Season 4: How much will be Iron Islands and Dorne?

[Frumpus]

I think they made such a huge deal about Asha's rescue mission, that it's impossible that she'd give up. But maybe she'll take the Dreadfort, find that everyone's gone to WF, and then turn back to go to the Kingsmoot? A stretch, I know.

That's an incredible stretch.

And this is the problem the writers face. If they choose to include the kingsmoot, there is no plausible way for it to be done, now that they've given Yara her own saving Theon storyline for S4. If they include the kingsmoot at all, it'll be similar to how they threw in Ramsay and the Reeds - nothing but fan appeasement.

I still think the only reason they decided to give Yara this story, is because they chose to cut out the Greyjoy brothers.

[Weeping Sore]

I think they made such a huge deal about Asha's rescue mission, that it's impossible that she'd give up. But maybe she'll take the Dreadfort, find that everyone's gone to WF, and then turn back to go to the Kingsmoot? A stretch, I know.

Having come that far, wouldn't she just go on to Winterfell?

Or if Yara went back to the Iron Islands for the Kingsmoot, could she possibly make it back in time? (Dreadfort looks accessible from the Westerosi East Coast - Old Wyk off the West coast, so she'd be sailing around the whole continent twice in one season)

I can't remember, was the ep310 Yara/Balon scene at Pyke or Deepwood Motte?

[Game of Chodes]

Agreed. Narratively it makes sense (except that I would put it towards the end of episode 10, since Tyrion killing Tywin is obviously a bigger shocking moment).

Arguing that it should happen in season 5 "because otherwise they don't have enough material for season 5" is not a good narrative argument: you're saying that "we should make season 4 slightly less awesome because otherwise season 5 will be too boring". If season 5 needs more material for Sansa... well, that's a reason to finish all AFFC/ADWD in season 5.

Finishing AFFC and ADWD in season 5 doesn't mean Sansa will have more material so that just doesn't make sense. it wouldn't ruin Sansa's storyline at all by having her spend like 2 or 3 episodes during season 4 with lysa and then killing lysa a few episodes into season 5.

Also is there any pressing need to introduce the Victarion, Euron or whatever combination the producers decide to go with in season 4. If memory serves me correctly, they really don't do anything besides pillage the reach and set sail for essos both of which don't really effect any of the other characters.

[Stannis' shadow babies]

One of the things that made me care less for the Dorne part of the story was how late it appeared. When so much of the story was told, and you got to know a bunch of characters and have your view on them and feel sort of attached to them, Dorne's appearance seemed almost out of the blue to me. In fact, that part of the books was a bit of a test for my attention. I would rather have Dorne introduced sooner on the TV show. The don't need all Dorne, because several characters are totally dispensable. In fact, they can only show Dorne through Doran and Arianne (and probably Myrcella, the only link of the current characters to Dorne in the TV show), no need to big locations and such. Rest of the characters will visit KL (the Red Viper and Ellaria). Later, Quentin may not be cut, but will definitely have to travel on his own.

As for the Iron born, I think they did well in showing and giving a purpose to Yara in the finale so the audience wouldn't forget about them when they reappear next season. That's what I think they should do with Dorne. Keep them around (besides the necessary stuff in KL) and display them more prominently in season 5. And not that much at that either because so far they haven't really proved their relevance.

Euron and Victarion, I don't know. I'm on the fence. They can be pulled to season 5 withouth major repercussion, right?

[Ser Luke.]

I feel if they are going to cut a major character, it should be Quentyn. He serves 0 purpose in the long run.

[Nezzer]

I feel if they are going to cut a major character, it should be Quentyn. He serves 0 purpose in the long run.

Well, his death might create a huge problem between Dany and the Martells. They should just cut his travel and the Windblown plot and make his first appearance to be in Meereen already. Aeron Damphair, Arys Oakheart and Areo Hotah are far more useless than Quentyn.

[callmedodge]

The Iron Born and Dorne stories are important for Dany. Unless they severely alter her storyline (which would be a welcome prospect) fans need to know by the end of Season 4 that something will happen in Season 5 with her and Westeros.

The best way to do this is to introduce Arianne, Vic/Euron early enough in Season 4 and then in episode 10 have:

1) Arianne return to Dorne and speak with Doran who does explains his plan with Quentyn to her.

2) Euron have Vic (or he could do it himself) go to get Dany.

3) Illyrio and Tyrion`s conversation about Dragons in Slavers` Bay and the hint that Tyrion is also on his way to her.

Fans will be pissed if it looks like Dany`s storyline is still going nowhere by the end of the next season. They want her to go to Westeros and interact with everyone else.

Of course, I`ve no doubt that D&D wont actually do it this way.

[Lannister Hamster]

Quentyn should be kept, but has to be introduced to and tied into the Dorne plot much earlier on and probably introduced on screen when he gets to Mereen.

[Arkash]

1) Arianne return to Dorne and speak with Doran who does explains his plan with Quentyn to her.

They wont cast an actor for Doran only for one episode.

I think Doran will wait season 5 and that season 4 will end with Arianne leaving full of hate King's Landing.

[Draco_Dracul]

Since the point of Quentyn is to be pointless, I think he can just be cut.

The lack of support that the Martells have for Dany can simple be attributed to the reappearance of Aegon.

[Ser Luke.]

Since the point of Quentyn is to be pointless, I think he can just be cut.

The lack of support that the Martells have for Dany can simple be attributed to the reappearance of Aegon.

Yeah, like I said before, if they are going to start cutting storylines, please start with Quentyn.

[Joyful Union]

Yeah, like I said before, if they are going to start cutting storylines, please start with Quentyn.

In order of characters most needing to be cut, to least:

Quentyn

Areo Hotah

Damphair

Darkstar

Arys Oakheart

Rodrik Harlaw and other assorted Ironborn

Sandsnakes

Ellaria

Trystane

Victarian

Euron

Arianne

Doran

Oberyn

[Ser Luke.]

In order of characters most needing to be cut, to least:

Quentyn

Areo Hotah

Damphair

Darkstar

Arys Oakheart

Rodrik Harlaw and other assorted Ironborn

Sandsnakes

Ellaria

Trystane

Victarian

Euron

Arianne

Doran

Oberyn

From your list, I am pretty sure Quentyn, Areo, Arys, Darkstar, Ellaria, and Rodrik Harlaw will be cut. The rest still have a decent role to play, besides the Sand Snakes, who I believe will be cut down to only Nymeria and Tyene., possibly Obara.

[Joyful Union]

From your list, I am pretty sure Quentyn, Areo, Arys, Darkstar, Ellaria, and Rodrik Harlaw will be cut. The rest still have a decent role to play, besides the Sand Snakes, who I believe will be cut down to only Nymeria and Tyene., possibly Obara.

Oh yes I agree. The ones towards the bottom of the list are useful and generally interesting characters I believe should be in, with Oberyn being number one priority. Since he's already in, I suppose it's a good start.

[Onna Lewyys]

Areo Hotah is way more pointless than Quentyn from a tv standpoint. Areo barely even has any lines at all in his chapters. He literally mostly just stands there. His purpose is to observe, but we don't need him to observe; as the audience we can observe everything that's going on by ourselves. And we don't even need him to kill Arys Oakheart - he can be killed by any random guardsman. But Quentyn actually has a bit of a story. And even if that story is ultimately pointless, at least it involves a pretty epic death scene. I am dying to see that scene on screen.

And I would be absolutely heartbroken if they cut any bit of the Martells out of the show. I find them so awesome and fascinating, they're actually my favorite house after House Stark.

So here's how I would do it, if I were condensing AFFC & ADWD into just S5:

The first six episodes would cover Arianne's queenmaking plot, ending with her father telling her about Quentyn's mission. Then in Ep 7 Quentyn shows up in Meereen and Dany rejects him. He sticks around so the audience is fooled into thinking he's actually going to be a major character because we just spent half the season with his family. Then after Dany flies off on Drogon in Ep 9, in the finale Quentyn tries to steal Viseron, he gets burned to death, and the audience goes, Oh shit! I guess he's not going to be a major character after all!

[YouSnowNothing]

After 3x10, I'm actually in the line of thinking that Quentyn is the least likely to be cut of all the Martells. We won't see his journey to Meereen of course (unless they combine it somehow with Tyrion's), but his time in Meereen is useful, as it gives Dany a tie to the main action in Westeros, and an interesting dilemma to consider. Without Quentyn, her arc is even more isolated and dull.

As much as it pains me to say it, given my utter adoration for all things Dornish, I think that Sunspear may be cut. The Martells will be needed later, but as they already seem to be cutting out the Kingsmoot as an isolated event, they may do the same for Dorne, and just have the characters turn up later as needed. If they do this, we may see events unfold like this:

Early S4: Oberyn arrives in Kings Landing with Quentyn in tow

Late S4: Oberyn dies, Quentyn leaves KL on a mysterious mission

Mid S5: Quentyn turns up in Meereen and proposes marriage to Dany. He explains his father's long-term plan for vengance.

Late S5: Dany flies off, Quentyn gets barbequed. Aegon lands in Westeros

Early S6: We are introduced to Arianne when she comes to meet Aegon, and we continue as per events in The Winds of Winter.

So that means no Doran (:(), but Oberyn, Arianne and Quentyn kept, and perhaps a Sand Snake or two (Sarella in Oldtown and Nymeria in Kings Landing).

Aaaand as I typed that last sentence, I had a brainstorm. What if Nymeria is introduced in S4/5, taking over the role of Taena Merryweather? She can act as Cersei's confidante/occasional lover, pretending to be a minor noblewoman. Then she can be revealed as an agent of the Martell's in late S5. I believe that Nymeria (and Tyene, though they will undoubtedly be combined into one character) will have a significant role in Winds, and this may be the best way to introduce her if Dorne as a location is but. They can expand on her character as they have done for many other minor characters. Being around for 3 seasons or so, she can be built up as a fairly significant player, which is useful since a whole lot of major characters abandons Kings Landing after ASOS, leaving only Cersei and Margaery. TaeNymerTyene (proposed name) can add another side to the KL dynamic. Plus, a lesbian woman of colour in a major role gives the show a major boost in the representation stakes, you never see a character like that in most high fantasy series - or many series' at all for that matter.

[TalalOfDorne]

If they cut Iron islands and Dorne, then I'm done with the show.

Same here. Dorne and the Iron Islands are my favorite and the most underrated story-lines IMO.

Im guessing Dornes appearance will be in season 5 though.

Im not a fan of how they portrayed Asha. I hope they do better next season.

[Weeping Sore]

What if Nymeria is introduced in S4/5, taking over the role of Taena Merryweather?

Just skimmed this and thought you were proposing lesbian direwolf sex scenes for a second.

[Onna Lewyys]

As much as it pains me to say it, given my utter adoration for all things Dornish, I think that Sunspear may be cut.

But the Sunspear plot is so full of sex and violence! I certainly hope we can count on B&W always taking advantage of every opportunity to put more of both those things into the show (especially the sex).

[WingedMan]

I'd hate if they cut Sunspear. I want to see as many places as possible in the series, I was even having my hopes up for both Sunspear and Water Gardens but it's unlikely.

Gotta see Nagga's bones! And don't even get me started on other locations, like Raventree Hall. Yes, I'm greedy.