awful double standards >:(

[Stannis the Wight]

If I ever met Sophie Turner I would ask her to be my queen. Sure she's 7 years younger than me but I can live with that, she is coming into her own nicely.

[Bayard]

Does this double standard come from gender discrimination?? probably in some cases. But think about this. Everyone who watches the show thinks Joffrey is a horrible POS, and I've heard plenty of times beeing said that Gleeson is a terrific actor because he is capable of bringing that character back to life. How many times did you see it written in this forum, that Sophie Turner is a great actress?? A lot less. Both are playing annoying characters, but in Jack's case it's clear he is a great actor (he also has a lot more experience) and people have that in the back of their heads when they meet him. Even more, Joffrey is so over the top, that people can't imagine that he is the same in real life, they separate the role from the actor. Sansa on the other hand is a very real character, so people think subconsciously that they are the same :). And for the few people who watch the interviews, Sophie Turner does seem annoying even in real life :leaving:

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

When I made my original comment, I was actually defending Jack Gleeson as saying gender stereotypes were wrong to say that he couldn't express being hurt by stranger abuse more than Sophie because of gender stereotypes.

It was spectacularly misinterpreted and a poster got aggressive so I didn't bother continuing the debate.

However the poster who mentioned people tend to much more critical of female characters is right. I believe this is at least part due to the fact until recently, many female characters weren't written very well. That's what I like about Martin, he can write women and children.

[Roose Seal]

I think comparing Jack Gleeson and Lena Hedley would be more appropriate.

They both play characters we're supposed to "love to hate", only Jack is a dude so it's okay for him to be crazy and violent and abusive and Lena is a woman so she just comes off as a bitchy bitch and that's not okay. It's stupid.

Pretending like it's not gender discrimination is ludicrous: look at how much people hate Catelyn just because she said that one thing to Jon. People don't like women to have an opinion, let alone assert it out loud.

Oh and fuck people who can't differentiate a character from the actor who plays them.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

I think comparing Jack Gleeson and Lena Hedley would be more appropriate.

They both play characters we're supposed to "love to hate", only Jack is a dude so it's okay for him to be crazy and violent and abusive and Lena is a woman so she just comes off as a bitchy bitch and that's not okay. It's stupid.

Pretending like it's not gender discrimination is ludicrous: look at how much people hate Catelyn just because she said that one thing to Jon. People don't like women to have an opinion, let alone assert it out loud.

Oh and fuck people who can't differentiate a character from the actor who plays them.

I want to kiss you. :bowdown:

[Jon Mark Selmy]

Pehaps this is not a double standard. Pehaps it's just that Sophie is more truthful about what really happens and/or more sensitive, while Jack is the more collected, "follow the press guy orientation" type. The real double standard here probably has more to do with how boys and girls are created, not how both characters are perceived. Also, I have a really hard time believing some character on the show is more hated than Joffrey.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

I once read a thread explaining why Sansa was actually the most evil character in the series. :dunno:

The internet is full of whackos, and not just the good ones like us.

[Pinkie Baelish]

I think comparing Jack Gleeson and Lena Hedley would be more appropriate.

They both play characters we're supposed to "love to hate", only Jack is a dude so it's okay for him to be crazy and violent and abusive and Lena is a woman so she just comes off as a bitchy bitch and that's not okay. It's stupid.

Pretending like it's not gender discrimination is ludicrous: look at how much people hate Catelyn just because she said that one thing to Jon. People don't like women to have an opinion, let alone assert it out loud.

Oh and fuck people who can't differentiate a character from the actor who plays them.

Yeah, this is apparent throughout all TV shows. Skyler White, in particular receives massive amounts of hate simply for being the voice of reason. Yes, she can come off as cold, but she's generally right. Also, people got the ridiculous idea that Anna Gunn's weight gain in season 4 was a legitimate reason to spew even more hatred towards Skyler.

I once read a thread explaining why Sansa was actually the most evil character in the series. :dunno:

The internet is full of whackos, and not just the good ones like us.

Was it this one? http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/30326-sansa-is-the-worst-person-in-westeros/

Because that thread was friggin hilarious

[Jon Mark Selmy]

And besides, reading only her chapters is a step up over some characters.

Wasn't it Charles Dance who said that he "doesn't have the time to read several thousand pages"? Yeah, I call bull on that. But whateves.

If he keeps delivering such an amazing performance, he can read or not read whatever he likes. It's the ones whose characterization is flawed I'm worried about. If Dance can basically BE Tywin without ever reading a page, it's fine by me. It is a job to him and I seriously prefer he executes it well rather than have a lesser actor who loves the books and has had all of them.

[Jon Mark Selmy]

You did NOT just go there.... :thumbsdown:

do you have ANY idea how strong ballerinas are? Ballerinas strength/mass ratio is way WAY beyond that of even the strongest weight lifters!

Do you have even the slightest inclination what discipline, will power, training and sheer torture goes into dancing on pointe, AND making the whole shebang look like you're just having tea with your grandma in a tutu? Ballerinas are better athletes than Football players, and if you're going to be fooled by the color pink, then I can't help you ser,

You better check yourself!

And so what? The guy wasn't criticizing ballerinas. He was criticizing silly little teenage behavior.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

Yeah, this is apparent throughout all TV shows. Skyler White, in particular receives massive amounts of hate simply for being the voice of reason. Yes, she can come off as cold, but she's generally right. Also, people got the ridiculous idea that Anna Gunn's weight gain in season 4 was a legitimate reason to spew even more hatred towards Skyler.

Was it this one? http://asoiaf.wester...on-in-westeros/

Because that thread was friggin hilarious

Yeah on Sky, I feel sorry as for her. And she's stuck in a mega abusive relationship. Too many just get their rocks off on 'but he's so keeeewwwwl' and miss the actual 'drugs are bad, mckay, power is bad, mckay' r Mackay point of the show.

Also yeah apparently the fact she isn't attractive enough for Walt is strange. She is supposed to be a new mother, after all.

YES! That was the thread! It was posted on IMDB where I used to lurk before I joined here.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

And so what? The guy wasn't criticizing ballerinas. He was criticizing silly little teenage behavior.

BB was light-heartedly explaining how much discipline and strength goes into being a ballerina.

[Jon Mark Selmy]

I'm glad I'm 17. I'm allowed to think she's hot. :lol:

I'm 25. And I'd be allowed to think she is hot even if I were 90! Seriously, quit the silly "age appropriate" bullshit, she is 17! Unless she is a child and so unable to give consent (which in actuality has more to do with maturity than a set-in-stone age), you're fine. I wouldn't pursue her if I were in a position to do so, though. For gods sake, she likes Justin Bieber. That's a HUGE turn off. Well, considering the level of maturity needed to like this kind of crap, I guess it WOULD be pedophilia after all.

[Roose Seal]

^Creepy post is creepy.

Yeah, this is apparent throughout all TV shows. Skyler White, in particular receives massive amounts of hate simply for being the voice of reason. Yes, she can come off as cold, but she's generally right. Also, people got the ridiculous idea that Anna Gunn's weight gain in season 4 was a legitimate reason to spew even more hatred towards Skyler.

Yes or sleeping with another guy is apparently worse than making and dealing drugs, killing people, poisoning kids, etc etc...

The amount of hatred Gunn gets just because her character does not follow Walt blindly is absolutely ridiculous.

It's also the same in Dexter. Jennifer Carpenter gets tremendous amounts of hate but MC Hall is a god amongst men to some.

[Jon Mark Selmy]

BB was light-heartedly explaining how much discipline and strength goes into being a ballerina.

Yeah, and I agree it does. However he/she felt the need to point it out to contradict someone who didn't said the opposiite on the first place. The first poster was not saying "ballarinas are silly and weak", he/she was saying "silly teenage behavior is silly".

[Jon Mark Selmy]

^Creepy post is creepy.

How so? Are you implying that an older person can't love and have a relationship with a younger one?

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

^Creepy post is creepy.

Yes or sleeping with another guy is apparently worse than making and dealing drugs, killing people, poisoning kids, etc etc...

The amount of hatred Gunn gets just because her character does not follow Walt blindly is absolutely ridiculous.

It's also the same in Dexter. Jennifer Carpenter gets tremendous amounts of hate but MC Hall is a god amongst men to some.

Or Lori on Walking Dead (I've only just started Season 2, but the amount of hate she got for sleeping with Shane when she thought Rick was dead...Because Shane told her so! Blerg.)

I have no issue with age gap relationships, but even at 20 I remember how much 'younger' I was at 17. It wouldn't be right for a 25 year old man/woman to date a seventeen year old. The brain just isn't developed, no matter how mayure they are for their age.

Kinda OT but doesn't the brain keep developing into your mid twenties?

I don't think anyone cares about age differences near a decade when there isn't a huge difference in brain development between 30 and 40 for example, but there is between 17 and 25. I'm sure there are cases where it works, but on the whole I don't think most 17 year olds are that mature.

Finding Sophie repugnant because she's 17 and sexy as Hell when she's 18 would be weird though (some people seem to think they can't admit someone is sexy until they turn 18? :dunno: )

[Werthead]

Peter and Nikolai haven't read the book. It's at the 1:10 mark:

Where did you hear that Emilia has? I've heard Kit and Alfie say they have.

Richard Madden and Aidan Gillen have also read (at least a few of) the books. Michelle Fairley definitely hasn't. The record probably goes to Ron Donachie, who read all four of the (then-published) books within about four days of being cast :) And then realised they were written by the same guy who wrote his favourite vampire novel from the 1980s :D

[Jon Mark Selmy]

I have no issue with age gap relationships, but even at 20 I remember how much 'younger' I was at 17. It wouldn't be right for a 25 year old man/woman to date a seventeen year old. The brain just isn't developed, no matter how mayure they are for their age.

Kinda OT but doesn't the brain keep developing into your mid twenties?

I don't think anyone cares about age differences near a decade when there isn't a huge difference in brain development between 30 and 40 for example, but there is between 17 and 25. I'm sure there are cases where it works, but on the whole I don't think most 17 year olds are that mature.

Finding Sophie repugnant because she's 17 and sexy as Hell when she's 18 would be weird though (some people seem to think they can't admit someone is sexy until they turn 18? :dunno: )

Well, this "age gap" between 17 and 20 is very cultural dependant and also very personal. I wouldn't date most 18 years old for reasons of maturity. But I also wouldn't date most 20 years old for the same reasons. Or most 25 years old for that matter. I have, however, at 19, dated a very smart, kind and mature 16 years old who was actually WAY more mature than I was at the time. It really, really can't be set on stone.

EDIT: Rule of thumb -> If she is into Justin Bieber, it's pedophilia. Even if she's 35.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

Well, this "age gap" between 17 and 20 is very cultural dependant and also very personal. I wouldn't date most 18 years old for reasons of maturity. But I also wouldn't date most 20 years old for the same reasons. Or most 25 years old for that matter. I have, however, at 19, dated a very smart, kind and mature 16 years old who was actually WAY more mature than I was at the time. It really, really can't be set on stone.

Yes but a 19 year old boy and a 16 year old girl probably have similar levels of maturity (if my remembrance of science is right) A 17 year old and a 25 year old is much, much more rare. No it's not set in stone but there are genetic and generic ideas.

Cultural or not, it's wrong to have a serious relationship with someone who isn't emotionally ready for one just because 'my culture says it's okay IMO. But we all have our own opinions, so :dunno: I'll leave it at that.