law' post='1507952' date='Sep 6 2008, 17.07']I don't know if this is in any way intentional or not, but the description of the Statues of the Stark kings and lords (enthroned and clutching swords on their laps) has always reminded me of the [url="http://history.chess.free.fr/images/medieval/lewis-kings.jpg"]kings[/url] from the[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_chessmen"] Lewis chess sets[/url].[/quote]

Heh, I always thought of the Stark statues as more in the style of roman times, but now that I think of it, it is kinda hard to imagine a medieval society making statues with the amount of detail used in antiquity.

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I think I'd go for a bit of improbability on that one then. I doubt Robert would be waxing rhapsodic over Lyanna's statue if it looked that rudimentary.

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You'd have to remember that one of the things that made RL medieval art a bit on the down side is the fall of Rome and its culture(and then the dark age with lots of bloody migrations etc), whereas in Westeros there's never been a great fall of a great culture.
Of course, Westeros is still a bit behind on some of the more sophisticated(and decadent?) peoples of the east.

Also, IIRC from school, the church in RL might've forbade or hindered depictions of realistic humans(of course nude, anatomically accurate statues woul'dve raised more than a shout), probably for reasons of anti-paganic worship and seperation from the "heretical" influences of Roman culture. There's been a "conflict" over that issue between the Catholic and Greek churches.
Of course I might be way off, it's been some time since school and I'm not too sure if the teachers had it right either. Edited by Knight o' Pansies

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[quote name='The Imp's Advocate' post='1554477' date='Oct 14 2008, 01.50']Did anyone else think the 3000 Unsullied against the army of Dothraki were a reference to the 300 Spartans?[/quote]

Ugh, I really hope not.

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I've noticed a couple references to Frank Herbert in this thread, but surely people have noticed the similarities between Arya and Alia (St. Alia of the Knife) Atreides, yes?

Both tested at an extremely young age, trained in various combat arts, both starting down a dark path, killing at a very young age. Both know that fear is the mind killer.

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[quote name='Diva' post='302179' date='May 23 2006, 01.42']also, although there isn't really a connection, whenever I read a Sansa PoV and she is referring / thinking about Gregor Clegane (such as at the Tourney of the Hand), I am reminded of the main character in Kafka's 'Metamorphosis', who is Gregor Samsa[/quote]


I think the connection with Metamorphosis is even stronger now that we are given the impression that Gregor is going to be transformed into some sort of inhuman fighter by Quorin's experiments.

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This is probably not at all intentional by GRRM but i still laughed when i realised. Did everyone notice that ASOS had "four weddings and a funeral?"

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Not only was it deliberate, GRRM announced up front as a teaser that it would have four weddings and a funeral (plus various other things, such as "a turtle of unusual size"). It's in So Spake Martin somewhere.

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Guest Other-in-law
[quote name='A wilding' post='1572205' date='Oct 30 2008, 08.04']Not only was it deliberate, GRRM announced up front as a teaser that it would have four weddings and a funeral (plus various other things, such as "a turtle of unusual size"). It's in So Spake Martin somewhere.[/quote]
I recall that comment, but I think the numbers may have been a bit different from the movie title. For one thing, there were at least two funerals; Hoster Tully's and Bannen's from the NW. For weddings were there more than four? I count Tyrion, Robb, Joffrey, and Littlefinger as grooms off the top of my head. I think there was mention of the number of bears, which would include Brienne's and varamyr's beasts and maybe a lovely undead ice bear, too.

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I have done some digging and you are correct. Here is the most relevant SSM quote [url="http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Month/2000/04/"]SSM April 2000[/url]

[quote]You cannot imagine how much it thrills me to be able to tell you all that A STORM OF SWORDS is finally finished.

...

I fear I lied about the four weddings and the funeral. Now that I am done, I see there are four weddings, =two= funerals, and a wake. Four trials as well. And three dragons, four bears, many mammoths, an unkindness of ravens, and a turtle of unusual size. More battles, swordfights, and deaths than I can count, but two births as well, just to remind us all that life goes on.[/quote]

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Guest Other-in-law
Ok, assuming he did mean Bannen's funeral, who was the wake for?

For trials there's the Hound's trial by combat, Tyrion's trial by combat, maybe also Tyrion's judicial trial, and Merret's kangaroo court trial by the BwB? Or should some of those be replaced by some I'm not thinking of?

Four bears is a bit daunting, too. There's Brienne's bear, that undead snow-bear, and what else? Varamyr's familar bear? Surely not the bear in Astapor that was going to eat three small boys (one rolled in honey, one in blood, and one in rotting fish) in a fighting pit? We never actually [i]saw[/i] the Astapori bear.

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Possibly Jeor/Jorah. Although it is weird to count one but not the other. Or the bear in butterbump's song.

For the wake it might be the scene between Cersei and Jaime in the sept. Not the stereotypical wake, and a bit of a stretch.

Tyrion's trials count as one. The fourth trial, I guess, would be Robb's judgement of Rickard Karstark and his accomplices. Edited by Ibsen's Crawfish

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Guest Other-in-law
Ah, good call on Joffrey's wake! :leer:

Forgot about the Karstark trial; that sounds more apt than Merret.

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Eddard Stark named his sons after his friends and family: Robb for Robert Baratheon, Jon Snow for Jon Arryn, Bran for his brother Brandon and Rickon for his father Rickard.

BUT

George R R Martin created those characters, and he created the Stark family before anyone else. And he named Eddard, Robb and Jon after Teddy, Bobby and John F Kennedy.

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Probably mentioned a dozen times before, but just so nice...

The Young Dragon's account of his war in Dorne, the "Conquest of Dorne" is obviously a reference to Julius Caesar's "Gallic Wars". Especially because he starts with the three kinds of Dornishmen, just as Caesar starts with the famous "Gallia omnia est divisa in partes tres" (or something like that, excuse my rusty latin ;) ).

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