Interviewing Bryan Cogman

[Khal Porno]

I disagree that he is doing a much better job than D&D, I see him more as the Harrison to their Lennon/McCartney. And Now His Watch is Ended and Walk of Punishment were very strong imo. And "A Man Without Honor" was probably as thematic as this episode. I also think it's much easier to do 1 episode per season then it is to do 7, and I think that if Cogman had to do the same number of episodes as D&D he wouldn't be able to keep up the quality. I also think that he has a much greater say in plotting the storylines than people think, going by his interviews.

Everyone credited with an "executive producer" has input into the breakdowns of the stories and will contribute writing here and there throughout the season. In fact, in TV credits, often "producer" is just another term for "writer," according to Drew Carey's book "Dirty Jokes and Beer."

[boojam]

Everyone credited with an "executive producer" has input into the breakdowns of the stories and will contribute writing here and there throughout the season. In fact, in TV credits, often "producer" is just another term for "writer," according to Drew Carey's book "Dirty Jokes and Beer."

Because it says "executive producer" probably does mean they have input, as we have found out Dave and Dan have the final word.

We have indications that George Martin is consulted, but he gives the impression that he does not or no longer reads the teleplays for each season. We know he influenced one decision in season 2, but seemingly not much after that.

This does not mean he does not take interest in the show.

[The Real Prophet]

Can we please ask Cogman in the next interview why they didn't just refer to garlan or Willa's and make them the younger brother? They've created a huge continuity plot hole with olenna breaking so Lora's doesn't join the Kingsguard because he already coluntarily joined Renly's Kingsguard in season 2. And the fact that he was never really king doesn't explain it because at the time that's what Loras and the tyrells thought and wanted to happen. All the other little stuff doesn't bother me at all, but this pretty much ruins the realisticness of the show for me personally.

[Khal Porno]

Can we please ask Cogman in the next interview why they didn't just refer to garlan or Willa's and make them the younger brother? They've created a huge continuity plot hole with olenna breaking so Lora's doesn't join the Kingsguard because he already coluntarily joined Renly's Kingsguard in season 2. And the fact that he was never really king doesn't explain it because at the time that's what Loras and the tyrells thought and wanted to happen. All the other little stuff doesn't bother me at all, but this pretty much ruins the realisticness of the show for me personally.

I don't understand the plot hole.

Either Renly's Kingsguard could still inherit and no one was worried about it, or Loras could no longer inherit after he became Renly's Kingsguard and once he left it he was able to inherit again.

Most likely Olenna was not pleased that Loras joined Renly's Kingsguard and then was glad when he left it.

[The Real Prophet]

Well then you're not very observant... If Renly never would have died like they obviously planned then he never would have left said Kingsguard and the tyrell name would have died out.

And to be clear we aren't talking about inheriting high garden were talking about the fact he would have no heirs and in show canon they're are no other male tyrells.

[Khal Porno]

Well then you're not very observant... If Renly never would have died like they obviously planned then he never would have left said Kingsguard and the tyrell name would have died out.

And to be clear we aren't talking about inheriting high garden were talking about the fact he would have no heirs and in show canon they're are no other male tyrells.

They planned for Renly to die? What?

And I understand clearly that if Loras is Mace Tyrell's only son then his sons won't inherit...however there MUST be other male Tyrells (cousins, nephews, etc) who would be next in line.

I'm still not seeing a plot hole here. Olenna probably was upset with Loras for joining Renly's Kingsguard, but he did it so he could be with Renly. He probably didn't care about being the heir to Highgarden while he was in love with Renly.

[The Real Prophet]

Now I just have to call you slow....First if you had reading comprehension you'd see that I said they planned for him NOT to die, second of all if there were more male tyrells then the pothole would come in when twin says and I quote, "Lora's will never have sons, and the tyrell name will fade and high garden will go to the second child of Joffrey and Margarey"

[Khal Porno]

Now I just have to call you slow....First if you had reading comprehension you'd see that I said they planned for him NOT to die, second of all if there were more male tyrells then the pothole would come in when twin says and I quote, "Lora's will never have sons, and the tyrell name will fade and high garden will go to the second child of Joffrey and Margarey"

First, don't be a dick. Second, "if Renly never died like they obviously planned" grammatically looks like "they planned for Renly to die but that never happened." Third, I don't remember that line so my bad. Fourth, there is still no plothole.

[The Real Prophet]

And finally you've come to idiot status for still saying that isn't a plothole.

He said it last episode genius, it's EXACTLY why olenna agrees to marry Loras to cersei.

And grammatically it reads if renly never died like they obviously planned reads like they didn't plan for Renly to die! Smart guy....

[Lord_Ravenstone]

@The Real Prophet There probably are more Tyrells.

Daughters just come before brothers in inheritance usually.

[The Real Prophet]

Once again you're wrong as well. Margarey and Joffreys children would have been Baratheons and as such never would have came before any tyrell.

[The Real Prophet]

And for like the 10th time... If there were more tyrells, olenna wouldn't have gave 2 flowers about tywin makin him Kingsguard.

[Khal Porno]

Dude, there is NO PLOT HOLE. If Olenna is against Loras joining Joffrey's Kingsguard, she was surely against Loras joining Renly's Kingsguard but he did it anyway because he was in love with Renly.

[Khal Porno]

And finally you've come to idiot status for still saying that isn't a plothole.

He said it last episode genius, it's EXACTLY why olenna agrees to marry Loras to cersei.

And grammatically it reads if renly never died like they obviously planned reads like they didn't plan for Renly to die! Smart guy....

Are you twelve years old with these insults? And yes, the "like they obviously planned" in your sentence refers to Renly's death because of the way you wrote it, not the way you intended it.

[The Real Prophet]

God you're bright..... The tyrells never would have aligned themselves with renly if it meant the extinction of their house you halfwit!

It's proven that their are no other tyrells when Tywin says high garden would go to JOFFREY AND MARGAREYS children.... Have a shred of intelligence, please.

[Khal Porno]

God you're bright..... The tyrells never would have aligned themselves with renly if it meant the extinction of their house you halfwit!

It's proven that their are no other tyrells when Tywin says high garden would go to JOFFREY AND MARGAREYS children.... Have a shred of intelligence, please.

I'm going to ignore your childish insults and focus on the issue at hand.

Maybe the Tyrells didn't know Loras was going to join Renly's Kingsguard. Maybe Margaery and Loras did their thing without their parents' approval. Maybe Mace and Olenna didn't even know Loras was in Renly's Kingsguard because he didn't want them to know and withdraw their support. And again, maybe Renly's Kingsguards could inherit. In the books it certainly seemed like they played by different rules than the regular Kingsguard and it seemed that way in the show as well.

Come on man, there are any number of explanations that you can infer.

[The Real Prophet]

We aren't talking about inheriting! Kingsguard can not wed and this Loras would have no sons, thus when Loras dies, so does the Tyrell name. And you're inferences are just not possible. Renly and Loras both know their alliance would end immediately once The Lord of highgarden knew their legacy and family name were at stake. Come on to you, the show is great and most complaints are idiotic, but they fucked up royally here, plain and simple.

And it all could have been avoiding without affecting show plot if Willas, Garlan or both were just made into the younger brothers.

In fact, I'd seriously doubt the Tyrells would even let their heir go and fight the war, after all they never let the REAL heir leave Highgarden in the books.

[Khal Porno]

We aren't talking about inheriting! Kingsguard can not wed and this Loras would have no sons, thus when Loras dies, so does the Tyrell name. And you're inferences are just not possible. Renly and Loras both know their alliance would end immediately once The Lord of highgarden knew their legacy and family name were at stake. Come on to you, the show is great and most complaints are idiotic, but they fucked up royally here, plain and simple.

No, once again maybe the rules for Renly's Kingsguard for different.

Or, once again (and this is the explanation that makes the most sense and ought to be satisfying to you), maybe Loras joined Renly's Kingsguard after the Tyrells had pledged to join Renly and married Margaery to him. In that case, Mace and Olenna would have been royally pissed but there would have been nothing they could do.

If they abandoned Renly they would have been personae non gratae to both him AND Joffrey, so the Tyrells would have lost regardless of who won the war and ended up king of Westeros. Not to mention that they couldn't abandon their daughter.

[ambi76]

Or, once again (and this is the explanation that makes the most sense and ought to be satisfying to you), maybe Loras joined Renly's Kingsguard after the Tyrells had pledged to join Renly and married Margaery to him. In that case, Mace and Olenna would have been royally pissed but there would have been nothing they could do.

Fine, maybe it was like this, the problem I have now is this: What is more likely to happen now storywise?

Loras marries Cersei and they have a brazillion Tyrell babies to save the name. :love:

Loras does exactly the same thing again and joins Joff's kingsguard against the explicit wishes of his family and just single-handedly got his family name extinct? :bang: (Again? Well, I guess Mace and Olenna could be really royally pissed then. For realz? Why the fuck would they even talk to him anymore?)

I think the second version is more likely and lets the Tyrells do the exact opposite of "Growing Strong" which is a bit weird in context of ASOIAF.

ETA: This should probably be in a D&D thread and not a Cogman thread, I guess. And If they go with the first route I'll tip my hat to them.

I would love to see Loras/Cersei babies. Maybe male twins they can call Garlan and Willas. :idea:

[Ran]

The obvious explantion in the show is that the only vow in Renly's Kingsguard was to guard his life and give your life for his. That is, after all, the only vow we see Brienne swearing in the second season.

I am deeply baffled by how they'll justify his entry into the Kingsguard on the show, however, without making the character even more unsympathetic than they already have. Assuming, of course, that they do have him join the Kingsguard. They don't have to.