Howdyphillip Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 How in the hell did you guys have a discussion of the greatest TE in the league and not bring up the mangod that is Jason Witten? He is the only TE in the league right now that has earned Hall of Fame consideration already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace, Extat Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 WHAT ARE YOU GOING ON ABOUT!?! For those who didn't notice, the original comment there was "Lol, he wasn't even in the league in 2011" So, I'll adjust to 2012. Gronkowski, Hernandez, Vernon Davis, Tony Fucking Gonzalez, Jimmy Graham, Dwayne Allen, Jason Witten... All of the men named above were a bigger deal than some 2nd year Vikings TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 How in the hell did you guys have a discussion of the greatest TE in the league and not bring up the mangod that is Jason Witten? He is the only TE in the league right now that has earned Hall of Fame consideration already. Gonzalez just retired, so I suppose you're technically correct. Still, when I think of current HOF TE's, I can't help but to think of him first. Witten is still a beast, but it seems to me he's on the downside of his career. A Hall of Fame career, no doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Gonzalez just retired, so I suppose you're technically correct. Still, when I think of current HOF TE's, I can't help but to think of him first. Witten is still a beast, but it seems to me he's on the downside of his career. A Hall of Fame career, no doubt. Is Gates still active? The bottom has definitely dropped out of his abilities, but he's had a Hall-worthy career as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Ayras Lord Commander Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Is Gates still active? The bottom has definitely dropped out of his abilities, but he's had a Hall-worthy career as well. I'd say he should be in. I feel like Gonzalez is hands down the best TE ever (and probably in the same position Jerry Rice is in where he will likely always be the best at his respective position), but Gates may have revolutionized the position more (bringing the basketball player/PF into the NFL as TEs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Is Gates still active? The bottom has definitely dropped out of his abilities, but he's had a Hall-worthy career as well. Good point. Looks like he's still on the Bolts roster. He definetely belongs in that group as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Tony Gonzalez was the first (and thus far still the best) of a new class of fast Tight Ends that took advantage of increasingly pass-friendly rules to dominate the middle of the field with their combination of size and speed. I feel like even comparing these guys against TEs of the 90s or earlier is sort of ridiculous. For example, those of you who are old enough certainly remember Jay Novacek, who was a key offensive weapon in the 90s Cowboys dominance. He isn't quite a Hall of Famer, but he was close - a five-time pro bowler. And yet his best season was 1991, with 59 catches for 664 yards and 4 touchdowns! For a starting TE who plays all 16 games, that is below average production these days. Tony Gonzalez put up 15 consecutive seasons (1999 to 2013) with better numbers than that (often dramatically better). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Tony Gonzalez was the first (and thus far still the best) of a new class of fast Tight Ends that took advantage of increasingly pass-friendly rules to dominate the middle of the field with their combination of size and speed. I feel like even comparing these guys against TEs of the 90s or earlier is sort of ridiculous. For example, those of you who are old enough certainly remember Jay Novacek, who was a key offensive weapon in the 90s Cowboys dominance. He isn't quite a Hall of Famer, but he was close - a five-time pro bowler. And yet his best season was 1991, with 59 catches for 664 yards and 4 touchdowns! For a starting TE who plays all 16 games, that is below average production these days. Tony Gonzalez put up 15 consecutive seasons (1999 to 2013) with better numbers than that (often dramatically better). I felt like Brent Jones of the 49ers had a higher peak than Novacek, but your point is taken. Jones finished his career with 33 TDs, which is basically two seasons of production for a healthy Gronk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Ayras Lord Commander Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 I'm too young to actively know everything about football pre 90's, but didn't they use to take the guys who look like modern TEs and just make them WRs (like Kellen Winslow)? Because it was always my understanding that TEs were like FBs and were more for blocking, but could slip out and make a play now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 I'm too young to actively know everything about football pre 90's, but didn't they use to take the guys who look like modern TEs and just make them WRs (like Kellen Winslow)? Because it was always my understanding that TEs were like FBs and were more for blocking, but could slip out and make a play now and then. Pretty much. The rise of the pass catching TE probably started with Don Coryell's early iteration of the West Coast Offense and featured the aforementioned Kellen Winslow. At least that's the first TE I can remember watching who was a premiere offensive threat. Russ Francis was another guy who springs to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quijote Light Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Mike Ditka still epitomizes what a TE should be. Great pass catcher while also terrorizing defenses when blocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickster Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Shoot me off a pm with an email address, and I can shoot you off an invite. I don't think you need a Yahoo account. Did you click "join a group" then put in the ID# and password? Sent you a pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince of the North Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Tony Gonzalez was the first (and thus far still the best) of a new class of fast Tight Ends that took advantage of increasingly pass-friendly rules to dominate the middle of the field with their combination of size and speed. I feel like even comparing these guys against TEs of the 90s or earlier is sort of ridiculous. For example, those of you who are old enough certainly remember Jay Novacek, who was a key offensive weapon in the 90s Cowboys dominance. He isn't quite a Hall of Famer, but he was close - a five-time pro bowler. And yet his best season was 1991, with 59 catches for 664 yards and 4 touchdowns! For a starting TE who plays all 16 games, that is below average production these days. Tony Gonzalez put up 15 consecutive seasons (1999 to 2013) with better numbers than that (often dramatically better). Very much agreed. But I find myself wanting to throw Shannon Sharpe's name out here as well just to include him in the conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickster Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 QALC: The list of current TE playing in the NFC who are way better than Rudolph: 1. Jimmy Graham2. VD3. Jason Witten Rudolph belongs in the next tier (some of them are better than Rudolph imo): 1. Martellus Bennett2. Jared Cook (bit of an enigma, hampered by the offense he plays in)3. Brandon Pettigrew4. Brent Celek5. Greg Olsen The list of WRs playing in the NFC better than Greg "not-catching-from-Rodgers-any-more-and-I-suck" Jennings is longer than that. Patterson is a great talent in the mold of Harvin. But his route running is suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickster Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Not last year you weren't! We needed our Colts fan FIX! Wasn't Jace enough? Also I am crushed that you forgot me :crying: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Very much agreed. But I find myself wanting to throw Shannon Sharpe's name out here as well just to include him in the conversation. Another great call. That guy was practically unstoppable for 4-5 seasons running back in the early to mid 90's. Definite HoF material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Sent you a pm. I'm shoot off that invite ASAP. At work at the moment, so give me a minute or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balefired-ed Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Tony Gonzalez was the first (and thus far still the best) of a new class of fast Tight Ends that took advantage of increasingly pass-friendly rules to dominate the middle of the field with their combination of size and speed. I feel like even comparing these guys against TEs of the 90s or earlier is sort of ridiculous. For example, those of you who are old enough certainly remember Jay Novacek, who was a key offensive weapon in the 90s Cowboys dominance. He isn't quite a Hall of Famer, but he was close - a five-time pro bowler. And yet his best season was 1991, with 59 catches for 664 yards and 4 touchdowns! For a starting TE who plays all 16 games, that is below average production these days. Tony Gonzalez put up 15 consecutive seasons (1999 to 2013) with better numbers than that (often dramatically better). Nah, man. Kellen Winslow opened up that mold of TE before Tony Gonzalez, with guys like Newsome and Sharpe coming after. Edit: Newsome was actually a contemporary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Ayras Lord Commander Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 QALC: The list of current TE playing in the NFC who are way better than Rudolph: 1. Jimmy Graham 2. VD 3. Jason Witten Rudolph belongs in the next tier (some of them are better than Rudolph imo): 1. Martellus Bennett 2. Jared Cook (bit of an enigma, hampered by the offense he plays in) 3. Brandon Pettigrew 4. Brent Celek 5. Greg Olsen The list of WRs playing in the NFC better than Greg "not-catching-from-Rodgers-any-more-and-I-suck" Jennings is longer than that. Patterson is a great talent in the mold of Harvin. But his route running is suspect. Your lists are absolutely correct, for last year. My point is this year the dude is going to explode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickster Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Your lists are absolutely correct, for last year. My point is this year the dude is going to explode. 'cause he will be catching it from Teddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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