Daenerys Stormborn is a Bastard

[pobeb]

Theory:

Daenerys is not the daughter of Aerys, but the bastard daughter of Rhaella Targaryen and Bonifer Hasty.

(This is not a theory of what her name should be. This is a theory which suggests "Stormborn" is a hint that Bonifer is Dany's father; not in bastardy surname application, but simply that he is a knight of the Stormlands)

Evidence:

In Westrosi tradition, The Queen of Love and Beauty is a title granted to a woman by the champion of a given tournament. Only 4 times has there been mention of a champion bestowing this title to a woman. These are the 4 occurrences:

- Aemon, the Dragon Knight, bestowed the title to Naerys Targaryen

- Bonifer Hasty bestowed the title to Rhaella Targaryen

- Rhaegar Targaryen bestowed the title to Lyanna Stark

- Jorah Mormont bestowed the title to Lynesse Hightower

There's a pattern here I mean to unveil, but first, I want you to look at this pattern problem and think of how you would answer:

Example 1

- I hope we can all agree that the answer is C

Now, let's make this pattern problem more specific:

Example 2 (please note that love means "mutual love" and "no love" means "no mutual love")

- Notice that the pattern applies here also. Each time the QoLaB has had a mutual love with her champion, a baby is yielded. When the love is not mutual, there is no baby.

And finally, let's add another layer to help with seeing my theory's pattern:

Example 3 (please note that love means "mutual love" and "no love" means "no mutual love")

- And by now, you're hopefully beginning to see the connections more clearly

I've always wondered why Jorah and Lynesse never worked, and why GRRM thought it was important that we know this. Surely, it explains his infatuation with Dany, and adds a sympathetic layer to Jorah's character, but why is it important that he won the tourney and crowned Lynesse the QoLaB? Then, after coming up with this crazy theory, it hit me:

GRRM was highlighting this to show us how the pattern works; and subsequently reveal to us who Dany's real father is.

Ever wonder why Dany is almost always introduced, not thought of or referred to, but introduced as "Daenerys Stormborn" as opposed to "Daenerys Targaryen"?

I feel that GRRM is slapping us in the face with a clue each time this happens. Like on your first read-through, when you see the name "Ghost" (foreshadowing Jon warging on his deathbed), and you don't necessarily make that connection. (if you did, well kudos to you!)

It is my belief that "Stormborn" really means "Born from a Storm"

Now, I know how the laws of bastard surnames apply: Your bastard name is given to you depending on the region you grew up in. And I think we can all agree that Dragonstone is not in the Stormlands, and Dany grew up overseas.

However, I don't think the hint is necessarily indicating where Dany was born, or where she grew up, but simply that she is a bastard from a man of the Stormlands.

Now, some might ask. Well, what was Bonifer doing in Dragonstone? Wasn't he sworn to the houses of the Stormlands? Shouldn't he be fighting for Robert?

Oh, but he does.

In the last month of the Rebellion, Stannis was building a fleet to assail Dragonstone. But when he gets there, there's no opposition. Why?

Well:

Daenerys Stormborn, she was called, for she had come howling into the world on distant Dragonstone as the greatest storm in the memory of Westeros howled outside, a storm so fierce that it ripped gargoyles from the castle walls and smashed her father’s fleet to kindling.

Daenerys, ASoS

Stannis just waltzes into Dragonstone because, by some convenient miracle, the Targaryen fleet has been destroyed.

But, was it a miracle? Doesn't this sound a little too convenient?

Where was Bonifer, and shouldn't he be fighting for Robert somewhere?

He was: Bonifer is the one who burned the Targaryen fleet.

How am I coming to this conclusion? Let's go back over Dany's recollection of her birth:

Daenerys Stormborn, she was called

- Dany is introduced as Stormborn, right before she explains her birth.

for she had come howling into the world on distant Dragonstone

- Here we see that Dany is specifically "howling". Not crying, not whining, not screaming. But "howling". This is key:

as the ... storm ... howled outside

- Here howling is used again, but to personify the "storm". This represents Bonifer, who howled in grief at his lover's death.

a storm so fierce that it (...) smashed her father’s fleet to kindling

- And we come to the big kicker: kindling

The "storm" doesn't just smash her father's fleet, the "storm" smashes it to "kindling". Not "to pieces". Not "to oblivion". Not "to splinters". But, "to kindling".

Why is this important, you ask? Well:

His son was Brandon the Burner, because he put the torch to all his father’s ships in grief.

Bran, AGoT

Wanna know an interesting anagram of Bonifer Hasty?

Hasty Bonfire

Hasty (due to grief)

Bonfire (burning of the fleet)

Please see this thread for a more in-depth explanation of why Stannis burned the fleet.

Bonfires are sometimes referred to as a signal fires. Stannis comes, not before, but after that signal.

He sent Bonifer to do a job, there is no signal fire, so Stannis thinks he's dead, months pass while he employs a different strategy (builds the fleet), Rhaella dies, Bonifer burns the ships in grief, Stannis sees the signal fire, and sets sail.

From the WoW Theon chapter, Stannis tells Justin Massey this:

"It may be that we shall lose this battle," the king said grimly. "In Braavos you may hear that I am dead. It may even be true. You shall find my sellswords nonetheless."
The knight hesitated. "Your Grace, if you are dead — "
" — you will avenge my death, and seat my daughter on the Iron Throne. Or die in the attempt."

He's telling Massey to continue doing what he's doing (like Stannis continued to build his fleet) even if he dies (like how he thought Bonifer died).

And he tells Massey this because he knows from first-hand experience, that in the face of certain doom (Stannis fleet vs Targ fleet), hope still may come through (Bonifer burning the fleet).

How is any of this important to Dany's overall character? Please see this thread

Arguments against:

1) Dany is already a "quickening" in her mother's womb when Rhaella departs King's Landing for Dragonstone.

- This is Dany's perception of these events, and I don't believe her perception, as she was only a "quickening" during the time of the alleged events, to be strong evidence against. I simply think she isn't in the know.

2) Rhaella had Dany 9 months after leaving for Dragonstone.

- 9 months is a lot of time to sail to Dragonstone, conceive a baby there, and die in childbirth.

3) Bonifer is not important enough to be Dany's Dad.

- I don't have an argument against this. He definitely hasn't been shown to be important beyond where I hold this theory.

Anything else that needs to be added?

There are probably several ways to explain all of this differently, but I hope you guys enjoyed my interpretation of it :)

[chrisdaw]

Now that... would be awesome. But I'm not on board.

[Slender Aimry Hill]

I like it, but there's a fatal flaw. If the girl was really so Hasty, surely she'd have made it to Westeros by now?

[Northernmonkey]

I love any theory that involves anagrams so I'm all for this.

On a side note, who was declared Queen of Love and Beauty at the tournament in the first Dunk and Egg book? Or did they not bother because the king died?

[Arya Stark Rules]

I like it, it makes shipping Jon and Dany all more interesting.

[Lord Damian]

She has 3 dragons and that is all the proof anyone in her world needs so if it were true, which I doubt, it will never matter.

[Daemon The Black Dragon]

I love any theory that involves anagrams so I'm all for this.

On a side note, who was declared Queen of Love and Beauty at the tournament in the first Dunk and Egg book? Or did they not bother because the king died?

I don't think they finished the tournament in The Hedge knight. They had the Trial of Seven and then Prince Baelor died of the wound to his head by his brother.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

<snip

Arguments against:

1) Dany is already a "quickening" in her mother's womb when Rhaella departs King's Landing for Dragonstone.

- This is Dany's perception of these events, and I don't believe her perception, as she was only a "quickening" during the time of the alleged events, to be strong evidence against. I simply think she isn't in the know.

2) Rhaella had Dany 9 months after leaving for Dragonstone.

- 9 months is a lot of time to sail to Dragonstone, conceive a baby there, and die in childbirth.

3) Bonifer is not important enough to be Dany's Dad.

- I don't have an argument against this. He definitely hasn't been shown to be important beyond where I hold this theory.

Actually you're cutting it close with 2. I don't know how long it takes to get to Dragonstone by boat, but if Dany wasn't conceived until after Rhaella got there, the birth would probably be later. Unless we're dealing with premature labor, that is. That is possible, I suppose.

Also there's her name itself that rather goes against this theory. Rhaella named Daenerys after someone who had to give love up entirely and marry someone chosen by the king, a man she didn't love, but she had to make a go of it, and that princess' descendants are still in power in Dorne today...because she did her duty, not because she had a fling years later with the guy she really wanted. If we had a story about the first Daenerys Targaryen having a love child (couldn't be Daemon's because he was dead, but she could have fallen in love later) it would help your theory out a bit.

I disagree about Jorah and Lynesse. He did love her, so there was some love involved. Just didn't go both ways. And since we don't have confirmation yet that Rhaegar and Lyanna had mutual feelings for each other, it's risky putting them into the equation. In fact we don't have confirmation that Jon is theirs. Everyone may believe it, but until GRRM puts it in black and white, it remains just a theory (with a ton of forshadowing, I grant you).

Are we sure that Aemon and Naerys had a child together? I'm not up on my early Targ history so much. Or maybe it's my middle Targ history. ;)

This isn't a bad theory, but it needs more than four tournaments and three possible secret kids. I suggest a reread geared specifically toward looking for any clues that might support the idea.

ETA: her name would actually be Daenerys Waters, not Daenerys Hasty. Bastard kid and all that.

[Gustavo]

I like it, but there's a fatal flaw. If the girl was really so Hasty, surely she'd have made it to Westeros by now?

My thoughts exactly.

[Good Guy Garlan]

I like it! And it would be hilarious, but who knows. I guess the whole Bonifer and Rhaella thing has to be significant somehow

[JonCon's Red Beard]

I like it! And it would be hilarious, but who knows. I guess the whole Bonifer and Rhaella thing has to be significant somehow

Bonifer will, I wouldn't doubt it. He's the one saying that to those who are pious and faithful, ghouls and wights won't do harm. I can see the Faith trying to face the wights and failing miserably.

[Good Guy Garlan]

Bonifer will, I wouldn't doubt it. He's the one saying that to those who are pious and faithful, ghouls and wights won't do harm. I can see the Faith trying to face the wights and failing miserably.

You're right, poor guy. I want to see a Tarantino-style battle with the Holy Hundred (or well, Holy 86) before they go

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

Cool theory! Of course, I think Dany's a Targ, but it would be hilarious if both she and (f)Aegon had no claim but Jon did.

I like it, but there's a fatal flaw. If the girl was really so Hasty, surely she'd have made it to Westeros by now?

:lmao:

[Light a wight tonight]

Bonifer was boning Rhaella? Hope he wasn't too hasty about it.

Good man to be leading the Holy Hundred.

[El Starko]

Interesting but I can"t stand by this.

A. Considering Hasty's attraction to religion it seems highly unlikely that he would bed a woman without having said the proper wedding vows.

Indeed, Selmy's POV says he abandoned the lance the moment Rhaella married Aerys. Would he really be so hypocritical as to denounce his faith in favour of his Queen while maintaining his 'Holier than thou' act ?

B. I don't understand your parallel with the other Queens of Love and Beauty as none of the outcomes were similar aside from the idea that it was a love that did not work out

1) It was 'rumoured' by singers that Aemon fathered Daeron II because Aegon the Unworthy was not the nicest king. It suited the romance of the Dragon Knight pretty well. Both Aemon and Naerys lived long after the tournament

2) Both Hasty and Rhaella lived long after the tourney and if Hasty did father Dany, it would mean that they had the opportunity to "love" after all.

3) In regards to R + L. Were they in love ? If one believes Lyanna was the Knight of the Laughing Tree, Rhaegar could originally have been honouring her for being a truer knight than most.

4) Jorah Mormont was in love, crucially and truly in love. His wife? Originally maybe but it doesn't seem to be a very romantic affair

C. I'll add that Selmy tells Dany that Rhaella was once briefly smitten by a Knight from the Stormlands. Regular visits with the Queen would have been noted by him or other members of the KG.

D. I'll concede that the Born a Storm reveal would be mindblowing but Dany would then be a Storm or a Hasty and it would ruin the Targaryan coin toss idea. One side representing greatness, the other madness. A coin evidently falling on madness for Viserys and greatness for Dany.

[The Dragons Hand]

I like it, but there's a fatal flaw. If the girl was really so Hasty, surely she'd have made it to Westeros by now?

:cheers:

And this only seems worse when G.R.R.M makes it seem like Dany in Westeros will be a mid-to-late TWoW thing.

[Nictarion]

ADwD Epilogue

"We have these tales coming from the east as well. A second Targaryen, and one whose blood no man can question. Daenerys Stormborn".

It also seems to me that when a Targaryen with Valyrian features conceives a child with a non Valyrian the non Valyrian genes are dominant, like Baelor Breakspear, Jon

Luke and Jace who were likely bastards of a Strong, etc

[jon rhaegar stark]

ADwD Epilogue

"We have these tales coming from the east as well. A second Targaryen, and one whose blood no man can question. Daenerys Stormborn".

It also seems to me that when a Targaryen with Valyrian features conceives a child with a non Valyrian the non Valyrian genes are dominant, like Baelor Breakspear, Jon

Luke and Jace who were likely bastards of a Strong, etc

this and about introducing her as Daenarys Stormborn

if i remember correctly in hedge knight,

Baelor is introduced Baelor Breakspear and

Aerion as Aerion brightflame ..

so the name stormborn is simply because she was born amidst a greatest storm that westeros ever seen

[The Dragons Hand]

ADwD Epilogue

"We have these tales coming from the east as well. A second Targaryen, and one whose blood no man can question. Daenerys Stormborn".

It also seems to me that when a Targaryen with Valyrian features conceives a child with a non Valyrian the non Valyrian genes are dominant, like Baelor Breakspear, Jon

Luke and Jace who were likely bastards of a Strong, etc

Well. I'd say most of the time (Something unusual like green eyes might lose out to purple) Somebody with dark hair or eyes will almost always take dominance. (Rhaegar's daughter Rhaenys had dark hair and eyes in typical dornish style)

Facial structure seems to lose out as well, given that Jon looks very "Starkish" and has never really be associated with the "Otherworldly" beauty Targ's seem to have.

Which explains why they were so eager to marry other Valyrian looking sorts. When Steffon Baratheon was looking for a bride for Rhaegar it seemed like their standards as far as rank goes slipped some.

[pobeb]

I like it, but there's a fatal flaw. If the girl was really so Hasty, surely she'd have made it to Westeros by now?

This makes me think of Quaithe, and how she seems to be urging Dany to remember who and wanting to “To show (her) the way.”

Quaithe shows up when Dany is settling into Meereen, and I think it was to get her to make haste. "Remember who you are"

This comes at a time when her dragons are growing restless - which seemed to me as a sign that Dany should have been making haste. "Remember who you are"

Unless we're dealing with premature labor, that is. That is possible, I suppose.

Also there's her name itself that rather goes against this theory. Rhaella named Daenerys after someone who had to give love up entirely and marry someone chosen by the king, a man she didn't love, but she had to make a go of it, and that princess' descendants are still in power in Dorne today...because she did her duty, not because she had a fling years later with the guy she really wanted. If we had a story about the first Daenerys Targaryen having a love child (couldn't be Daemon's because he was dead, but she could have fallen in love later) it would help your theory out a bit.

I disagree about Jorah and Lynesse. He did love her, so there was some love involved. Just didn't go both ways. And since we don't have confirmation yet that Rhaegar and Lyanna had mutual feelings for each other, it's risky putting them into the equation. In fact we don't have confirmation that Jon is theirs. Everyone may believe it, but until GRRM puts it in black and white, it remains just a theory (with a ton of forshadowing, I grant you).

her name would actually be Daenerys Waters, not Daenerys Hasty. Bastard kid and all that.

- Yes, a premature birth was what I had in mind

- I agree with you that Rhaella named Daenerys after Daenerys Martell, and it was meant to symbolize duty over love. But perhaps this is where the poetic tie-in is: With the stark contrast between words: Daenerys (duty over love) Stormborn (love over duty). Would kinda fall in line with the biggest contrasting motif in the story: Ice and Fire

- I probably need to redo the images. I meant, "mutual love". In both cases where the QoLaB and her champion loved each other mutually, they had a secret child. The fact that Lynesse and Jorah didn't have a mutual love serves to highlight the break in pattern; it didn't yield a child.

- I agree that if it was known that she was born of Bonifer, she would carry a different name, but I thought Daenerys Hasty might get a little more attention. ;)