The dragon connection.

[DireKiwi]

Until now two of Dany's dragons have interacted with someone else besides Dany, but then I realised they are interacting with the wrong people.

Viserion doesn't count because he's as much a mindless slave to the night king as all the other icezombies.

Jon had a close encounter and bonding moment with Drogon when most people were expecting Rhaegal instead, but isn't Drogon already bonded with Dany?

And I read in the script that it was Rhaegal and not Viserion who Tyrion touched and interacted with.

Strange.

 

[Apoplexy]

If I understand your question correctly, are you saying Jon should've interacted with Rhaegal?

[DireKiwi]

9 hours ago, Apoplexy said:

If I understand your question correctly, are you saying Jon should've interacted with Rhaegal?

Well, it's kind of implied Rhaegal might become Jon's dragon in the future. Only Jon and Tyrion had some dragon moments in the show so far, and Tyrion was actually chatting up to Rhaegal instead of Viserion..

But now that I think of it, it actually does make sense. Dany's going to get pregnant and might not ride her dragon while with child, so she asks Jon to ride Drogon in her stead, and Drogon accepts because he already connected with Jon .

Drogon is also named after her love Drogo, And Jon will be her next love so it's rather fitting.

Rhaegal is named after her noble brother Rhaegar, and if Tyrion turns out to be her half brother it would be rather fitting as well.

Even Viserion is now making sense, he was named after her evil brother Viserys , and unfortunately he is now evil as well.

These are all wild guesses of course, but I just like to speculate.

[Kajjo]

Daenerys, Jon and, most probably, Tyrion are of Targaryen ancestry.

Jon and Tyrion had some short experiences with dragons. I don't think it matters which dragon they touched. It simply shows that only these two have some contact with dragons.

Jons contact was more intimate and Tyrions real heritage is not revealed in the TV show, yet, not even a lot of clues pointing that way. 

[Bazwong]

3 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Daenerys, Jon and, most probably, Tyrion are of Targaryen ancestry.

Jon and Tyrion had some short experiences with dragons. I don't think it matters which dragon they touched. It simply shows that only these two have some contact with dragons.

Jons contact was more intimate and Tyrions real heritage is not revealed in the TV show, yet, not even a lot of clues pointing that way. 

I think the Tyrion being a targ theory is unlikely to come up in the show now for a couple reasons. Firstly Tyrion being hinted as a Targ in the show hasn't occurred other than when Tywin said 'you are no son of mine' combined with his father's apparent disgust of him. Second, I think the reason that theory was circulating was because of the 'Dragon has three heads' quote, which most likely won't happen now due to Viseron being dead.

The WOIAF book does hint at Aerys having an interest in Joanna and when he stayed at Casterly Rock for the best part of a year before Tyrion was born, but nothing concrete as such.

I agree with the idea that Dany will become pregnant and Jon will ride Drogon instead of Rhaegal, after the events of the finale. I was hoping that Jon would ride Rhaegal for obvious reasons but they haven't placed any focus on him (maybe due to budget) and all the close ups and action has been with Drogon, plus Jon had a significant moment with Drogon this season. 

[Kajjo]

4 minutes ago, Bazwong said:

Firstly Tyrion being hinted as a Targ in the show hasn't occurred

Yes, and that is a real problem with the TV show starting from season 1 -- where GRRM still had the full overview. Tyrion has not silver hair as he has in the books. Very, very strange -- I believed this might be because in a movie this would be too much of a easy give-away, because everyone would notice. Jon being half-Targaryen, half Stark, has no silver hair, too. So Tyrion does not need silver hair to be a half-Targaryen.

7 minutes ago, Bazwong said:

other than when Tywin said 'you are no son of mine'

And the very popular quote "dwarves are always bastards to their fathers" in season 1 and 7.

8 minutes ago, Bazwong said:

The WOIAF book does hint at Aerys having an interest in Joanna and when he stayed at Casterly Rock for the best part of a year before Tyrion was born, but nothing concrete as such

The very first book early on describes Tyrion as having silver hair.

[Bazwong]

1 hour ago, Kajjo said:

The very first book early on describes Tyrion as having silver hair.

 

I think the quote was along the lines of 'hair so blond it looked white' or something. The WOIAF book also mentions how Aerys and his wife Rhaella had multiple miscarriages and still births and children that died at young ages, so i wouldn't be surprised if he had a child with Tyrions ailments.

I'm not saying that it isn't true or possible, just that I think it is unlikely to appear on the show now with such little time left. It seems like one of those things that the show has left out for the sake of not complicating the plot too much, especially now because if they revealed he is a Targ then it doesn't do anything for the plot and would seem unnecessary. The end game would still be the same whether Tyrion is riding a dragon or not at this stage.

[Kajjo]

4 minutes ago, Bazwong said:

I'm not saying that it isn't true or possible, just that I think it is unlikely to appear on the show now with such little time left

I agree. Without any prior hint this would be pretty far-fetched and therefor unlikely.

However, Tyrion survived taken the chains from the dragons.

[DireKiwi]

On 8/30/2017 at 2:50 PM, Bazwong said:

I think the Tyrion being a targ theory is unlikely to come up in the show now for a couple reasons. Firstly Tyrion being hinted as a Targ in the show hasn't occurred other than when Tywin said 'you are no son of mine' combined with his father's apparent disgust of him. Second, I think the reason that theory was circulating was because of the 'Dragon has three heads' quote, which most likely won't happen now due to Viseron being dead.

The WOIAF book does hint at Aerys having an interest in Joanna and when he stayed at Casterly Rock for the best part of a year before Tyrion was born, but nothing concrete as such.

I agree with the idea that Dany will become pregnant and Jon will ride Drogon instead of Rhaegal, after the events of the finale. I was hoping that Jon would ride Rhaegal for obvious reasons but they haven't placed any focus on him (maybe due to budget) and all the close ups and action has been with Drogon, plus Jon had a significant moment with Drogon this season. 

It has occurred a few times, or have you forgotten the line "Men’s laws give you the right to bear my name and display my colors, since I cannot prove that you are not mine." .......Now WHY would Tywin doubt that?... unless, he had his suspicions.

And the fact that only he and Jon are the only people who had a dragon moment so far.

His dragon dreams and obsession are quite a give-away, Jon also dreams of dragons.

The Red priestess in Volantis gave him that creepy look, you have to admit that was a weird moment.

So there's plenty of reason for doubt.

 

 

[Johnimus]

On 8/30/2017 at 11:54 AM, Kajjo said:

I agree. Without any prior hint this would be pretty far-fetched and therefor unlikely.

However, Tyrion survived taken the chains from the dragons.

I don't believe Tyrion is a Targ, but it's not a bad theory.

But I also don't for a moment think him surviving taking the chains from the Dragons is evidence of anything other than that the Dragons liked/trusted him. We have no reason to think, from the show, that only Targaryens or Valyrians can master Dragons. After all, Doreah, (Bless her and all who sail in her) had a pretty good relationship with the baby Dragons, too. And the Dragons have shown a fairly consistent ability to recognise friend from foe.

[Kajjo]

2 hours ago, Johnimus said:

We have no reason to think, from the show, that only Targaryens or Valyrians can master Dragons.

I agree. The baby dragons were handled by non-Targaryens as well.

[BalerionTheCat]

On 31/08/2017 at 8:29 PM, Johnimus said:

I don't believe Tyrion is a Targ, but it's not a bad theory.

But I also don't for a moment think him surviving taking the chains from the Dragons is evidence of anything other than that the Dragons liked/trusted him. We have no reason to think, from the show, that only Targaryens or Valyrians can master Dragons. After all, Doreah, (Bless her and all who sail in her) had a pretty good relationship with the baby Dragons, too. And the Dragons have shown a fairly consistent ability to recognise friend from foe.

Yes. But "taking care of dragons and not be burned" is different from "bounding dragons". Yes the dragons recognize the friends of their master.

Some people on Dragonstone bounded dragons. But most, if not all, were Targaryen's bastards. There is no show evidence Tyrion is another one. For sure, D&D would not miss that if it was in GRRM story. But it's not either. It is just a fan fiction. Born from the 3 main characters and the 3 headed dragon. Whatever it means exactly.

[Error-504]

On 8/30/2017 at 9:50 AM, Bazwong said:

I think the Tyrion being a targ theory is unlikely to come up in the show now for a couple reasons. Firstly Tyrion being hinted as a Targ in the show hasn't occurred other than when Tywin said 'you are no son of mine' combined with his father's apparent disgust of him. Second, I think the reason that theory was circulating was because of the 'Dragon has three heads' quote, which most likely won't happen now due to Viseron being dead.

The WOIAF book does hint at Aerys having an interest in Joanna and when he stayed at Casterly Rock for the best part of a year before Tyrion was born, but nothing concrete as such.

I agree with the idea that Dany will become pregnant and Jon will ride Drogon instead of Rhaegal, after the events of the finale. I was hoping that Jon would ride Rhaegal for obvious reasons but they haven't placed any focus on him (maybe due to budget) and all the close ups and action has been with Drogon, plus Jon had a significant moment with Drogon this season. 

The whole Tyrion is a Targ theory is a red herring, and most likely an obvious  miss direct by GRRM, and as such completely ignored in the show. A lot of people misinterpret the "Dragon must have three heads" prophecy to directly correlate to three dragon riders, and this has never been the case. That never became more obvious when Dany lost Viserion leaving her only two dragons. As to whether anyone other than Dany ever rides a dragon remains to be seen, but I actually kind of doubt it. As much as it might make sense to have Jon mount a dragon, what good would it do? Jon, and his valaryian sword are much more effectively put to use in ground combat, not on top of any dragon, and we have already seen Dany can control all her dragons while riding only one. 

Jamie will be the third head of the Dragon, representing an alliance of three separate parties. Tyrion is already firmly entrenched in team Dany, and as such, cannot be the third head. So, a Tyrion is a targ theory would accomplish nothing. 

However, a much more fitting plot twist would be a last minute reveal (hint hint Jamie is coming to see Bran), that it was both Jamie and Cersei that were the product of the Mad King taking liberties in the bedding ceremony of Johanna, and Tyrion is the only legitimate Lannister, and as such the heir to CL. 

This would mean that Tywin was wrong, and not only was Tyrion his son, but he was his only heir. It also spins things in a way that both he and Jamie share something in common, they both killed their own fathers. Meanwhile Cersei is off going bat sh*t crazy, because she inherited the crazy gene, as well as the Targaryan gene for incest. 

This scenario has a lot more interesting plot twists and WTF moments then the whole Tyrion is a targ theory.  

[MinscS2]

22 minutes ago, Error-504 said:

However, a much more fitting plot twist would be a last minute reveal (hint hint Jamie is coming to see Bran), that it was both Jamie and Cersei that were the product of the Mad King taking liberties in the bedding ceremony of Johanna, and Tyrion is the only legitimate Lannister, and as such the heir to CL. 

I approve of this twist. Would be way more jaw-dropping than the Tyrion is secretly a targ-theory, and a last middle finger to Cersei. Doubt it will happen though, but I wouldn't complain if it did.

In regards to Tyrion, I think that it would make Tyrion-the-character less interesting if he ends up a Targaryen bastard.  
The fact that he is a trueborn Lannister that still sides with Daenerys against his family, with all the family drama that has (and will) entail makes his arc much more interesting. We already have one secret Targaryen in #TeamTargaryen, we don't need a second. It would be anticlimactic imo.

[Error-504]

7 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

I approve of this twist. Would be way more jaw-dropping than the Tyrion is secretly a targ-theory, and a last middle finger to Cersei. Doubt it will happen though, but I wouldn't complain if it did.

In regards to Tyrion, I think that it would make Tyrion-the-character less interesting if he ends up a Targaryen bastard.  
The fact that he is a trueborn Lannister that still sides with Daenerys against his family, with all the family drama that has (and will) entail makes his arc much more interesting. We already have one secret Targaryen in #TeamTargaryen, we don't need a second. It would be anticlimactic imo.

The plot twist are endless with what I proposed, not only the twists I mentioned, how about the fact Cersei vs Dany/Jon is actually targ vs targ?

[MinscS2]

Ahh, the cruel but oldest living bastard of Aerys in a war of succession against Aerys last living daughter who in turn is supported by Aerys last living grandson. That would be something.

In the words of Tormund: I like it. 
 

[Error-504]

2 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

Ahh, the cruel but oldest living bastard of Aerys in a war of succession against Aerys last living daughter who in turn is supported by Aerys last living grandson. That would be something.

In the words of Tormund: I like it. 
 

If volonqar is another targ word that has no gender, then Dany could be the Volonqar, being she is her little (half) sister. 

[BalerionTheCat]

6 minutes ago, Error-504 said:

If volonqar is another targ word that has no gender, then Dany could be the Volonqar, being she is her little (half) sister. 

That valonqar, a Valyrian word, was used in Cersei's prophecy, is one of the many evidences she is Aerys' bastard.
This applies to Jaime rather than Tyrion (except if all 3 are Aerys' bastards). Which is unlikely.

[falcotron]

On 8/31/2017 at 11:29 AM, Johnimus said:

But I also don't for a moment think him surviving taking the chains from the Dragons is evidence of anything other than that the Dragons liked/trusted him. We have no reason to think, from the show, that only Targaryens or Valyrians can master Dragons. After all, Doreah, (Bless her and all who sail in her) had a pretty good relationship with the baby Dragons, too. And the Dragons have shown a fairly consistent ability to recognise friend from foe.

If the whole "only Targs can bond with dragons" thing is Targ (or ancient Valyrian) propaganda rather than fact, the show would have to make that point much less subtly than the books.

And having Doreah playing with the baby dragons and then Tyrion having a nice moment with a grown-up dragon is a much less subtle way to make the point than, say, a vague story about Nettles that doesn't get explained anywhere unless you read both TPaTQ and WoIaF as well as the main novels, while still not being too sledgehammer-over-the-head.

I don't know if that's what they're actually going for, but I don't see why so many people just rule out the possibility and instead jump for A+J=T or even more conspiratorial theories that are even less justified by the show.