Ser Pounce FTW Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 I'm quite excited to see what happens to Stannis. I have my theories on how he will deal with Roose and Ramsay. I don't see him dying at their hand. Honestly I see him being betrayed by Melisandre once she confirms once and for all the Jon is the PwwP. I agree and am eager to see this play out, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcasinoroyale Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 This is a really awesome and epic tribute. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGFEPeIxPaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I'm Unsullied, but Stannis is still one of my favorites so the show isn't doing anything bad with his character. How could you possibly determine that? Stannis spends almost all of Storm sitting around doing nothing. They gave him a lot more to do in the show than in the book. His Storm chapters are his best appearances. His appearances in seasons 3 and 4 were terrible, and often hugely out of character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0LordCommanderSnow0 Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 They have definitely made Stannis more villainous in the show. Most of his humanizing moments were taken out and they added darker scenes for him in the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon in the North Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 They have definitely made Stannis more villainous in the show. Most of his humanizing moments were taken out and they added darker scenes for him in the show. Bad moments in the show: killing Renly, burning infidels alive, willing to sacrifice his nephew to the Red God. Replace infidel with traitor and these are all the actions Stannis committed in the books. Tender moments in the show: making Davos his Hand, his display of guilt over Renly's death, speaking to Selyse about their daughter, speaking to Shireen, Stannis visiting Davos in his cell and offers his condolence about Matthos's death, and, to a lesser extent, his conversation with Jon Snow about Ned Stark and showing respect. Can you provide examples of some of the tender moments Stannis has in the books? I'm not saying they don't exist, only that I don't remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Stannis is not the sum of 'tender moments' and 'bad moments', sweet R'hllor. Case in point? In the books, Stannis threatens to kill Melisandre by inches should she be deceiving him about the sacrifice. Is that a bad moment, because he's threatening someone with death, or is it a tender moment, because he's sticking up for his nephew's worth? It's neither, but it does very firmly establish his independence from Melisandre, an independence lacking in his show-counterpart that makes it all the weaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon in the North Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Stannis is not the sum of 'tender moments' and 'bad moments', sweet R'hllor. Case in point? In the books, Stannis threatens to kill Melisandre by inches should she be deceiving him about the sacrifice. Is that a bad moment, because he's threatening someone with death, or is it a tender moment, because he's sticking up for his nephew's worth? It's neither, but it does very firmly establish his independence from Melisandre, an independence lacking in his show-counterpart that makes it all the weaker. I know that. I was responding to the previous poster's remarks about how the show has made Stannis more villainous and that there were few tender moments. I was merely voicing my disagreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aFeastForDragons Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 This is a really awesome and epic tribute. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGFEPeIxPaw That was awesome! You can really see how the show has shaped Stannis the last few seasons. Despite the blunders of season 3 he still comes out on top in S4 when he is the surviving King and taking the fight to the White Walkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ryon Stark Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I thought his roles in the Battle of the Blackwater and the Battle at the Wall were suitably badass. I like him but the show does definitely cast him as a darker character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSansa Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 The biggest problem that Stannis faces next season is the possibilities of the unsullied/khaleesists considering the progression of Stannis as unrealistic. They may say the Stannis suddenly becoming a good guy is weird and stupid and totally not making any sense. So that is why if the goal is to make stannis look better they will have to do a good job of that transition. Ofcourse it can come as a surprise but not too much of a surprise as to make the watchers think that its just some "retcon" created for the purposes of plot progression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 The biggest problem that Stannis faces next season is the possibilities of the unsullied/khaleesists considering the progression of Stannis as unrealistic. They may say the Stannis suddenly becoming a good guy is weird and stupid and totally not making any sense. So that is why if the goal is to make stannis look better they will have to do a good job of that transition. Ofcourse it can come as a surprise but not too much of a surprise as to make the watchers think that its just some "retcon" created for the purposes of plot progression. I really don't think Stannis is going to suddenly become a good guy. After all, that's not what happens in the books. He remains as he was: focused on his goals, ambitious, more interested in the letter of the law than the spirit of it, more interested in justice than people and a damn, good general. He will lead his armies well, just as he did in the books, but none of this is different than he was before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSansa Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I really don't think Stannis is going to suddenly become a good guy. After all, that's not what happens in the books. He remains as he was: focused on his goals, ambitious, more interested in the letter of the law than the spirit of it, more interested in justice than people and a damn, good general. He will lead his armies well, just as he did in the books, but none of this is different than he was before. You might think that but are the unsullied going to think the same. I am not referring to people who have read the book. Reread what I wrote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 You might think that but are the unsullied going to think the same. I am not referring to people who have read the book. Reread what I wrote. In did. If I understand you correctly you are saying the show will begin to show Stannis as a different guy now that he's at the wall and I'm saying I doubt it since that's not what happened in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSansa Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 In did. If I understand you correctly you are saying the show will begin to show Stannis as a different guy now that he's at the wall and I'm saying I doubt it since that's not what happened in the books. Again the unsullied (many of them) seem to think that stannis is a bad guy. So if he starts to do honourable things it may be seen as unrealistic. Even though many saw him going to the wall as awesome they still hadn't totally changed their opinions. You keep seeing things from the book readers perspective. Im not talking about the book...the book never made stannis out to be a bad guy...it was ambiguous. Its going to seem weird to show watchers if stannis suddenly starts helping the north etc so the show runners are going to have to show it in a way that doesn't make it look like a retcon to show only watchers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konradsmith Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 ^I don't recall any Unsullied thinking it was villainous of him to help the NW in ep. 410. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I'm Unsullied. I don't think he's bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Again the unsullied (many of them) seem to think that stannis is a bad guy. So if he starts to do honourable things it may be seen as unrealistic. You keep seeing things from the book readers perspective. Im not talking about the book...the book never made stannis out to be a bad guy...it was ambitious. I suppose the question is how do you view Stannis' portrayal on the show. I believe there have been some nuances lost but overall the show character is very similar to the book character. And many unsullied seem to have a similar view as book readers from what I've seen them posting in unsullied threads - some really like him and think he's good guy and some really don't. Just like the book readers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSansa Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I suppose the question is how do you view Stannis' portrayal on the show. I believe there have been some nuances lost but overall the show character is very similar to the book character. And many unsullied seem to have a similar view as book readers from what I've seen them posting in unsullied threads - some really like him and think he's good guy and some really don't. Just like the book readers. I would line myself as moderate when it comes to my problems with stannis in the show. I feel that the show has had many hints at Stannis not being a villain. Davos has been a prime example of a way to convince show watchers that stannis is not a bad guy. But it seems that even then many unsullied ignored those hints and the burnings of the "infidels" didnt help things either. The show has shown stannis in a more negative light then how he is in the books. There are some people who think that stannis is under the control of the "red woman". Many of these things can be fixed assuming that the the creators of the shows intentions were to first show stannis in a more negative light so that him doing the right thing end up being a bigger surprise. But I am worried that if they do take the route of showing him in a better light..they should do it in a way that is realistic to the show. Many show watchers still dont fully understand the motivations behind Stannis's actions. The show will have to convey all of them one way or another. Reveal what stannis saw in the flames, explain that he doesn't really want the throne, explain his motivations etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSansa Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 I'm Unsullied. I don't think he's bad. Not every unsullied goes online to forum section filled with spoilers so.... But I do agree that many unsullied do see him like a good guy. But many still dont like him because of misinformed perceptions about Stannis. Atleast the people who read the books have more legitimate reasons for not liking Stannis...you can actually have a proper conversation with them because they have all the facts. But not all of the facts have been presented to the show watchers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Its going to seem weird to show watchers if stannis suddenly starts helping the north etc so the show runners are going to have to show it in a way that doesn't make it look like a retcon to show only watchers. Why would it be weird? We leave Stannis coming to the aid of the Watch. I suspect he'll ride for Winterfell after hearing about the Iron Born and the Boltons, just as he does in the books. I don't think it will need anything more that was shown in the books. I would line myself as moderate when it comes to my problems with stannis in the show. I feel that the show has had many hints at Stannis not being a villain. Davos has been a prime example of a way to convince show watchers that stannis is not a bad guy. But it seems that even then many unsullied ignored those hints and the burnings of the "infidels" didnt help things either. The show has shown stannis in a more negative light then how he is in the books. There are some people who think that stannis is under the control of the "red woman". Many of these things can be fixed assuming that the the creators of the shows intentions were to first show stannis in a more negative light so that him doing the right thing end up being a bigger surprise. But I am worried that if they do take the route of showing him in a better light..they should do it in a way that is realistic to the show. And herein lies the crux of the discussion. Before your post, the last 3 posts in this thread (and countless others on the forum) are stating that Stannis has not been shown in a more negative light on the show but there are definitely posters who think the show has. I don't see the show changing their portrayal of Stannis much but then again, I don't really think they need to. Their portrayal so far has been consistent with the books so I don't think they need to take any different route with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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