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Jon/Arya shipping confirmed?


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The most important two line in the entire treatment is:

"As you know, I don't outline my novels. I find that if I know exactly where a book is going, I lose all interest in writing it."

This shows two things:

1) He admits he can lose complete interest in a writing project. This is something people have accused him of for years with ASOIAF.

2) He never connected the dots of how to get from point A to point B in the saga. Which is exactly why he had such a hard time going from ASOS to Books 4 & 5.

I wonder if this comes from his background as a TV writer, where a lot of work is done collaboratively. If that's the case, if he's willing to work with a collaborator or two, he could very easily finish and release TWoW before April 2016, and then do a Hail Mary pass at getting ADoS out before the show ends.

But this is his baby, so that's probably not going to happen. I'm not as upset with him as some, though. GRRM created one hell of a universe and characters that have millions of people invested. That's a huge accomplishment. Everything else is just details. The fun will be in the journeys -- both on screen and on the page.

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The most important two line in the entire treatment is:

"As you know, I don't outline my novels. I find that if I know exactly where a book is going, I lose all interest in writing it."

This shows two things:

1) He admits he can lose complete interest in a writing project. This is something people have accused him of for years with ASOIAF.

2) He never connected the dots of how to get from point A to point B in the saga. Which is exactly why he had such a hard time going from ASOS to Books 4 & 5.

But, despite the process, he's also said he wouldn't change anything regarding the endgame as he has been accused if anyone "figured it out."

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I'm too freaked out to click the links or read too deep into this thread... What do I do?! I'm so curious, but I'm terrified of being over spoiled.

I was worried too and then decided to read it. I don't feel like it ruined much at all. Once you read the entire thing you quickly realize a lot has changed. So much that it has little effect on the current story. I did geta few tidbits that I think are minor spoilers but nothing that I hadn't already figured out already anyways.

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I'm too freaked out to click the links or read too deep into this thread... What do I do?! I'm so curious, but I'm terrified of being over spoiled.

No worries. There are no spoilers in there. GRRM has changed the story so much from these that it is more of a fun comparative reading from what we already know in the current books to the original thought process.

No words on how he wanted it to end either

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"The neverborn" what in the seven hells are they?

The "neverborn" are the most interesting thing here, as they could still be introduced. Craster's sons maybe?

The outline suggests that there are at least three tiers of the cold armies of the far North: the wights who are the dead raised back from the cold; the "neverborn" who are the cold creatures we saw in the Prologue of AGOT killing Ser Warmar Royce, getting killed by Sam in ASOS and are quite possibly Craster's sons; and the real Others, ancient Others, or First Others, the ones who ride spiders, have powers with ice, and who led the armies in the original Long Night.

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The Arya/Jon part actually is very Arthurian in terms of shadows of Arthur and Morgan Le Fay, so I still speculate that its not out of the question

Good point, especially with the path Arya is currently on, getting into the black arts with the FM

and becoming a bit of seductress as well

. There's definitely some strong parallels with both, which is reason enough to think they'll continue.

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Thanks for that. I couldnt see shit in the OP. But what the hell is in the blacked out part? Im guessing thats stuff that might still happen and/or is relevant....

Sounds like a very basic outline for the story before he really began toiling at it. I kinda wish his original Dany plan (regarding Viserys) happened. Oh well.

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But what the hell is in the blacked out part?

Apparently the Reddit brigade is trying to find ways of eliminating the black lines. Seems pretty likely that they are hiding plot points that GRRM is still hoping to use though, or at least modify.

I kinda wish his original Dany plan (regarding Viserys) happened. Oh well.

I agree. Slashing down Drogo would've been awesome.

Dany getting hunted by the Dothraki would've been much more entertaining as well. He should've had Jhogo follow her for at least a little while.

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The outline suggests that there are at least three tiers of the cold armies of the far North: the wights who are the dead raised back from the cold; the "neverborn" who are the cold creatures we saw in the Prologue of AGOT killing Ser Warmar Royce, getting killed by Sam in ASOS and are quite possibly Craster's sons; and the real Others, ancient Others, or First Others, the ones who ride spiders, have powers with ice, and who led the armies in the original Long Night.

I can get behind this. Been arguing on and off with someone about whether or not the Others are Craster's sons, and I've been saying no to that idea throughout the argument.

However, it wouldn't have to be the neverborn we met in AGoT. That could actually have been Others.

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Apparently the Reddit brigade is trying to find ways of eliminating the black lines. Seems pretty likely that they are hiding plot points that GRRM is still hoping to use though, or at least modify.

I agree. Slashing down Drogo would've been awesome.

Dany getting hunted by the Dothraki would've been much more entertaining as well. He should've had Jhogo follow her for at least a little while.

Imagine the shitstorm if they're able to get rid of the redaction. :D

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Good point, especially with the path Arya is currently on, getting into the black arts with the FM

and becoming a bit of seductress as well

. There's definitely some strong parallels with both, which is reason enough to think they'll continue.

EXACTLY, my thoughts.

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