Kiss of Fire Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 Did the King in the North offend the Old Gods by marrying Jeyne Westerling via the Gods of the Seven (the Southern Gods)? This marriage cost him plenty cultimating in his death at the RW. Did a search but could not find any threads that explore this possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dornishman's Wife Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 Even if they had any agency, I doubt the Old Gods would be so aghast at a Southern wedding ceremony that they would manipulate someone into breaking the biggest taboo of all and slaughtering his guests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Walrus Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 First off, the Old Gods aren't real, so it's not like they can do anything. Secondly, even if they were real, i doubt they would care about Robb breaking one vow, but at the same time be okay with something like the right of the First Night... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steinnis Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 This argument would have more credibility if you proposed the Old Gods punished Robb, for beheading Rickard Karstark, who would of been distant kin to Robb. But still, very little to go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groat Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 First off, the Old Gods aren't real, so it's not like they can do anything.I for some reason picture a tomcat with one eye and a torn ear staring at you after making this statement. The stare is malign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs.Grumpy Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 No :ack: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 I guess in a sense the downfall of House Stark has to do with their Southern Ambitions, represented by Rickard's and Ned's alliances. Bran dreaming about becoming a knight, Sansa's ways at first etc. are all signs of that.If anything, Robb was returning to their old ways when he was declared King in the North. But the need to secure the Riverlands led him into failure. If he had retreated to the North, he would probably be fine.So I guess there's something to what you're saying, but it's not the gods acting directly or to do with a marriage ceremony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Walrus Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 I for some reason picture a tomcat with one eye and a torn ear staring at you after making this statement. The stare is malign.Well i suppose the Old Gods maybe technically real, but they're certainly not deities in any traditional sense. And Balerion can get over it, he's just a warged cat after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frozentree Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 First off, the Old Gods aren't real, so it's not like they can do anything. Secondly, even if they were real, i doubt they would care about Robb breaking one vow, but at the same time be okay with something like the right of the First Night...But, they are real. In fact they are the only gods actually confirmed to be real. Based on what definition of "god" you use, you could say they are not gods, but the entities called old gods and worshiped in the North do exist and do have power, though they are not omnipotent and something like this would probably be still above their limitsedit: took too long to write Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Walrus Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 But, they are real. In fact they are the only gods actually confirmed to be real. Based on what definition of "god" you use, you could say they are not gods, but the entities called old gods and worshiped in the North do exist and do have power, though they are not omnipotent and something like this would probably be still above their limitsWell that is my point, they are considered gods in the ASOIAF universe, but they aren't gods in any traditional sense of the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dornishman's Wife Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 But, they are real. In fact they are the only gods actually confirmed to be real. Based on what definition of "god" you use, you could say they are not gods, but the entities called old gods and worshiped in the North do exist and do have power, though they are not omnipotent and something like this would probably be still above their limitsI understand that pov, but I personally would say that what we meet are not the Old Gods Ned & co pray to. They were certainly the inspiration for those beliefs, and they are the closest thing to it that exists, but I still wouldn't call them the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zman1863 Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 I think GRRM created the religious climate to be much like our own world. Yes, there is magic in the series, and it is attributed to divine beings, but that attribution still requires a leap of logic and faith. I regard things like guest right and the kinslaying taboo and emphasis on oaths etc as societal rather than divinely ordained rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blutraven Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 Well considering The Ned married Catelyn in a 7 ceremony and did alright for the next 15 years, I'd say no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blede Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 Eddard Stark married Catelyn Tully in a Faith of the Seven ceremony. Are you saying the Old Gods caused his death too ?Edit: Ninja'd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiasyd Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 Well, I don't believe that gods exist, so no... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vengeance Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 But, they are real. In fact they are the only gods actually confirmed to be real. Based on what definition of "god" you use, you could say they are not gods, but the entities called old gods and worshiped in the North do exist and do have power, though they are not omnipotent and something like this would probably be still above their limitsedit: took too long to writeConfirmed to exist by whom and where? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeirwoodTreeHugger Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 The Stark kids and Jon are all half Southron and still have Old Godsy warging powers. It couldn't have been that a big of a deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildBlood Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 First off, the Old Gods aren't real, so it's not like they can do anything. Secondly, even if they were real, i doubt they would care about Robb breaking one vow, but at the same time be okay with something like the right of the First Night...Well i suppose the Old Gods maybe technically real, but they're certainly not deities in any traditional sense. And Balerion can get over it, he's just a warged cat after all.Well that is my point, they are considered gods in the ASOIAF universe, but they aren't gods in any traditional sense of the word.Are any gods really real? Book or not... What is a traditional deity. Even in real life people worship some crazy things. To each his own though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aceluby Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 No, gods are not real. Magic is real and is explained simply through 'gods', but gods as the people of Westeros think of them are not real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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