Does Name Of The Wind get better?

[Stevonicus]

I found it very enjoyable. The metafictional structure, sending up of stock fantasy cliche, rich world and sheer readability made me tear through the two books. I usually don't reread soon after finishing a book but I've read the second book twice since last April since I found it so good. But as it sounds like the same things that hooked me turn you off i'd suggest letting it slide if you aren't getting a great feel from it. There are definitely a tonne of books that are equally deserving of your time that unless you are an ancient, ubermensch, speed reader you've probably not read.

[Stevonicus]

I am gonna get trashed for this but TNotW was a much better gook than AFfC and ADWD!!!! If your saying TNotW was forgettable you must have completely forgotten AFfC the second you put it down.

I certainly won't bite your head off for that comment. TNotW is one of the better fantasy books of the last decade while aFfC and aDwD were both somewhat lacking if still enjoyable.

[Spring Bass]

Out of curiosity, how often was Kvothe being an unreliable narrator? I know that

Spoilers for NOTW and WMF

he was probably raped when living on the streets in that city in NOTW, and that he tends to dwell on certain things for a long time (Denna) while omitting/minimizing other events (such as his trial and the ordeal of his ship journey in WMF). Are there any other instances that really stand out?

I certainly wouldn't put it above any of GRRM's books. Rothfuss has one good character (most of the time) - GRRM has many, some of which are much more interesting than Kvothe.

[jurble]

Uh, I think one big one is that the dude is either entirely making up the dialogue or has Kellhus-level memory. As far as we know, the essence of the story is true-ish, but Kvothe is constructing scenes and exposition for us in order to for it to work as a story.

[Screaming Turkey Ultimate]

I suggest you put it down. I made the mistake of continuing after the first book, and trust me, it gets worse, so much worse.

[Verboten]

I think Kvothe has the mentality of a fifteen year old boy and his narrative really reflects that. I don't mean that in a good way, but I am convinced that Kvothe is lying his ass off in a lot of places as well as exaggerating his prowess in other areas.

[TerraPrime]

As to wether to continue the series or not, I'd say that if it has not been enjoyable to you, then don't. :shrugs:

I mean, we can't promise that things will pay off later, because we're not you and what we find enjoyable, you may not. But yes, some of us enjoyed the story so far, with its own flaws and short-comings.

Re :Bass

Out of curiosity, how often was Kvothe being an unreliable narrator? I know that

I suspect that we will later on find out more. But one spot I remembered was this:

In TNOTW supposedly Kvothe went off to kill the demons that came close to his inn, but he suffered a lot of wounds for it. Later on, when he described his martial training, he made it sound like that he could enter the tree of the spinning blade leaves and come out untouched. I don't think the two jived. It's either that Kvothe had lost a lot of his training, or he was exaggerating a lot of his physical prowess in fighting.

[Aemon Stark]

denst, I famously fought myself through the first volume, but never “got” it. Not even close. I made earnest inquiries in one of the first Kvothe threads about what was good about these books, but did not receive an answer that enlightened me.

Just walk away.

I bought the second book, but I've read a few things since then and am currently re-reading ACoK. I took a very, very long time to get through TNotW - enjoyed it, but there's very little all that original, and I don't really agree that the "deconstruction" is especially sophisticated. Kvothe just comes off as a talented but arrogant and impulsive teenager - in his own words. I also thought the end of the book to be pretty underwhelming - minimal payoff to be sure.

I am gonna get trashed for this but TNotW was a much better gook than AFfC and ADWD!!!! If your saying TNotW was forgettable you must have completely forgotten AFfC the second you put it down.

Considering how lame the ending of TNotW was, I'm really surprised by this. In AFfC Cersei *FINALLY* gets trapped in her own vanity and arrogance, Doran Martell invokes "Revenge, Justice, Fire and Blood", and Brienne's journey reveals the full scope of the devastation of the War of the Five Kings. While it has perhaps less payoff than ASoS (but what doesn't?), I can't really see how the paper-thin and excessively drawn-out singular plot of TNotW really falls into the same category.

Similarly with ADwD, which has more deliberate pacing but takes us to Volantis and back to Winterfell. And dragons. And that epilogue...

It's also, as I said before, all coloured by him telling his own story. He always talk about himself in a certain flattering light, but if you really think about some of the events that happen, you get a whole different perspective on it.

By having him tell his own story, Rothfuss is trying to white-wash him and seeing if you can spot it happening.

Again though, if you don't like it yet, walk away. It's not gonna change drastically.

It's not especially difficult to see what Kvothe portrays his own actions in the best possible light. He doesn't seem to have a lot of insight into his previous poor judgement. It's NOT that deep.

[Shryke]

As to wether to continue the series or not, I'd say that if it has not been enjoyable to you, then don't. :shrugs:

I mean, we can't promise that things will pay off later, because we're not you and what we find enjoyable, you may not. But yes, some of us enjoyed the story so far, with its own flaws and short-comings.

Re :Bass

I suspect that we will later on find out more. But one spot I remembered was this:

In TNOTW supposedly Kvothe went off to kill the demons that came close to his inn, but he suffered a lot of wounds for it. Later on, when he described his martial training, he made it sound like that he could enter the tree of the spinning blade leaves and come out untouched. I don't think the two jived. It's either that Kvothe had lost a lot of his training, or he was exaggerating a lot of his physical prowess in fighting.

Huh?

He only gets in and out of the spinning blade leaves by invoking the name of the wind. Otherwise, knew he was gonna be cut to ribbons.

I wouldn't ever say Kvothe is an unreliable narrator. He's just a biased one.

[polishgenius]

I think the difference between Kvothe then and Kvothe now, that TerraPrime mentioned, and finding out why, is one of the main appeals of the series. We could yet be wrong, of course, but some of the clues picked up in the discussion topics on WMF are fantastic.

Apart from his prose, which I did love, I think that scattering of clues and inviting us to pick up on it is what Rothfuss does very, very well. It wasn't apparent after tNotW because there was little to refer against, but when the bigger picture started to show and people started to compare the books, there's some gems.

[Guest]

I think the difference between Kvothe then and Kvothe now, that TerraPrime mentioned, and finding out why, is one of the main appeals of the series.

This means that you have to find Kvothe fascinating enough to want to know more about this essential difference. I'm genuinely curious: what about him did you find intriguing? The fact that he may/may not be embellishing his story is not enough for me. I agree with Bass - somehow Martin's peripheral characters are better developed because you yearn to know more about them. With TNotW, K's voice is amped up to 11. 1st person narrator overkill with the subtlety of a box factory. And if he's a biased narrator, he's using his peripheral characters (surprise! a woman) to make his story/himself seem more interesting. What a dick.

I'm trying to figure out what divides us as readers on such a fundamental degree as this book. I reviewed it as indulgent: douchewizard thinks he deserves the satisfaction of having his story put to paper, so that we readers can follow it at an agonizingly slow pace across multiple novels. Thinks he's fascinating enough to send us all on a LOST-style clue chase to find out the hidden mysteries of all that is KVOTHE SOUNDS LIKE QUOTHE. Doesn't it feel a little like dissecting a president's memoirs? I have to wonder what person in power ever deserves this much attention when there are multitudes of more intriguing stories about the "little people" that never get told...

I'm interested to know more about Rothfuss' views on what he thinks fantasy "needs to do" and how he's attempting to "correct" it.

[Arthmail]

i haven't read it, and therefore have neither opinion to offer on the novel nor credentials on which to base one--but nonetheless advise that you should keep reading it even though you hate it, despite everyone else saying that it's consistent in form and content, and furthermore to buy the second installment just in case it awesomes up, and thereafter to engage in heated debate about the novel, author, irate fanbase, and detractors of all aforesaid, on fantasy message boards such as this one, perhaps even repeating your inquiry about this book once you begin the second one.

I really wish you would use capitals at the beginning of your sentences. No matter how good your posts are, i can't get over the fact that you've missed the very foundation of a sentence in a literature forum. Just saying.

I found this book to be fairly boring, certainly not worth the sales numbers and acclaim that it is getting. A biased or partial observer in a first person narrative is not particularily interesting, as everything is filtered through them, and there is a huge assumption that we give a shit about them in the first place. It is a really ordinary book, and i agree with those that have no idea why its doing as well as it is. But it's so forgettable, and i jumped out so quickly, i'm going to have to give it another go to justify the money i spent. Perhaps i'll start that tonight.

[Arthmail]

Alright, i've started, and i've already run into cliche that if i remember correctly, runs rampant through what little of the book i read.

Cob peered closely at the newer, more attentive member of his small audience, the smith's prentice. "Do you know what that meant, boy?" Everyone called the smith's prentice "boy" despite the fact that he was a head taller than anyone there. Small towns being what they are, he would most likely remain "boy" until his beard filled out or he bloodied someones nose over the matter.

So many cliches. Firstly, Old Cob. Second, small towns and how it seems you have to reach a hundred years to be a man in any of them. Of course, the boy is taller, as if to expose the small town failings. All shit i've seen a thousand times before.

And i don't think that prentice is even a word. Nitpicking, yes. Deconstruction of the genre, no. But, i'll keep going.

[Grack21]

It's full of cliches, but sometimes I like to read something...oh I dunno the word...90sish?

I kinda get why it's popular, but I don't get why it's popular around here. It's very unWesteros.

[Spring Bass]

We like lots of "unWesteros" stuff, unless it's Terry Goodkind.

Uh, I think one big one is that the dude is either entirely making up the dialogue or has Kellhus-level memory. As far as we know, the essence of the story is true-ish, but Kvothe is constructing scenes and exposition for us in order to for it to work as a story.

Possibly, but that's one of those Story Conventions for flashback tales that make it possible to actually have a story. Realistically, Kvothe shouldn't really have a lot of day-to-day memories of what's going. Think about it - can you remember what you were doing exactly on November 11, 12, and 13 last year? I can't.

[Sci-2]

I'm interested in the world, the side characters, and the Chadrian. Kvothe - well I hope he is dead by the last book and we can move on to new characters who need to save the world from whatever lies behind the Doors of Stone.

he was probably raped when living on the streets in that city in NOTW

wait, what?

[Shryke]

Alright, i've started, and i've already run into cliche that if i remember correctly, runs rampant through what little of the book i read.

Cob peered closely at the newer, more attentive member of his small audience, the smith's prentice. "Do you know what that meant, boy?" Everyone called the smith's prentice "boy" despite the fact that he was a head taller than anyone there. Small towns being what they are, he would most likely remain "boy" until his beard filled out or he bloodied someones nose over the matter.

So many cliches. Firstly, Old Cob. Second, small towns and how it seems you have to reach a hundred years to be a man in any of them. Of course, the boy is taller, as if to expose the small town failings. All shit i've seen a thousand times before.

And i don't think that prentice is even a word. Nitpicking, yes. Deconstruction of the genre, no. But, i'll keep going.

Prentice is a fairly common short-form.

Also, it's not small town failings, it's small town quirks. It's Gilmore Girls, not Deliverance.

[Shryke]

wait, what?

In the scene where the other boy gets raped, he pretty clearly thinks around the fact that the same thing happened to him.

Although book 2 may have changed that to him only being almost raped.

[Arthmail]

Prentice is a fairly common short-form.

Also, it's not small town failings, it's small town quirks. It's Gilmore Girls, not Deliverance.

Sorry, i would say failings. Not that it matters at all, but everyone sees people that live in small towns as a bunch of backwoods good old boys that never change and remain stagnant. Usually until a big city girl comes and teaches them the meaning of tolerance - or they're psycho hillbillies and they murder her.

[Maia]

Apart from his prose, which I did love, I think that scattering of clues and inviting us to pick up on it is what Rothfuss does very, very well.

Not so crazy about his prose, but I have to agree about the clues and secrets.

OTOH, Kvothe is annoying and hits _all_ fantasy clichés at once (the whole street-child thing being particularly forced and egregious, IMHO), nearly all other characters are completely cardboard, "present-day" world-building is very shallow. lazy and unbelievable (seriously, Rothfuss, read up on how poor, including poor students, and rich lived even as recently as late 19th -early 20th century!), etc.

But yea, the myths and hints about the past and nature of magic are interesting. So, I guess that I'll stay around for conclusion, but count me as very lukewarm on the whole thing. Nor do I understand why it has become so popular, either...