Did Dany truly love Khal Drogo?

[miguel sanchez]

I was very disturbed by their relationship, especially at first, though you need to look at it as if you were Daenerys.

The thing to recognize is the inner strength of Dany. She took control of her situation like none of us would be able to. She took the hand she was dealt in life and played it wonderfully. Her mistake was Mirri Maz Duur, and then she was rewarded with dragons, that whole conclusion being fairly supernatural and very fantasy-esque. But the beginning... the nightly rapings of the husband she was forced onto, the cruelty and control of Viserys? She broke the chains of her life by seizing her title as Khaleesi and forging respect from her husband (a very powerful person to have loving and respecting you) and his people. Regardless of her own feelings towards Drogo (and I believe she did grow to love him in a way) she adapted to her surroundings and never shied away from being a leader. The other thing to think about, is that Dany is no ordinary little girl. The sex from Drogo would have scarred many girls, and made them truly submissive, Dany ended up enjoying it, and finding a path through which her husband did not think her weak.

It was actually an amazing story, albeit a pretty messed up one. Isn't that just George's style though?

To answer the thread title question more directly: Long after he died, Dany still thinks of Drogo as her 'sun and stars', and she certainly loved the protection and position of power he gave her and what he represented. IMO her personality and circumstances prevent her from having pure, reciprocal love with another. The whole relationship pre-disposed her to only desiring alpha males as lovers, I think, which suits her as she is an alpha female. She never wanted Hizdahr, and made a poor choice re-Daario me thinks, but that's a whole other kettle of fish.

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

I've seen so many people only use half of this quote (the latter half) so thank you! It does show that Drogo is not the only thing making her miserable and in pain which goes a long way in explaining why she never blames him or has any ill feelings whatsoever to him.

Exactly, Dany is awake, crying, and in pain every night...before Drogo even enters into the equation. Does he make things worst, of course; but he is not attacking Dany out of malice or rage, and Dany does not view their "activities" as a crime against her.

In Dany's view...it's all these things that made her feel like death was the only way out.

"Day followed day, and night followed night, until Dany knew she could not endure a moment longer. She would kill herself rather than go on...she decided one night..."

[Theda Baratheon]

Oh Dany :( I'll never forget when first reading this series how much I was fond of her

[Éadaoin]

Oh Dany :( I'll never forget when first reading this series how much I was fond of her

Yeah, I used to be more of a Dany fan as well. How things change, eh?

[Theda Baratheon]

Yeah, I used to be more of a Dany fan as well. How things change, eh?

Yeah, it is pretty strange and how some characters really pop up as favourites on re-reads, mainly Stannis.

[TheMysteriousOne]

I'm still a staunch Dany fan. But as of late, I just think that she's lost.

[Dr. Pepper]

I don't feel like I'm an evil person for saying this and i'm going to leave it there.

You aren't.

Lots of mentions about Dany's pain when having sex with Drogo. If one takes a closer look at that passage, it is immediately preceded by the pain she experiences due to riding her horse. She's hurting from riding when Drogo enters her tent. But she's basically equating having sex with Drogo with riding her horse. She doesn't covey any sense of shame or violation. Instead, it's more of the feeling one experiences when learning new skills...say like waterdancing. As time goes on, she comes to love both riding and Drogo. This isn't a Stockholm Syndrome type of deal. It's not even all that different from nearly all other Westerosi noble weddings we see.

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

She was so very awesome in the beginning. Maybe she had a re-awakening in the wilderness with Drogon?

[Éadaoin]

Yeah, it is pretty strange and how some characters really pop up as favourites on re-reads, mainly Stannis.

I am liking Stannis as of late, as well, perhaps because I kind of fell off the Dany train. :P And I think he can be pretty funny.

[Theda Baratheon]

You aren't.

Lots of mentions about Dany's pain when having sex with Drogo. If one takes a closer look at that passage, it is immediately preceded by the pain she experiences due to riding her horse. She's hurting from riding when Drogo enters her tent. But she's basically equating having sex with Drogo with riding her horse. She doesn't covey any sense of shame or violation. Instead, it's more of the feeling one experiences when learning new skills...say like waterdancing. As time goes on, she comes to love both riding and Drogo. This isn't a Stockholm Syndrome type of deal. It's not even all that different from nearly all other Westerosi noble weddings we see.

This is what I've been thinking, yes. Except there is actual love in this marriage, or at least respect.

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

You aren't.

Lots of mentions about Dany's pain when having sex with Drogo. If one takes a closer look at that passage, it is immediately preceded by the pain she experiences due to riding her horse. She's hurting from riding when Drogo enters her tent. But she's basically equating having sex with Drogo with riding her horse. She doesn't covey any sense of shame or violation. Instead, it's more of the feeling one experiences when learning new skills...say like waterdancing. As time goes on, she comes to love both riding and Drogo. This isn't a Stockholm Syndrome type of deal. It's not even all that different from nearly all other Westerosi noble weddings we see.

:agree: (We must improvise now that the "like" button is out of commission.)

[Theda Baratheon]

She was so very awesome in the beginning. Maybe she had a re-awakening in the wilderness with Drogon?

I have been growing a bit tired of her AND THEN SUDDENLY SHE JUMPS INTO THE PIT AND WHIPS THE FUCK OUT OF A DRAGON INTO SUBMISSION

And then I was like 'AWWWW YEEEE GRRRL' except I don't want her to sit the Iron Throne, I want her to find a nice place to belong and be happy. :(

[Theda Baratheon]

I am liking Stannis as of late, as well, perhaps because I kind of fell off the Dany train. :P And I think he can be pretty funny.

I know right! I think he's hilarious. His grinding of he teeth, his absolute lack of understanding for those of the female persuasion :lol:

Oh and his amazing dry wit :cool4:

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

I have been growing a bit tired of her AND THEN SUDDENLY SHE JUMPS INTO THE PIT AND WHIPS THE FUCK OUT OF A DRAGON INTO SUBMISSION

Yes! Yes! YES!!!

And then I was like 'AWWWW YEEEE GRRRL' except I don't want her to sit the Iron Throne, I want her to find a nice place to belong and be happy. :(

That's how I feel about Stannis. :crying:

[Theda Baratheon]

Yes! Yes! YES!!!

That's how I feel about Stannis. :crying:

Can Stannis even be happy? :(

[Lady Tippy Wolfsbane]

Can Stannis even be happy? :(

I don't know...dammit, I don't know. :bawl:

Stannis. :crying:

[juanml82]

This is the book's first sexual relationship between Drogo and Danny

Khal Drogo stared at her tears, his face strangely empty of expression. “No,” he said. He lifted his hand and rubbed away the tears roughly with a callused thumb.

“You speak the Common Tongue,” Dany said in wonder.

“No,” he said again.

Perhaps he had only that word, she thought, but it was one word more than she had known he had, and somehow it made her feel a little better. Drogo touched her hair lightly, sliding the silver-blond strands between his fingers and murmuring softly in Dothraki. Dany did not understand the words, yet there was warmth in the tone, a tenderness she had never expected from this man.

He put his finger under her chin and lifted her head, so she was looking up into his eyes. Drogo towered over her as he towered over everyone. Taking her lightly under the arms, he lifted her and seated her on a rounded rock beside the stream. Then he sat on the ground facing her, legs crossed beneath him, their faces finally at a height. “No,” he said.

“Is that the only word you know?” she asked him.

Drogo did not reply. His long heavy braid was coiled in the dirt beside him. He pulled it over his right shoulder and began to remove the bells from his hair, one by one. After a moment Dany leaned forward to help. When they were done, Drogo gestured. She understood. Slowly, carefully, she began to undo his braid.

It took a long time. All the while he sat there silently, watching her. When she was done, he shook his head, and his hair spread out behind him like a river of darkness, oiled and gleaming. She had never seen hair so long, so black, so thick.

Then it was his turn. He began to undress her.

His fingers were deft and strangely tender. He removed her silks one by one, carefully, while Dany sat unmoving, silent, looking at his eyes. When he bared her small breasts, she could not help herself. She averted her eyes and covered herself with her hands. “No,” Drogo said. He pulled her hands away from her breasts, gently but firmly, then lifted her face again to make her look at him. “No,” he repeated.

“No,” she echoed back at him.

He stood her up then and pulled her close to remove the last of her silks. The night air was chilly on her bare skin. She shivered, and gooseflesh covered her arms and legs. She was afraid

of what would come next, but for a while nothing happened. Khal Drogo sat with his legs crossed, looking at her, drinking in her body with his eyes.

After a while he began to touch her. Lightly at first, then harder. She could sense the fierce strength in his hands, but he never hurt her. He held her hand in his own and brushed her fingers, one by one. He ran a hand gently down her leg. He stroked her face, tracing the curve of her ears, running a finger gently around her mouth. He put both hands in her hair and combed it with his fingers. He turned her around, massaged her shoulders, slid a knuckle down the path of her spine.

It seemed as if hours passed before his hands finally went to her breasts. He stroked the soft skin underneath until it tingled. He circled her nipples with his thumbs, pinched them between thumb and forefinger, then began to pull at her, very lightly at first, then more insistently, until her nipples stiffened and began to ache.

He stopped then, and drew her down onto his lap. Dany was flushed and breathless, her heart fluttering in her chest. He cupped her face in his huge hands and looked into his eyes. “No?” he said, and she knew it was a question.

She took his hand and moved it down to the wetness between her thighs. “Yes,” she whispered as she put his finger inside her.

Disturbing as it is - and I'd say it's supposed to be disturbing - due the age difference and their marriage's circumstances, I can't consider it rape, as in Drogo hitting her into submission and forcing him into her. It's certainly not right by modern standards and I wouldn't really call it consensual, despite Drogo asking her. But he is maneuvering her so she would desire him. Actually, he's showing a lot more of care than in their following encounters. Of course, he probably does it for himself much more than for her, but it's certainly far from the TV version.

As other mentioned, her pain later isn't probably related to Drogo brutalizing her, but rather as the sexual act opening the wounds she got riding. And Drogo, as expected, treats her as little more than a rubber doll. She doesn't like it, that much is clear and, were they in an egalitarian relationship, she would certainly refuse to have, at the very least, that kind of sex. This isn't unlike all the other arranged marriages in the series except, perhaps, for Danny's young age. Lysa Tully probably never wanted to even touch Jon Arryn and Cersei came to despise having Robert in bed.

Then Danny has her dream about the dragon burning her and she changes overnight, physically and mentally. As for realism, that has to be magic and it kinds of require a certain amount of suspension of disbelief. She pretty much leaves behind the scared persona she was until then as if changing her dress, and the new Danny takes the reins of the relationship and both of them begin to fall in love.

I just don't think Danny's change can happen to real people, so IMHO the argument 'she fell in love with her rapist' suffers from Martin's use of Applied Phlebotinum

[Theda Baratheon]

I don't know...dammit, I don't know. :bawl:

Stannis. :crying:

HE IS SO FRUSTRATING :(

[hollowcrown]

As other mentioned, her pain later isn't probably related to Drogo brutalizing her, but rather as the sexual act opening the wounds she got riding. And Drogo, as expected, treats her as little more than a rubber doll. She doesn't like it, that much is clear and, were they in an egalitarian relationship, she would certainly refuse to have, at the very least, that kind of sex.

Well it's still rape. If my girlfriend doesn't want to have sex...we don't do it, especially if she's had a physically exhausting day or something and if she was injured down there I would definitely not consider it if it was hurting her.

Earlier in the thread the "day after day night after night" quote came out. Dany might not have considered suicide if she had nights off from the rapes from Khal Drogo.

Anyway Dany and Drogo never seemed to have any conversations, we never learn about the man's past from her PoV. I don't see how it's "love" without that kind of thing there, just some weird twisted sex rape relationship.

[Arkantos]

Where did it say Dany didn't want to have sex? Maybe she wanted to make Drogo happy.