Breaking Bad Seasons Three and Four

[Relic]

Or I'm just "clearly wrong."

Well, I guess that depends on how you define "wrong". Do you mean like when you went off on a 15 paragraph rants a few weeks ago about some Skylar dialouge you misheard (kudos on owning up to that btw). Or wrong as is in you are reading too deeply/seeing what you want to see? Or maybe you mean wrong as in not being able to handle some light ribbing in response to your essays?

[Reposado]

That seems like a contradiction. The fact that Gus shot it is a big deal in the eyes of the Don, is it not?

Well its a big deal in that I think he didn't entirely trust Gus, so I think he wanted to see him drink it before drinking it himself.

Maybe he would have enjoyed a glass with Gus before saving the rest for later. It was still unlikely that he would pass it out to all the men.

Look at his face when he opens it, he is pumped, this is clearly a rarity. He will want Gus to drink it, to ensure its not poison, but he won't want anyone to shoot it.

[Blaine]

I also think that Walt's waterworks were real. In the Fly episode, Walt gets a bit of drugs in him and he starts feeling the need to confess, almost to the point of telling Jesse that he let his girlfriend die. A few episodes back, Walt has too much wine and completely steers Hank to the idea that Gale isn't Heisenberg. When Walt gets inebriated or drugged, the truth comes spilling out.

[Therawbeats]

I'm not gonna call anyones opinions wrong or anything haha, but I can't believe people are picking apart the ending. It was fucking awesome! Topped the ending of 'One Minute' in my opinion. I can buy Don Eladio passing out the Tequila because he was so excited to stop the mini-war, to have Gus concede, and to now have a chemist that makes amazing meth. I can buy the poison working because this is Gus, and the Breaking Bad universe is not the Wire universe. It's like a Tarintino/Coen Brothers universe. Things like this can happen, they are bad ass, so STFU and enjoy.

Yeah, killers don't say "too easy" and go to get an axe during a public execution, axes don't stick in pavement, squigies don't blow up cars...who the fuck cares?

[red snow]

I took Walt's breakdown as genuine as well. I've seen people get like that after a beating and alcohol (myself included) and you get weird moments of clarity, that you never want to admit to again afterwards.

I competely forgot about Jesse's girlfriend. Walt has a hell of a lot to answer for regarding his treatment of Jesse, despite him sticking up for him last season.

[red snow]

I'm not gonna call anyones opinions wrong or anything haha, but I can't believe people are picking apart the ending. It was fucking awesome! Topped the ending of 'One Minute' in my opinion. I can buy Don Eladio passing out the Tequila because he was so excited to stop the mini-war, to have Gus concede, and to now have a chemist that makes amazing meth. I can buy the poison working because this is Gus, and the Breaking Bad universe is not the Wire universe. It's like a Tarintino/Coen Brothers universe. Things like this can happen, they are bad ass, so STFU and enjoy.

Yeah, killers don't say "too easy" and go to get an axe during a public execution, axes don't stick in pavement, squigies don't blow up cars...who the fuck cares?

I agree. The Don would never have risked drinking the poison himself, so the fact that Gus did was enough for him. He never anticipated someone woudl risk their own life to get him via poison.

I also don't blame Jesse for not trying to kill Gus at this point. The guy was going to be stranded in Mexico and no doubt killed once they could replicate his methods. What's far more interesting for the rest of the season is whether Gus will be happy with Jesse's purity of meth. IT may not be quite as good but it's still better than anything else which by my reckoning makes Walt expendable. Jesse is afterall far more subserviant, especially if given the correct praise and tutelage.

[TrackerNeil]

Or I'm just "clearly wrong."

I'm going to go with clearly wrong. There is absolutely zero dramatic interest in Walter shedding crocodile tears in that moment; we already know Walt can play the bastard and will unshamefacedly lie to those he loves. We don't need another reminder, and a reminder is all that scene would be.

However, if those tears, and the story that shortly follows, were real, that's a ton of interesting character insight. That experience Walt had with his ill father is another explanation for why Walt himself has turned along this path despite the opportunities he had to turn aside into something safer. It's not just pride and thwarted anger but a good deal of shame and pain from his father's illness. The fact that VG found a way to show yet another aspect of a character we've been following for four seasons shows that he's pretty darn good.

I said it before and I'll say it again: Season Four is my favorite of the bunch.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

I'm going to go with clearly wrong. There is absolutely zero dramatic interest in Walter shedding crocodile tears in that moment; we already know Walt can play the bastard and will unshamefacedly lie to those he loves. We don't need another reminder, and a reminder is all that scene would be.

However, if those tears, and the story that shortly follows, were real, that's a ton of interesting character insight. That experience Walt had with his ill father is another explanation for why Walt himself has turned along this path despite the opportunities he had to turn aside into something safer. It's not just pride and thwarted anger but a good deal of shame and pain from his father's illness. The fact that VG found a way to show yet another aspect of a character we've been following for four seasons shows that he's pretty darn good.

I said it before and I'll say it again: Season Four is my favorite of the bunch.

I think the tears were fake, but I still found the scene to be quite compelling. We know Walt can be a bastard, but he's never really been a bastard to Junior. That's taking it to a whole new level. The fact that he can't generate any real emotion in front of his son is pretty damn interesting.

[TrackerNeil]

I think the tears were fake, but I still found the scene to be quite compelling. We know Walt can be a bastard, but he's never really been a bastard to Junior. That's taking it to a whole new level. The fact that he can't generate any real emotion in front of his son is pretty damn interesting.

He was quite the bastard to Walt Jr. in Season One, when he considered Saul's proposal to use his son's Web site to launder drug money. That's pretty low, and definitely outranks lying as assholery goes.

[Ken Stone]

He was quite the bastard to Walt Jr. in Season One, when he considered Saul's proposal to use his son's Web site to launder drug money. That's pretty low, and definitely outranks lying as assholery goes.

He actually made Jr. feel good doing that.

[TrackerNeil]

He actually made Jr. feel good doing that.

Yes, Jr. did feel good, but how would he have felt if he knew the truth? That his father turned over a project built from love and concern and turned it over to a scumbag lawyer who then used it to launder drug money? That's low. Real low.

BTW, Rockroi, I find it interesting that you find Walter White, who is generally a monster, generally sympathetic except for the one scene in which he's actually sympathetic. :idea:

[Rockroi]

I also think that Walt's waterworks were real. In the Fly episode, Walt gets a bit of drugs in him and he starts feeling the need to confess, almost to the point of telling Jesse that he let his girlfriend die. A few episodes back, Walt has too much wine and completely steers Hank to the idea that Gale isn't Heisenberg. When Walt gets inebriated or drugged, the truth comes spilling out.

Except, of course, that he as not telling the truth. We know this. He starts off the whole "confession" with a dramatic lie. He claims- bald faced -that he has been "gambling" again.

So... he has a compulsion to tell the truth unless he's not telling the truth?

I think there is a lot to that scene and I think Walt is trying to cry- IIRC he is almost pushing the tears out, trying to get this kid to just go away; don't call the cops, don't call mom; just go away.

I think he then regrets this for a variety of reasons and also is genuinely touched by Junior sticking around. So, he decides to unburden himself to junior and make a very real admission about how he wants to be viewed by his son. Especially in the face of oblivion.

BTW, Rockroi, I find it interesting that you find Walter White, who is generally a monster, generally sympathetic except for the one scene in which he's actually sympathetic.

I find it interesting that you find a lot of what I think interesting.

The obvious fact is that I actually DID find Walt sympathetic in the following scene - where he explains to Junior that he has only one memory of his own father and that's basically a deformed shell, waiting to die. The memory is so vivid; including where he was and what his father's breathing sounded like. It was very real. And very scary to young Walt and now he wants to share that with his son. Again, I thought this was a real and sympathetic moment for Walt. And I said so up thread.

'm not gonna call anyones opinions wrong or anything haha, but I can't believe people are picking apart the ending.

The reality is that we all seem to "like" the ending; we just have various opinions on its believability and its "nip-tuck" feeling; ie: that everything has to be wrapped up with this story-line because it has no place else to go. I'm not saying it was "bad" more like "convenient."

[Relic]

Wrong again. Walt starts off lying (he obv can't tell jr the truth) but the part about him making a mistake is 100% sincere. He wouldn't cry just to get rid of his son, Walt hates anyone thinking of him as weak. Furthermore I'm pretty sure Walt is aware that he's digging himself a huge hole, one that might get him and perhaps his family killed. He's pinned is hopes on Jesse taking out Gus for him and he's aware that option was removed after the fight. So yeah huge mistake on Walt's part and in his drug enduced state (he answers the door in tighty whities) he lets some emotion slip.