[Book Spoilers!] Episode 7 Preview

[Logodnica]

I'm hoping Robb finds out about Sansa's upcoming wedding and writes his will in this episode.

[Nick_Scryer]

I'm hoping Robb finds out about Sansa's upcoming wedding and writes his will in this episode.

I think he will, he'll disinherit Sansa and make Jon next in line after his own son and that's why there will be a Robb/Talisa sex scene this episode. They're trying to make an heir. My guess.

[bobbybuilderton]

Just rewatched one of the trailers and Melisandre says "A darkness is coming that will swallow the dawn (or something like that). We can stop it, you and I." That's probably what Melisandre will say to gendry, followed by "I'm just a bastard" and followed by her reminding him that Thoros was a drunken fool and R'hllor used him in unimaginable ways. I doubt she will tell him who his father is.

Also, in one of the trailers, there is a view of the camera zooming in on Jon from above. That poster is probably right about the eye attack coming at Queenscrown, because it has the same look as another scene in a trailer where Jon is holding a sword to a bald man's throat.

[Colonel Green]

(Given Tywin’s opinion of whores, it won’t be the brutal way he killed Ros).

I could see it being about killing Ros, from a perspective of him alarming House Tyrell with his behaviour.

GRRM writes a very good Sansa, so I'm glad he's the one handling her reaction to the marriage plot. I wonder if they're going to have the Tyrells totally cut her loose like they did in the book.

[Newstar]

Am I the only one hoping for at least one exchange between Loras and Cersei as an engaged couple? Comedy gold, people.

I’ve whiffed on predicting the scene where Loras storms away from Margaery and Olenna at the dinner table in two straight episodes, but I’ll take one more crack at it here. He won’t be happy about having to marry Cersei, but no doubt Olenna will find a suitably witty way to tell him off.

I think the scene at the dinner table is from the Tyrion/Sansa wedding feast in 3x08. I'm guessing Loras throws a hissyfit (over what I'm not sure, exactly, as I think he would have found out about his engagement before 3x08) and Olenna is smiling indulgently at his tantrum because she's secretly pleased that he's making the Lannisters (or maybe just Cersei) look ridiculous.

GRRM writes a very good Sansa, so I'm glad he's the one handling her reaction to the marriage plot. I wonder if they're going to have the Tyrells totally cut her loose like they did in the book.

I'm guessing that 3x07 is the episode where she realizes (or someone spells out for her) that the only reason the Lannisters and Tyrells are interested in her as a marriage prospect is her claim. She might also realize maybe not that Loras is gay, but that Loras never loved her. The Tyrells might also start snubbing her, compounding her misery.

We'll probably get some exposition in 3x07 as to wedding timing, since as of the end of 3x06, it's not clear when Tyrion/Sansa and Loras/Cersei are getting married, or who's supposed to go first. Maybe someone will mention that Olenna has insisted that Loras/Cersei's wedding wait until after Joffrey and Margaery's, and Tywin decides to get the Tyrion/Sansa wedding out of the way as soon as possible so he can at least marry off one of his children without it interfering with the Joffrey/Margaery wedding.

It will be interesting to see how GRRM handles the non-book plots, since there are a lot of them in this episode: Gendry/Melisandre, Loras/Willas swap-occasioned KL plot changes, Shae/Tyrion blowout over the engagement, non-book Sansa scene with Sansa mulling over the news of her engagement (as opposed to the books where she had no time to think about it), Tywin making mincemeat out of Joffrey, Robb/Talisa love scene, Ramsay mutilating (possibly castrating) Theon (which happened in the books but happened "off screen"), and so on.

[Khalessi]

Do you think it's possible Robb might be getting his gift from Ramsay this week. Or do you think the show might leave that out?

[go joff go]

This episode seems like its going to be crazy busy.

[Colonel Green]

We'll probably get some exposition in 3x07 as to wedding timing, since as of the end of 3x06, it's not clear when Tyrion/Sansa and Loras/Cersei are getting married, or who's supposed to go first. Maybe someone will mention that Olenna has insisted that Loras/Cersei's wedding wait until after Joffrey and Margaery's, and Tywin decides to get the Tyrion/Sansa wedding out of the way as soon as possible so he can at least marry off one of his children without it interfering with the Joffrey/Margaery wedding.

The Frey envoys said the Red Wedding would have to happen within two weeks of that day, so the Tyrion/Sansa wedding is definitely being fast-tracked.

[SoManyVows]

I think the scene at the dinner table is from the Tyrion/Sansa wedding feast in 3x08. I'm guessing Loras throws a hissyfit (over what I'm not sure, exactly, as I think he would have found out about his engagement before 3x08) and Olenna is smiling indulgently at his tantrum because she's secretly pleased that he's making the Lannisters (or maybe just Cersei) look ridiculous.

That actually fits much better than what I proposed in my post. I defer to your logic.

I'm guessing that 3x07 is the episode where she realizes (or someone spells out for her) that the only reason the Lannisters and Tyrells are interested in her as a marriage prospect is her claim. She might also realize maybe not that Loras is gay, but that Loras never loved her. The Tyrells might also start snubbing her, compounding her misery.

We'll probably get some exposition in 3x07 as to wedding timing, since as of the end of 3x06, it's not clear when Tyrion/Sansa and Loras/Cersei are getting married, or who's supposed to go first. Maybe someone will mention that Olenna has insisted that Loras/Cersei's wedding wait until after Joffrey and Margaery's, and Tywin decides to get the Tyrion/Sansa wedding out of the way as soon as possible so he can at least marry off one of his children without it interfering with the Joffrey/Margaery wedding.

Olenna will no doubt insist that the Cersei-Loras wedding be delayed until after the Royal Wedding (since she didn't want it in the first place). I think that the simplest explanation as to why Tywin will agree to wait is that the Joffrey-Margaery wedding is the one that's truly necessary to secure the Lannister-Tyrell alliance. Cersei and Loras (or Cersei and Willas in the books) is kind of doubling down on that bet. If for some wild reason the Royal Wedding were to fall apart before it's completed (we know it won't, but hypothetically), I doubt that Tywin would be as keen to marry Cersei to Loras as opposed to say, Oberyn Martell. With the Sansa-Tyrion union, on the other hand, Tywin is in complete control of both players, and their prospective marriage is free from any such political constraints. He can give any excuse he wants for marrying them off as soon as possible. Of course, his true reason (which will go unsaid in the show) is that he's taking steps to set up the Red Wedding, and wants Sansa wedded to (and ideally impregnated by) Tyrion before Robb dies so as to eliminate the possibilty that an heir to the North by Talisa could supplant her in the line of succession (obviously at this point we don't know if Talisa is in on the conspiracy and is taking moon tea to prevent such a thing from happening. I continue to believe she's not involved).

[SoManyVows]

Do you think it's possible Robb might be getting his gift from Ramsay this week. Or do you think the show might leave that out?

I think that moment will probably be cut. In the books, Ramsay sends that bit of flayed skin to his father, who in turn gives it Robb. Roose won't meet up with Robb until Episode 8 at the earliest (more likely Episode 9, since they'll probably just have them meet up at the wedding). The moment Roose admits that his bastard is the one who's been torturing Theon, the viewers will know that the Boltons are a twisted bunch who can't be trusted, if they haven't already figured it out (from the non-readers I've talked to, the popular theory seems to be that Roose is letting Jaime go to hedge his bets with Tywin, rather than betraying Robb utterly). Given the trouble the writers have gone to in order to keep the true identity of "Boy" under wraps and how long they've put it off (to the immense frustration of the casual viewer, according to several of the non-reader reviews I've read), at this point I'd been stunned if they give the game away before Roose can kill Robb at the Red Wedding. Why risk undercutting that particular shock?

[Newstar]

The Frey envoys said the Red Wedding would have to happen within two weeks of that day, so the Tyrion/Sansa wedding is definitely being fast-tracked.

To book readers, yes, that much is clear (since we know that the Tyrion/Sansa wedding precedes the Red Wedding in ASOS), but non-book readers wouldn't understand just from 3x05 and 3x06 that 1) Tyrion and Sansa will get married first and 2) Tyrion and Sansa will get married very quickly. They didn't even get the "You will marry Sansa Stark, and soon" line from Tywin.

Olenna will no doubt insist that the Cersei-Loras wedding be delayed until after the Royal Wedding (since she didn't want it in the first place).

I do think we'll get some sort of explanation as to why the Tyrion/Sansa wedding will precede Loras and Cersei's, and why it's happening so quickly, even if it's only a line or two from Tywin or Olenna. I agree that Olenna will likely insist that the Loras/Cersei wedding be delayed (probably using some sort of BS explanation about not stealing Margaery's thunder or somesuch).

With the Sansa-Tyrion union, on the other hand, Tywin is in complete control of both players, and their prospective marriage is free from any such political constraints. He can give any excuse he wants for marrying them off as soon as possible. Of course, his true reason (which will go unsaid in the show) is that he's taking steps to set up the Red Wedding, and wants Sansa wedded to (and ideally impregnated by) Tyrion before Robb dies so as to eliminate the possibilty that an heir to the North by Talisa could supplant her in the line of succession (obviously at this point we don't know if Talisa is in on the conspiracy and is taking moon tea to prevent such a thing from happening. I continue to believe she's not involved).

That's a good point, and I liked your earlier speculation about Robb and Talisa discussing the conception of an heir (leading to what I think will be a Robb/Talisa love scene).

Maybe Tywin putting the fear of God into Joffrey is related to expediting Tyrion and Sansa's wedding somehow. Tywin is all "Make this wedding happen," Joffrey is all, "Who cares about my uncle's stupid wedding?" In the books, technically, Sansa was marrying at Joffrey's command, wasn't she?

If Talisa gets knocked up, that pretty much guarantees she'll die at the Red Wedding, doesn't it?

On another note, I would be amused if Tywin's power move to bring Joffrey to heel is something weaksauce like confiscating his crossbow.

[Khalessi]

I think that moment will probably be cut. In the books, Ramsay sends that bit of flayed skin to his father, who in turn gives it Robb. Roose won't meet up with Robb until Episode 8 at the earliest (more likely Episode 9, since they'll probably just have them meet up at the wedding). The moment Roose admits that his bastard is the one who's been torturing Theon, the viewers will know that the Boltons are a twisted bunch who can't be trusted, if they haven't already figured it out (from the non-readers I've talked to, the popular theory seems to be that Roose is letting Jaime go to hedge his bets with Tywin, rather than betraying Robb utterly). Given the trouble the writers have gone to in order to keep the true identity of "Boy" under wraps and how long they've put it off (to the immense frustration of the casual viewer, according to several of the non-reader reviews I've read), at this point I'd been stunned if they give the game away before Roose can kill Robb at the Red Wedding. Why risk undercutting that particular shock?

Yeah I honestly think they will cut it. Which is a shame since it was an intense moment in the book. It would also help connect Theon's torutre scenes to another character which might help make his scenes less tedious for the casual viewer. Since I find most non book reader are disliking Theon's scenes since they seem to be just grotesque torture scenes that are pointless if you haven't read the books. However, I guess this is all done to try and shock viewers when Roose betrays Robb. Which I understand, but at the same time it leads to a lot of frustration. Making such a big deal about hiding Ramsay's identity when at the same time giving Jamie back to his father is already a pretty big betrayl to Robb. Also wasn't the horn already pretty much a dead give away who he is?

[bobbybuilderton]

I think that moment will probably be cut. In the books, Ramsay sends that bit of flayed skin to his father, who in turn gives it Robb. Roose won't meet up with Robb until Episode 8 at the earliest (more likely Episode 9, since they'll probably just have them meet up at the wedding). The moment Roose admits that his bastard is the one who's been torturing Theon, the viewers will know that the Boltons are a twisted bunch who can't be trusted, if they haven't already figured it out (from the non-readers I've talked to, the popular theory seems to be that Roose is letting Jaime go to hedge his bets with Tywin, rather than betraying Robb utterly). Given the trouble the writers have gone to in order to keep the true identity of "Boy" under wraps and how long they've put it off (to the immense frustration of the casual viewer, according to several of the non-reader reviews I've read), at this point I'd been stunned if they give the game away before Roose can kill Robb at the Red Wedding. Why risk undercutting that particular shock?

Try telling that to people in the previous episode threads. They all think it's sooooo obvious that the Boltons are betraying Robb. I pointed out that to most people it just looks like Roose is being pragmatic and saving his butt in case things go south rather than flat out betrayal, but no one said anything in response...

[go joff go]

I was listening to Bill simmons podcast with Andy Greenwald and it made me realize how important it is for the show to go all the way with the Theon casatration and general degradation. You could tell from listening how unsympathetic people are to Theon like the book at this point. IT really does take a lot to turn that sympathy

[go joff go]

Try telling that to people in the previous episode threads. They all think it's sooooo obvious that the Boltons are betraying Robb. I pointed out that to most people it just looks like Roose is being pragmatic and saving his butt in case things go south rather than flat out betrayal, but no one said anything in response...

I don't believe it. People use TWOP and the like as a surrogate to gague how much non-readers bet, but most people are semi-casual watchers and aren't trying to put stuff together. When they spell out that roose betrays Robb and who his son is people will be plenty surprised.

[bobbybuilderton]

That's what I meant, though....that people on the forums think it's obvious but non-readers generally don't suspect anything. Should have worded it better. Nobody's like OMG TREASON ROOSE IS PLOTTING AGAINST ROBB, but they do have some uneasy feelings about everything that's going on. They're not completely oblivious.

One thing that I find funny is that Roose all but said that he's going to betray Robb. He basically said "letting Jaime go was treason, so I'm sending you back to Robb....but I'm letting Jaime go." And yet most people think he's just being cautious hahaha

[Khalessi]

My question is even if they revealed that Ramsay was Theon's torturer would that neccisarily reveal that Roose is betraying Robb? Couldn't Ramsay just be a crazy bastard who lied to his father?Or they were doing it for Robb for what he did to Robb's brothers. That was the way it was in the books.

[AzorAhai42]

I found this on google image search, it's pretty cool.

http://i9.photobucke...809-500-280.gif

http://i9.photobucke...bvloso1_500.gif

I'd watch them in that order. I have probably watched these gifs like 800 times.

[Hiram McDrogon]

Maybe Tywin putting the fear of God into Joffrey is related to expediting Tyrion and Sansa's wedding somehow. Tywin is all "Make this wedding happen," Joffrey is all, "Who cares about my uncle's stupid wedding?" In the books, technically, Sansa was marrying at Joffrey's command, wasn't she?

My memory's failing me: was there a Tywin/Joffrey confrontation in the books? If so, where, so I can re-read it?

EDIT: AzorAhai42, perhaps you should emphasize that those pictures probably count as spoilers for next week's episode?

[Daenerys Must Die]

My question is even if they revealed that Ramsay was Theon's torturer would that neccisarily reveal that Roose is betraying Robb? Couldn't Ramsay just be a crazy bastard who lied to his father?Or they were doing it for Robb for what he did to Robb's brothers. That was the way it was in the books.

I know what you mean and have been thinking the same thing however, if they couple the Roose betrayal with the Ramsay reveal it will definitely serve as a bit moment for the vilification of House Bolton as a whole. In the books we already know Roose doesn't particularly approve of Ramsay's "games".. On the contrary I'm not sure how anyone would think (aside from the grotesque nature of it) that Ramsay torturing Theon is in any way a sign of impending betrayal as Robb specifically asked for Theon to be taken alive (I realize this isn't 'exactly' what Robb had in mind but still - in Ramsay's head he's probably doing Robb a favour)

I actually a have a feeling that Theon is going to guess that he's at the Dreadfort this week, and he's not going to refer to Ramsay by name but he's going to call him 'bastard' thus causing Ramsay to go into a rage that leads to Theon's .. well yeah... it's not a straight reveal but it's a bit more than we've been getting, plus he's already been called Bastard once this season which essentially gave it away for a few of my friends who weren't readers, but knew a bit about him from the Wiki pages. Plus Dreadfort hasn't been mentioned much in the show so I don't think it would really give it away for most unless they go out of their way to look it up.